Page 13 | Meghan & Harry Were Lying From The Start, Weren't They?

TheShellBeach · 2022-12-15T17:47:04+00:00

As per the thread title. Right from the word go, Meghan and Harry were not telling the truth. About anything. Now the Netflix series has come out it just proves it, over and over again.

Ohnonevermind · 21/12/2022 08:50

@onlylarkin

her father wasn’t able to afford it, he had to take out loans to pay a hefty amount of fees.

Imagine taking out loans, going bankrupt in the process and not even being thanked in your daughters speech about paying for college, your contribution just air brushed out.

shockthemonkey · 21/12/2022 10:02

Spot on, richlydetailed. The documentary paints the UK as a hotbed of racism, from slavery and empire through to Brexit.

It may not be expressly said by Harry, but he has to take responsibility for the series, which juxtaposes images, adds voiceovers and adds eery soundtracks in an aim to paint all white-skinned Brits as bigotted Brexiteers.

And Meghan did say her race was never an issue until she arrived in the UK.

ImAvingOops · 21/12/2022 10:06

shockthemonkey · 21/12/2022 06:07

ImAvingOops · Yesterday 18:39
Meghan's so-called lies are the result of confusion on her part, or twisting of the facts/embellishment
Twisting of facts/embellishment is lying. As in, it's not the truth

@ImAvingOops , semantics and pragmatics teach us the difference between lying, misleading, deceiving... between what is said, what is implied and what is inferred. You can deceive while telling the truth - I could give examples if you like - and conversely, if you totally believe what you're saying, you're not lying because there is no intention to deceive. You're simply telling an untruth, which is not always the same as lying. And a very charitable interpretation of what is going on with Meghan is that sometimes she believes her own fabrications.

I would agree that it's certainly possible to deceive while telling the truth. Or rather by telling some of the truth and leaving out salient details. An example being how MM's education was financed - yes she did work, but it was also paid for by her father. I would struggle to believe that she genuinely has forgotten that her father contributed.
Deliberate misrepresentation or lying by omission is still a lie.

I do believe that H&M do have some legitimate complaints around tabloid behaviour. I also think that the RF doesn't always help itself and should work on being cohesive and not have separate offices competing. It's certainly not helpful to family relationships not to have direct access to one's own father or grandmother.

But I think they are not the victims of a racist Britain. And I think there have been instances where H&M have been very economical with the truth.

And I still come back to the view that if it's all so awful, stop using the titles and monetising their association with Britain/RF.

shockthemonkey · 21/12/2022 12:54

I'm with you, Oops! No I don't think that M has genuinely forgotten about her father's financial contributions. Just that in the context of that speech, it didn't suit her narrative to include it.

And I agree with the rest of your post.

TheRedLip · 21/12/2022 14:21

I agree with the poster above. I think that Meghan's memory functions perfectly well. She just chooses which memories to remember or forget depending on what narrative she's pushing at the time. So when she was still doing The Tig it suited her narrative to show what a doting father her Dad was and how she was very much a Daddy's girl.

Roussette · 21/12/2022 15:45

Isn't that like anyone though?

We see threads started by someone going through a difficult time with their DH or MIL or DM or whatever... they put forward their side of the story. How it made them feel, and sometimes I bet there are elements missed out or glossed over.

Original poster

TheShellBeach · 21/12/2022 16:04

"..................and sometimes I bet there are elements missed out or glossed over"

It's just that Markle glosses over the truth all the time and rewrites history to suit herself.

OP posts:

Roussette · 21/12/2022 16:12

TheShellBeach · 21/12/2022 16:04

"..................and sometimes I bet there are elements missed out or glossed over"

It's just that Markle glosses over the truth all the time and rewrites history to suit herself.

Says you

meinteresamucho · 21/12/2022 16:27

I think the evidence is there in black and white Rousette. You can twist her words to make them into truths that are consistent with the facts but everyone can see when that's being done. The newspapers including the broadsheets have documented these inaccuracies extensively and some have also been recorded in a court of law.

DownNative · 21/12/2022 16:44

shockthemonkey · 20/12/2022 11:06

She has said some very misleading things, that's for sure, and some untruths were told, I believe, stemming from her "strong sense of self".

One such example is her response to Oprah when asked if Archie wasn't getting a title or his own protection because of his skin color. That's when Meghan sighed, and trotted out words to the effect that "all I know is that they were concerned about his skin colour and around the same time we were told that he wouldn't get his own protection or a title". Obviously I am paraphrasing there, but can she really have conflated a possibly unintentionally crass remark with the quite different explanations re the letters of patent and what this ancient statute meant for Archie? Meghan's disingenuous reply here - and let's face it she was either being disingenuous or stupid - stoked the accusations of racism that were levelled at the RF.

