Is there another couple in the world like The Sussexes?

[veraswaistcoat]

I was musing last night about this aspect - they had the world at their feet. Despite what Sussex Supporters like to suggest most people in the UK nodded their heads " yes it was lovely Harry was getting married finally" . I had never heard of the bride myself as I don't watch American tv shows of that ilk. She was black or biracial? It didn't even enter my head what colour she was initially and then as coverage started it didn't make one iota of difference one way or the other. I recall the day of the wedding - it was sunny and the pubs were full of royal cheer broadcasting the wedding.

And then it all started to where we are today.

Are there any other couples in the world who have gone through such a downfall? Is this a feature of the social media arena today?
We see P Diddy and Blake Lively and others exposed now through SM.
You can't count the Duke and Duchess of Windsor in this category as they were always unpopular.

Can you think of any examples of people who have fallen so spectacularly?

I know people say " they live in California, they have money blah blah" but their reputation is one that most people would not want.

Is it purely because of their seeming complaining and sense of entitlement ? I mean you don't see the real philanthropists in this way - in fact you rarely hear about them and what they do.

Absolutely agree, great post @GiveMeSpanakopita . I want that book!

I hope you don't mind me recommending a podcaster - Sasha Stone/Free Thinking Through The Fourth Turning. She, like many of us, was a Hilary Clinton adoring, dedicated liberal, who became very popular in Hollywood circles for her thoughtful reviews of films. She had full on TDS when Trump was elected in 2016. And then she watched the left leave her behind and become utterly insane. She's a really interesting voice in all this.

@GiveMeSpanakopita Well said

They are all sizzle and no steak.

@GiveMeSpanakopita - I always enjoy your posts.

Catherine is clearly quite astute and seemed wary of Meghan. The “shopping trip snub” was, I read, because the suspicion was that Meghan would call the paps to snap her and Kate out shopping together.

Catherine's like a number of very quiet people I know. They seem 'dull' to louder (and less perceptive) folks, but in actual fact they are keen observers, and excellent judges of character.

I am using 'postmodernism' in the Cixousian sense.

So if you were accompanying a head of state or other VIP on an official event - the President of the United States, the PM of the UK, the King of Spain.

Or if you (as a PP said) were accompanying your boss and walking into an event honoring them.

Or if you were part of a group of family members bringing your 90 year old grandmother to a party in her honour.

etc etc etc

…that you wouldn’t instinctively know that the polite and appropriate thing to do would be to make sure the ‘senior’ person - whether for rank, age, position - was to go first?

We’re not talking about walking and chatting alone down a corridor. It’s an official event where you have a role to play.

It’s especially odd that Meghan didn’t get it because she was a trained actress and hitting your mark and knowing where the director wants you to stand and be is a huge part of the job.

We’ve seen loads of behind the scenes footage of the late Queen in non formal situations where she’s walking with family and there’s no protocol needed everyone just walks and interacts like a normal family.

The only bit of formal protocol they seem to stick to is the curtsey to the monarch on the first meeting of the day. Non of the HRHs curtsey to each other and the cousins without HRH or titles don’t curtsey to each other.

I honestly couldn't say. I don't think I've ever particularly thought about positioning like that. Maybe it would be instinctual in the moment. Quite possibly not. I don't think it's ever come up. Other than in a church service or a play where the order of entrance is entirely determined by rules and rehearsal.

They had her sussed that early!?

Well fair enough - sounds like you have never had to accompany a high profile person to a formal or semi formal public event.

However if you are put in that position and you have a team of people who brief you on what is expected then I presume you would be able to follow some simple instructions.

But as you say it’s usually instinctual to hang back a step and let your 95-year-old grandmother set the pace, so that you can make sure she is okay and you can step forward if needed.

I expect many people of high net worth are hyper-vigilent of the intentions of any interloper.

I also think that their words consistently dont match their actions. They promised 'uplifting', 'community', 'showing up and doing good' .... these words do not aligned with thieir biggest outputs OW, NF doc and Spare - which were vexactious, negative and malicious.

