If you watched all of Netflix H&M

[antelopevalley]

I have finally watched all episodes. It was much better than I was expecting and bore no resemblance to what was talked about for hours and hours by some posters on here.
I am interested in discussing the programme with people who have watched it all. What struck me was:

1. Harry clearly says Charles leaked the content of Harrys private letter to Charles, to the press.
2. William when younger had agreed with Harry that neither of them would behave as Charles had with his press office. But William went back on that and behaved the same way.
3. The Palace leaked the location of where Harry and Meghan were staying in Canada.
4. The small number of social media accounts run by mainly white middle-aged women who push hate for both of them but especially Meghan.
5. The myth that Meghan is controlling Harry is recognised by him as misogyny.

I think they were clearly right to leave.

And not only how much they don’t ‘get’ other cultures but how unaccepting they are of what you tell them when you explain your own culture. They cannot fathom that American ways aren’t considered the norm in other countries.

I think it goes both ways, @LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet . I was called a liar on here by 2 very narrow-minded and racist Brits who did not believe that it is common in some cultures to have two wedding ceremonies/or that you can be 'married' in the first ceremony even if it's not legal. I find some UK posters are so single-minded in their obstinance of what defines 'getting married' and have such a tunnel vision over it. Like no other wedding or marriage exists, if paperwork isn't signed.

And, as an Australian, I also agree with Americans over the UK's backwardness re 'f.g' / 'f.gg.t'. Yes, it has a different old fashioned meaning in the UK, but that is not good enough. No where else, not Australia, NZ, Canada, America, Germany, Sweden etc etc etc are those words still in usage. Only the UK has stubbornly refused to stop using the word. I don't give a stuff that it means cigarettes, or a bundle, or meatballs or what tf ever. STOP USING THE WORD, like everywhere else in a first world civilised society has. Change your ways. Every other country has!! In Australia we used to have lolly 'cigarettes', they came in a little cardboard (matchbox size) and were called Fags. Even Australia, even we changed it from 'Fags' to Fads in the late '80s. So it can be done. If the will is there. The word is offensive WORLD WIDE. Only the UK is still so backward it still uses it. Why can't the UK move with this century (even last century would be ok) and erase the word? There is no excuse for calling cigarettes 'f.gs' in 2022. No....Excuse. It's just laziness and an unwillingness to adapt to societal change.

Sentabale, Grenfell cook book, outfits for work interviews, that's just off the topic my head at this early hour. You can google for others

There are not 'always' two sides to every story.

They have never been 'proved' to have lied, ever. That they have is in itself, a lie.

been proved that they've lied in previous interviews That's a lie in itself, @liarliarshortsonfire . It has never been proved that they ever lied in any interview before.

@IAmWomanHearMeRoar1 The archbishop of Canterbury made a statement that he didn't marry them 3 days before their actual wedding. That's one lie/mis-truth for starters

@liarliarshortsonfire That is the only 'lie' ever put forward and it's been dealt with so, so, so, soooooo many times. As I referred to above, many cultures (inc some African Americans) have two ceremonies. So she did not lie. The Archbishop himself didn't deny the ceremony happened, just that it wasn't 'legal'. She did not lie at all, it's the UK's insular and narrow-minded view of what a ceremony can and can't be, that caused the problem. I even referred to it in my post to Lydia

I think it goes both ways, LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet . I was called a liar on here by 2 very narrow-minded and racist Brits who did not believe that it is common in some cultures to have two wedding ceremonies/or that you can be 'married' in the first ceremony even if it's not legal. I find some UK posters are so single-minded in their obstinance of what defines 'getting married' and have such a tunnel vision over it. Like no other wedding or marriage exists, if paperwork isn't signed.

It's been proven M and H never lied, it's been proven the only ones who have lied, are their critics. That's the great irony.

I agree with you OP. Regardless of what people might think about MM/PH the way press have treated them, mostly her, has been dreadful. No person should have gone through that. Regardless of the Palace’s personal feelings on her they should have defended and protected her.

I do often wonder if MM was your daughter what advice you would give to her? Give up and roll
over or fight back? Because I know what mine would be.

Right back off now to peel a carrot or two. Happy Christmas all 🎄

I do often wonder if MM was your daughter what advice you would give to her? Give up and roll
over or fight back? Because I know what mine would be.