Another untruth, just number two of many, was Meghan's claim that a South African member of the cast of Lion King told her that there was jubilation in the streets at home when she married into the RF, very similar to when Nelson Mandela was freed. But Dr John Kani, the only South African on the cast, says he never even met Meghan, much less said anything of the sort. Cue a fruitless search for whom she may possibly have been speaking to. In this instance it might seem a bit harsh to say Meghan lied... I think she may have got carried away and embellished her story. Perhaps she did get a nice comment from the cast line-up when she met them, but not from a South African, and probably nobody made a weird parallel between Meghan's wedding and such a momentous occasion as the release of Nelson Mandela. I think that conversation existed largely in Meghan's head.

I wouldn't go so far as to say Meghan's been lying from the start. That would be a bit harsh, and some of the things she's been saying have been true. What I believe is that she's a bit of a fantasizer at times, she likes to spin a good tale. So she'll embroider a truth or pretend to misconstrue a comment to advance her own narrative. And I think, in so far as you are convinced of the truth of what you're saying, it's not lying... because lying is to intentionally mislead, and I think often she's the one who is misled, or confused.

Of course, it was very intentional of Meghan Markle to link any supposed denial of the Prince title to Archie on the basis of alleged racism from the RF.

The plain meaning her words is very clear.

Meghan Markle claimed:

"....the first member of color in this family isn't being titled in the same way as other grandchildren would be."

On the contrary, Archie is really treated no differently to the Queen's grandchildren who aren't entitled to the Prince and Princess style.

Zara Tindall and Peter Phillips, for example, don't have this style. Zara is the Queen's eldest grandchild, by the way.

Furthermore, Prince Edward's children are NOT styled as Prince and Princess despite the Letters Patent of 1917. They are styled as children of the Earl - not HRH Prince and Princess.

Edward's children are the first to have the double barrelled Mountbatten-Windsor name.

Harry and Meghan's son, Archie, is treated in the exact same way as Edward's children AND he carries the same double barrelled surname as they do.

Here again, Meghan's implied claim of racism doesn't stand up.

Of course, Meghan incorrectly referred to Archie as one of the Queen's grandchildren. He was a great-grandson of the late Queen since his father, Harry was her grandson. Archie was treated NO differently to any great-grandchildren who WEREN'T entitled to Prince and Princess titles during the late Queen's reign.

It was deliberate to claim this from Meghan. She wasn't confused and she's far from being a stupid person.

bakalava · 21/12/2022 16:51

It is the big gig, she is not the one who has actually lost anything significant in all of this. It is a net gain for her at Aitch's expense, she's playing it like a pro. Why shouldn't she? Many would.
She knows that a madlib core will excuse every single act of bad behaviour and mis-remembrance. The polarization is cemented.
I can see it for what it is and it is done so clumsily that it has now started to endear her to me in a strange kind of way.

Roussette · 21/12/2022 16:51

meinteresamucho · 21/12/2022 16:27

I think the evidence is there in black and white Rousette. You can twist her words to make them into truths that are consistent with the facts but everyone can see when that's being done. The newspapers including the broadsheets have documented these inaccuracies extensively and some have also been recorded in a court of law.

And you can twist her words to fit your narrative.

One mistake in a court of law. Much like the Queen forgetting about agreeing with Paul Burrell. She had a flash of memory. Like Meghan did.

As for the rest, I suppose you're going on about wedding 3 days before. What does it matter? She does not deserve the hate and vitriol. That's all I know.

Well done them for leaving.

p.s. I don't need a huge list of what you consider her 'lies'. I've heard it all before a million times.

Roussette · 21/12/2022 16:52

bakalava · 21/12/2022 16:51

It is the big gig, she is not the one who has actually lost anything significant in all of this. It is a net gain for her at Aitch's expense, she's playing it like a pro. Why shouldn't she? Many would.
She knows that a madlib core will excuse every single act of bad behaviour and mis-remembrance. The polarization is cemented.
I can see it for what it is and it is done so clumsily that it has now started to endear her to me in a strange kind of way.

Ahhh we're all mad liberals now are we? And woke I suppose. Yawn

DownNative · 21/12/2022 16:59

On top of this, their Oprah interview had what they claimed was racist based articles from UK media on screen as they told their story.

Yet non-UK articles were cropped, mocked up and passed off as British ones. This included American publications such as US Weekly and National Enquirer as well as Australian outlet New Ideas. The UKs Guardian article was certainly cropped and distorted for effect, for example.