Also behaviour behind the scenes of workplace bullying reported by dozens of employees.

Yes, the loud garrulous types are rarely the people who are most astute. Too busy pushing their own egos on everyone.

It’s especially odd that Meghan didn’t get it because she was a trained actress and hitting your mark and knowing where the director wants you to stand and be is a huge part of the job

Or maybe it suited her to appear not to get it, @wordler, because there was a chance of that attracting comments which could be manipulated to "justify" her intention to leave ... an intention I personally believe was there from the very start?

@wordler I agree with you about just naturally hanging back and letting the older person go person go first. Is it a matter of upbringing? Did M not spend a lot of time around grandparents?
I sometimes wonder if M's difficulty with the RF was not having grown up with a close extended family and understand the give and take and biting of the tongue that is often involved. I thought that when I saw her dm sitting alone at the wedding. I wondered how someone from such a tiny family would cope with a massive clan like the RF.

I do often wonder about the curtseying to the Queen in private by the family, was that an exaggeration by Meghan?

Both Harry and Fergie have independently confirmed it. It’s interesting because sometimes when you see them in public there will be one or two who don’t curtsey/bow when they would normally but it’s because they’ve already seen the monarch that day and already done their bow of the day. Which indicates it’s less about public performance and just a bit of protocol that’s ingrained in them.

i do wonder if William will continue with it. Must be weird to have someone you are close to like Zara suddenly start curtseying to you.

I did see a clip of Stella McCartney greeting the King early on and she started laughing and said ‘oh I guess I need to do this now’ and did a little curtsey - obviously having met him many times before when she didn’t curtsey. Charles just laughed found it funny that she was finding it amusing. So not sure he’s taking it too seriously himself.

Wonder if it was more of a generational thing, would be curious to know if they all have to curtsey to Charles and Camilla in private. I can see why Meghan would think it's weird, however lots of our old grandparents had different standards to us which were sometimes kind of cute and traditional.

Not sure about Camilla but I think technically yes - it’s both monarch and consort. Everyone used to do to to Phillip in the same way as the Queen.

I think they are definitely doing it in private for Charles because I’ve seen the scenario where William doesn’t bow but Catherine and the children do, or Anne doesn’t curtsey sometimes but others - which seems to imply they’d already seen him thay day and got their bow out of the way.

My grandparents were the same age as QEII and they were very formal. Didn't mean they weren't lovely, just a product of their generation.

The curtseying in private is a bit odd, but equally I don't think it's a massive deal. I would say it is no more weird than pressing hugs onto people you don't know.

I think it sounds odd if you describe it as Meghan did in the documentary as curtseying to ‘your grandmother’ but less odd if it’s simply a traditional custom for respecting the position of Head of State.

Americans have all sorts of rules about the office of the President, and the symbolism of the American flag. American school kids recite the Pledge of Allegiance from the age of 5 every morning in their classrooms standing up hand on heart. People on military bases stand and face the direction of the flag at Taps every evening.

And of course lots of people abstain from those traditions too.

But why Harry hadn’t explained long before they were pulling up in the car to meet the Queen that a ‘first meeting of the day’ curtsey as a traditional custom to the Head of State was required by family members.

That it wasn’t an act or performance being put on for the public but a way of life and it was going to be hard at first to get the hang of all the protocol but after a few years it would be second nature.

That’s how you prepare the person you love to succeed in a new and stressf situation.

That thing she said about “I love grandmas” - so rude . It’s the flippin’ Queen! A head of state since 1952! It sounded deliberately disrespectful and belittling. Along with that “mediaeval times” comment - the bloody cheek after she’d helped herself to the £££ wedding with foul peasants cheering for her and Harry.

Ah but it wasn’t the REAL wedding😂

Meghan wasn’t going to listen to anyone. Even Harry. She always knows best.

That’s certainly what I think.

I bet they DO curtesy in private, I believe it’s only required for the first meeting of the day though, so not too onerous.