I’ve never understood why rich people cant pay others to monitor smears against them (therefore they need to sue) and just ignore the rest of the Twitter stuff, newspapers, etc
Princess Diana reacted to Daily Mail comments, Prince Andrew can’t just disappear to a mansion in S Africa or some such distant land. MM and H seem to depend on crap headlines (mostly about others) to fund their lifestyle - I mean just step back guys.

I think you need to remember that we are just hearing one side of the story. Personally, I think both Harry and Meghan both felt annoyed that, due to how a monarchy works, the eldest sibling will always take priority. I think they loved the reaction they got in Australia and thought it would mean they were the 'stars'. I don't think there was a vendetta against them at all, I just think life continued as normal and they were a bit miffed that it didn't go all their way.

There have also been countless examples of times where both of their claims have been proven untrue, so it is hard to believe what they say. There have also been lots of stories from people who previously worked with Meghan in junior roles (e.g. fashion shoots) who said that she was deeply unpleasant to them. Since they don't have a particular loyalty to either camp, I am inclined to believe them.

Ultimately, if they really wanted a private life, they could easily have it. Peter Phillips has managed it - as have other royals. Personally, I think Meghan wanted the fame and celebrity side and was rather unimpressed with how monotonous royal life can be - e.g. yes, they have access to lots of wealth, but they can't be seen to be true extravagant too often, they can't accept freebies, are expected to be smiley and happy on walkabouts etc.

I don't wish Meghan any ill will, but if they really wanted closure, they wouldn't be doing a Netflix documentary and writing a book to tell the world about it.

Well there is clearly at the very least a question mark re the sharing by the employee of the documents during the court procedure - can’t remember what docs it was now - but there was a note about it at the end of the show.

it sounds to me that it is likely the guy was asked for documents as part of discovery process for the court proceedings.

their statement was obviously questionable enough for Netflix legal to insist on the note going up

@Havehope21 See I don't get this narrative that people have invented that they felt they were in William's shadow, that they wanted attention, to be higher up etc. Harry has always seemed like he didn't want the responsibilities of the job. I think he wanted out of the RF a long time ago. I genuinely don't believe he ever wanted William's role, or the responsibilities or the privilege. People seem to think he resents his rank. It suits their agenda to believe that, and they judge him through that false lens they themselves created. I think he is relieved he doesn't have William's role or responsibilities. He never did. I think if in the unlikely event it came to his turn, he'd abdicate immediately.

There have also been countless examples of times where both of their claims have been proven untrue

As I've said just a bit up in the thread, there are precisely zero examples of them ever been proven untrue in their claims. Not....one....single......example (and before the wedding ceremony is, yet again, mentioned, that's been dealt with only several posts before this.

There have also been lots of stories from people who previously worked with Meghan in junior roles (e.g. fashion shoots) who said that she was deeply unpleasant to them.

I have yet to see any named source come out and say this. On the contrary, many if not all of her previous co-stars, not just from Suits, but from Deal or No Deal, all names on record, who say she was nothing but genuine and warm. That is the overwhelming consensus, and I believe them.

Ultimately, if they really wanted a private life

They never at any stage said they wanted a 'private life'. On the contrary, they said they intended to continue doing public roles.

Personally, I think Meghan wanted the fame and celebrity side

That's your constructed narrative, I see nothing that suggests she particularly cares for fame or celebrity for it's sake of it.

@IAmWomanHearMeRoar1 Hey 👋

So there are plenty of examples of her behaviour on photoshoots where she was very difficult - it doesn't take long to find them.

Private life - they have used the word 'privacy' countless times which is ironic since their netflix documentary shared a lot of very personal photos / moments (including pictures of their children in the bath). That is up to them, of course, but then they shouldn't go on about privacy.

You don't think any of their claims have been proven to be untrue - I think you are wrong (a la the remark about the clothes she wears - same colour as Camilla here www.harpersbazaar.com/uk/culture/culture-news/a25047491/prince-charles-birthday-portraits-prince-louis/ and red here www.prima.co.uk/fashion-and-beauty/fashion-tips/a29585460/meghan-markle-red-leather-skirt/ and there are lots of photos of her in yellow too). Her remarks about Nelson Mandela - no one said that either! Their claims they had to get engaged in the UK - false, William and Kate got engaged abroad... the list goes on.