Their latest documentary continues the misleading stuff by using Harry Potter and Katie Price scenes to claim it was the media hounding the Sussexes. 🤷‍♂️

meinteresamucho · 21/12/2022 17:04

It was a lie - why call it a mistake? And yes the Queen did the same but she doesn't have the same history of compulsive lying as Meghan (HMQ can still be criticised for that one incident though). She does not deserve a lot of what has been said but she does deserve to have these lies documented and pointed out because they are harmful to other people whether you want to deny their existence or not. There is really zero ambiguity on most of them which almost everyone else thankfully seems to recognise.

pelargoniums · 21/12/2022 17:20

bakalava · 21/12/2022 16:51

It is the big gig, she is not the one who has actually lost anything significant in all of this. It is a net gain for her at Aitch's expense, she's playing it like a pro. Why shouldn't she? Many would.
She knows that a madlib core will excuse every single act of bad behaviour and mis-remembrance. The polarization is cemented.
I can see it for what it is and it is done so clumsily that it has now started to endear her to me in a strange kind of way.

Even by Mumsnet massive salad standards that’s a massive word salad.

bakalava · 21/12/2022 17:25

pelargoniums · 21/12/2022 17:20

Even by Mumsnet massive salad standards that’s a massive word salad.

Show quote history

Oh, is it? Please don't take it so seriously that you feel you need to go out of your way to comment.
Have you taken over from antelope as the resident obsessed poster? 🤔

pelargoniums · 21/12/2022 17:27

bakalava · 21/12/2022 17:25

Oh, is it? Please don't take it so seriously that you feel you need to go out of your way to comment.
Have you taken over from antelope as the resident obsessed poster? 🤔

Show quote history

Have you taken over from the thread police to arbitrate on who’s allowed to comment?

Sayitagainmyl · 21/12/2022 17:31

It’s amazing what some people perceive as so important that they dedicate so much time to discussion. Either you’re incredibly privileged that you neither have to work nor be troubled by real societal problems or you’re incredibly lonely and consumed with such bitterness that your only source of pleasure is to imagine that some other individual who you do not know is suffering even more, and taking wilful action to manifest those thoughts into reality. The reality, however, is that H&M are very likely much happier than anyone that chooses to critique them incessantly. If Jeremy Clarkson did one positive thing this week, it was to expose inadvertently the sickness that pervades the minds of the anti-Meghan trolls – who are small in number but loud in voice. As Carol Vorderman tweeted yesterday:

“…it's like watching the last death throes of a dinosaur age. Sad souls who are angry at new thought, at equality, at kindness. BUT this chapter has also brought the calm, normally silent, people together.”

And thank goodness for that.

Ohnonevermind · 21/12/2022 17:32

@meinteresamucho

it might be more relevant to think why did they lie

Meghan - her contributions to the book were spiteful and it would ruin her victim narrative to be found out.

Most of her other lies are self -aggrandising ones

to make herself look better or others worse. It’s not to protect others feelings (which is when many of us tell the odd white lie- in my case that the jumper my mum has bought me is lovely’)

bakalava · 21/12/2022 17:36

Ohnonevermind · 21/12/2022 17:32

@meinteresamucho

it might be more relevant to think why did they lie

Meghan - her contributions to the book were spiteful and it would ruin her victim narrative to be found out.

Most of her other lies are self -aggrandising ones

to make herself look better or others worse. It’s not to protect others feelings (which is when many of us tell the odd white lie- in my case that the jumper my mum has bought me is lovely’)

Some of the details were too fine. Like dumping in the outbaok to impress your boyfriend. A serious writer would never have included that in a hagiography.

Walnutwhipsarenothesame · 21/12/2022 21:39

I wonder if Ms relationship with the truth started with embellishing or bending the truth in childhood to appease both her parents. Also to fit in at school. After a while objective truth can cease to matter to the person who is making up the ‘facts’.

StarbucksSmarterSister · 21/12/2022 22:15

sometimes forgot to mention her father’s contribution.

I have no issue with that, since he said that he'd paid for all of it. He must have forgotten too.

Morestrangethings · 22/12/2022 00:54

Roussette · 21/12/2022 15:45

Isn't that like anyone though?

We see threads started by someone going through a difficult time with their DH or MIL or DM or whatever... they put forward their side of the story. How it made them feel, and sometimes I bet there are elements missed out or glossed over.

That’s what I think Rousette.

Plus, I’m not going around showing the worst side of myself.

Hillcrest2022 · 22/12/2022 01:14

Nuch a nasty thread.

Meghan had undoubtedly a horrible experience with the royal family. Why is there so much hate piled on her.

I found the documentary for the most part very genuine. They were both hurt that they hadn't support from the Palace to address the media hate levelled at her. I think it's fair for them to feel hurt about that.