Harry and his truth

[TrashyPanda]

Let’s try again folks!

the aftermath of Harry’s court appearance and what happens next

Camilla Long had a nugget of good advice for H in her column today - “Harry, just stop being good material.” If he wants the press to leave him and his family alone, he needs to stop creating content for them.

We don’t know she slept with Manakee. I thought Hoare was harassed and that wasn’t an affair. Not sure W Carling was ever an affair, more an emotional dalliance. Gilbey, Hewitt and Khan were definitely affairs, and of course D Fayed. Charles stopped having sex with Diana after Harry was born according to her. He’d provided the heir and spare so was free to go back to Camilla.

I don’t think Harry wants the Press to leave him alone. I think he’s desperate to be the focus of attention, rather than his family. Or the ‘Institution’ as he likes to call them.

Iirc it was Blair and alistair Campbell that persuaded the Queen to go to london as she wanted to keep the boys in balmoral and she did a tv announcement too. They also put the flag at half mast which they would never normally do. I get that sometimes protocol isn’t appropriate and can look insensitive but I think the Queen was a stickler for it and had to be persuaded against her better judgement. With hindsight I think she was right.

I meant civil unrest

There was literally no risk of this.

Diana was pretty unpopular at the time of her death. People were sick of her cavorting round Europe on a playboy's yacht and dropping coy hints about what was coming next.

The very odd public wailing and gnashing of teeth was IMO a reaction to the untimely death of a young woman and the revisionism that has followed has allowed a false and exaggerated narrative to develop.

I agree, @CathyorClaire

Diana was pretty unpopular at the time of her death. People were sick of her cavorting round Europe on a playboy's yacht and dropping coy hints about what was coming next

Papers were very vocal about this and then she's killed and they do a 180 turn and she's suddenly a saint. The business over bringing the boys back from Scotland was a complete and utter disgrace - headlines saying 'Show Us You Care, Ma'am' when her priority was her grandsons. What they really meant was 'Show us you care about us all weeping and wailing.'

Yes Diana did spend the July and august just before she died diving off boats in leopard print swimming costumes and making suggestions she had a big announcement coming. She was all over the papers almost daily. The press loved her and she loved them is my memory of it all.

She said she was deeply in love with him and would be happy to run off with him. He was removed from post as their relationship was inappropriate’ - suggesting it did cross lines.

Regardless - both parents were preoccupied with affairs outside of the family unit throughout both boys young lives - Charles before and after marriage - Diana from when Harry was a year old - so not a stable emotional environment.

Must have been mortifying for her boys.

I’ve heard they really didn’t enjoy their time on a Faye DS yacht.

have you ever noticed how strange “yacht” looks written down? You are convinced you’ve spelt it wrong. Or at least I am.

Did anyone work out what this ‘news’ might have been? Is there a record of what the press were going to run with prior to the accident?

Also, was it true Dodi was really engaged to Kelly Fisher who was on a boat close by?

The speculation was that they were going to get married

Diana often courted press attention in ways like that

Yes I put a G in it when I was younger!

Khan and Dodi weren't affairs, she was divorced. Love interests.

Also, was it true Dodi was really engaged to Kelly Fisher who was on a boat close by?

Apparently. And she was mightily miffed to have been dumped not long before the wedding.

Harry seems to garner a lot of sympathy for losing his mum, while William is barely mentioned.

I’d say William doesn’t garner the same sympathetic posts as Harry on here because there is not the same amount of posters/posts so frequently and intensely and repetitively detailing Williams (mostly imagined) faults and failings.

I’ve criticised William’s actions exactly twice, and I’ve been subject to piles ons both times from other posters. As far as Royal Family people, personas, go I like William well enough, and do indeed recognise that he, just as Harry, lost his mum. But Heaven forbid I criticise him. I have criticised Harry als, but no one piles on me when I do. No one says boo about those posts. Because they aren’t frequently detailing all that can be wrong, or imagined wrong, about Harry.

I’ve also spoken of the expectations placed on William since he was born and those that are going to be increasingly placed on George and how wrong I think it is - very wrong to do this to young children, including both the ‘heir’ expectations and the tabloids’ constructions of his character and those of his siblings - ‘George is serous, Charlotte is bossy and Louis is the clown/silly.’

I think it’s because William doesn’t feed it… I mean he was out accepting the salute today, he was opening a new cancer centre a couple of days ago, he was talking to MPs about homelessness yesterday, very hard to get worked up into a stew about any of those things. If you ever hear him disclose something personal at an engagement it’s usually something boring like Princess Charlotte’s favourite colour, and he does very few interviews (especially ones that are purely about himself).

Has anyone else heard the Spotify have cancelled Archetypes podcast because of poor performance and sacked the exec who signed them? Is it true, do you know? Or exaggerated speculation?

I think William is very like the late Queen - never complain, never explain.

she was a wise woman and he would be wise to follow her example

@Gracewithoutend - that seems to be everywhere but without confirmation from Spotify.

Yeah basically a very boring explanation - there isn’t a secret pact with the press to feed Harry & Meghan to the wolves, it’s just that William is following the advice Harry rejected. Turns out it was good advice all along.

I can try. Obviously I have no idea who is the most impacted by their mothers death. As you say, its not a competition. I am sure they have both suffered terribly. In my family I have to boys who lost both their parents very young. Awful, tragic circumstances. One of them, much like William is keeping head down, the other struggles much more (also reckless behaviour etc). I wouldn't dream of suggesting that one is more hurt than the other.

What is clear to me though is that Harry has suffered much more than William by the press. Meghan has had a much harder time than Kate. I, personally believe, strongly, that the reason for that is that Meghan is not white. Now I understand that view s not shared here on mumsnet. But that is my view. I am not looking to debate that. It is my opin

I respect your view

i do think that Harry is very vocal while William keeps his own council. Different personalities I suppose.

Kate has had a particularly horrible time at the hands of the press though. They snapped a topless photo of her sunbathing at a very private place. And then all the “waiting Katie” nonsense. Again, she hasn’t said anything but who wouldn’t be affected by that?

I think Harry is clearly traumatized by his childhood and the loss of his mother. I also don't think Charles had the skill to step up as the sole parent in the way that most of us here (ie normal people) would probably expect. While the boys were teenagers he was still off on painting holidays, focusing on bringing Camilla into the public eye. I think he always vaguely felt others were looking after the boys. When Harry was revealed to have spent a summer drinking and drug taking he had basically been left alone at Highgrove with just servants and security aged 16.

I always wonder what people who think Meghan has suffered so much from the press would say if they took naked photos of her and published them across the Internet and in magazines. I think their outcry would, quite rightly, be how dreadful and shameful it was. I'm sure there would be a mention of racism and they'd think it was the worst thing that had happened to her, even more so because it had never happened to any other member of the family.
And yet, they seem surprisingly quiet when it happened to Kate.

@Lndnmummy

i think there are cultural issues at play, not just race.

Many people were irritated for example that Meghan did the American thing of dropping in saying she was going to ‘ fix’ things in the RF without ever bothering to understand what and if there was a problem.

There was a huge cultural clash which was largely ignored as everything was blamed on racism.