However, we can agree to disagree. You believe I have a constructed narrative, I, respectably, believe you have too. Their whole 'documentary' is a constructed narrative.

@IAmWomanHearMeRoar1 for someone preaching about racism you sure do come across xenophobic about Brits...

In what context have you heard Brits use that word? Are you going to generalise the whole population? My manager is Australian and is one of the most racist people I've ever met, I'm astounded by some of the outdated opinions he has and he openly makes racist jokes with black people at my work because they're supposedly friends and it's lighthearted. Should I tar the whole of Australia as racist?

And America is hardly a pillar of forward-thinking on racism and rights when they had Trump in power, stormed the Capitol, have people being killed by the police, have the KKK, have only just got rid of the confederate flag, they celebrate thanksgiving which has racist history. So please DO PIPE DOWN!

Gosh. I almost want to start smoking again so I can offer someone a fag.

People have said she's genuine and warm, and went on record with their names. That, speaks volumes.

The only times they mentioned privacy was in response to tabloids filming them at their house. They never said the reason they stepped back from their roles is due to privacy, which everyone seems to think they said despite the fact they never said that and in fact said they intend to continue to serve in public roles.
It has been said by many royal experts and in deed is publicly known that women in the RF are told before a function what colours they can't wear as that is (or was) the colours the late Queen was wearing. It was a faux pas to wear the same shade as the Queen of you were attending official duties with her.

Even Kate had to make sure she wasn't wearing the same colour as the Queen. So, again, proven true.

Do you know those comments re Mandela weren't said? Where's the proof they weren't.

Harry had to seek permission to get engaged to Meghan. Where is your proof that a) William and Kate were or weren't given permission to get in engaged abroad, and b) that Harry and Meghan were or weren't told they had to get engaged in the UK? Where is the confirmation for either, from the late Queen or from the RF? Until they confirm or deny one way or another, and also for Harry confirm one way or another, why declare outright they lied? When you have no proof? Only tabloid stories. If they lied the RF would call them out.

@MamboJamboWambo So telling the truth about British posters and simply reiterating what they've said is xenophobic? When I am pointing out the xenophobia of these British posters, your answer is to state that pointing out xenophobia is..... xenophobic. How do you justify that statement? It reads like gaslighting to me. My point is that if America and Australia can change, surely so too can the UK. Is there any reason why you think the two racist countries can change, but the UK cannot? I'm afraid you actually prove my point.

Exhibit B.....

Point proven.

Dunno why it surprises people that someone who has lived all his life in the eye of the media might try and use the media to tell his story. Seems pretty obvious thing to me.

The gilded cage aspect came across very strongly in the documentary. I kinda feel sorry for all of them. It's such a trap.

On your first point I had the impression that it was someone in his father's office that leaked it not necessarily himself.

Anyway I wish them well and hope some good might come from the documentary. I did think it was interesting when she said her race was never really an issue until she came to the UK.

I haven’t been able to watch the whole thing yet but the people I know who have, have told me they‘ve changed their opinions of M&H in a positive way and feel the Media and RF have acted terribly towards them.

I’ve always felt I don’t particularly like H&M, but that they do have very valid points about the British Media. H has chosen this battle and unfortunately because he’s attacking the media(who contributed to the death of his mother) they will double down in the attacking of him and his wife. I’m glad they’ve been able to get their side of the story out there.

Sticks and stones …….

It is interesting that Jason Knauf responded. Unless he was on leave I'd expect him to discuss that communication with colleagues which does give weight to the argument that their behaviour is a bit fishy.

Jason Knauf doesn't work at the palace anymore so no one to confer with. He left last year because his partner moved abroad for work.

@IAmWomanHearMeRoar1 Are you their PR or something? I am entitled to my opinion and you are entitled to yours. However, you do seem over invested in this!

My point is that if America and Australia can change, surely so too can the UK. Is there any reason why you think the two racist countries can change, but the UK cannot?

Just for clarity, you're saying that America and Australia have changed and are now no longer racist unlike the UK? 🤔

If you have a flexible relationship with the truth and you start a thread to report selectively in favour of others like you, then it doesn't being us any closer to the truth. Yes, I did say THE truth, not her truth or your truth.