Harry and Meghan - lies?

[FurAndFeathers]

Ok I’m keeping my fingers crossed this thread will not descend into an unsubstantiated bun fight! Please bear with me.

I’m definitely no Royalist, and am pretty ambivalent about H and M but from the little I’ve read they seem to have been treated pretty badly. However I keep seeing on other threads here that their claims have all be proven to be lies, which would make me much less sympathetic to them. But I can’t find any verification for this.

So I’m asking more knowledgeable posters - what lies specifically have H&M told and where’s the evidence to the contrary please?

thank you

In other words they're useful idiots.

It’s the immense privilege they have without having to do any work. Yet they sit around in their massive pile tearing down the source of that wealth and privilege for more money.
The hypocrisy of painting themselves as humanitarians when they are unable to see beyond their own noses.
They both reek of hypocrisy and self absorption. Many people know characters like this in their own lives and it rankles I suppose.
So many people are genuinely struggling in their lives at the moment, but nothing is ever enough for this pair. They are so full of bitterness and spite. It is unpleasant to behold.

To be frank, I find your post unpleasant to behold but there you go.
Horses for courses

Meghan has worked her whole life, Harry has served in the military and done a lot of conservation and humanitarian work.

Do you expect all celebrities to be lovely, humble and grateful?
like the rest of the Royal family? 😂

So what comparable impact specifically have H&M had?

I suspect the folk being unpleasant in this thread would find an outlet to be unpleasant regardless - it’s unfair to blame others for personal bile-spewing - we’re all grown ups - we need to take responsibility for our own behaviour, not chose to behave like dicks then blame it on Harry and Meghan

'So what comparable impact specifically have H&M had?'

You only have to look at these threads to see the division being stirred up. It becomes a problem when the attacks on the RF turn into attacks on the HOS and the constitutional monarchy. You want a republic? Fine, persuade people that a republic is a better form of state than a constitutional monarchy (and try and do it without 'personal bile-spewing') and I'm sure lots of people will agree and a referendum will show that.

However, these threads have very personal attacks directed at the HOS and next in line with a view to what? The number of anti monarchy threads, the same threads with the titles couched in a slightly different way, and anti monarchy posts from first time posters. Harry and Meghan's attacks on the institution of the monarchy have given carte blanche to many whose endgame is not benign. It's been proved again and again that there is interference in British politics/life from external sources who do not wish the UK well and a constitutional crisis on top of Brexit/COVID/another Scottish independence referendum would be damaging in the extreme.

As I said upthread, a pair of useful idiots.

None of that is a direct impact on the lives of the public though.

if people choose to be hateful then they need to take personal responsibility for that, not blame random celebrities they’ll never meet for it.

I have to say that I’ve become more anti-monarchy over the years - not because if anything H&M have done (I’m actually pretty ignorant of most of it hence starting this thread) but because it’s become increasingly obvious that the Royal family is a racist institution that befriends and harbours child sex abusers.

I blame the Royal family for that because they are the responsible party.

there seems to be a lots of scapegoating of H&M because if they aren’t ‘in ‘ the RF they must be the enemy, and many people clearly cannot cope with criticism of the royal institution.

interesting that no one seems to have the same bile towards the racists and sex abuser supporters who have actually damaged the RF.

I have to say that I’ve become more anti-monarchy over the years - not because if anything H&M have done

Me too. I was a total royalist at one point then bit by bit, my view changed over the span of a good decade or two. The RF do themselves no favours whatsoever and my views changing were nothing to do with H&M but how they have handled that whole situation has confirmed I was right. It was the Diana years, Queens assent changing of laws to suit themselves, the draining of public money to keep themselves in pure luxury, the disgusting behaviour of Andrew over decades and the Queen enabling him, the archaic institution that seems incapable of modernising into this century.

That sort of thing.

'None of that is a direct impact on the lives of the public though.'

Well it is if it affects the foundation of the state. There've been a couple of articles linked to on other threads about the damage Harry and Meghan's comments about the Commonwealth could do.

Your assertions that the RF are a racist institution harbouring child sex abusers, I'm not sure I agree wholeheartedly. Do you mean the RF is racist or the monarchy is a racist institution? I don't think the RF are any more or less racist than the population in general - or any other governmental institution. Prince Philip is often cited on these threads. Did you know, at the formation of the Commonwealth, he pushed very hard for exclusion of any countries subject to apartheid? I don't think any of the RF are racist on a personal level.

Andrew may be many awful things but there is no proof whatsoever that he is a child sex abuser.

I love that H&M are single-handedly destroying the ‘foundations of the state’
how exactly? By pointing out the flaws if a rich family? If the foundations are so shaky they cannot withstand some robust discussion then we probably shouldn’t be building our state on them.

Regarding the other points - I can’t be bothered to repeat myself. Try reading my posts again.

I would love to know how many "younger" people are fans of the royals. I know my adult child is not. we don't have big conversations about them, but when they come up they see the amount of money and stuff they have as obscene. also the queen making a speech with a solid gold piano in the background as hypocricy.
older people like me have i suppose a certain amount of "loyalty" as we have grown up thinking they are special.
my feelings are changing. the silence about what Clarkson said and his being part of a do Camila gave is very damming. I really think they have proved H&M have a point.
people seem to have a blind spot and have decided anything H&M are lies, yet even a broken clock is right twice a day.
people don't want to believe PW shouted and screamed at PW for instance. I remember when my DB did that to me, his mates would probably say "oh know Fred would never do that" yet he did.

Well said Samcro.

To say that M&H are destroying the RF in one breath whilst ignoring the far more damaging behaviour of PA in the other, is ludicrous.

My adult children have little opinion on the RF but one of the whose opinion I strongly value, watched the 6 part NF series and her take from it was positive towards Meghan.
Support in the younger generation is draining massively because they are becoming increasingly irrelevant to my mind. Unless they shake things up and make themselves more relevant. The Coronation costing £50 million with £3.5billion worth of jewels on display during the day is tone deaf in these days and times.

Charles gave a good Christmas day speech highlighting the cost of living crisis, (I applaud him for that) yet is happy to spend money like water and show off extreme wealth.

Coxspurplepippin
"Coxspurplepippin
'So what comparable impact specifically have H&M had?'

You only have to look at these threads to see the division being stirred up. It becomes a problem when the attacks on the RF turn into attacks on the HOS and the constitutional monarchy. You want a republic? Fine, persuade people that a republic is a better form of state than a constitutional monarchy (and try and do it without 'personal bile-spewing') and I'm sure lots of people will agree and a referendum will show that.

However, these threads have very personal attacks directed at the HOS and next in line with a view to what? The number of anti monarchy threads, the same threads with the titles couched in a slightly different way, and anti monarchy posts from first time posters. Harry and Meghan's attacks on the institution of the monarchy have given carte blanche to many whose endgame is not benign. It's been proved again and again that there is interference in British politics/life from external sources who do not wish the UK well and a constitutional crisis on top of Brexit/COVID/another Scottish independence referendum would be damaging in the extreme.

As I said upthread, a pair of useful idiots."

I agree, China and Russia seem to be making capital from all of this.

'I love that H&M are single-handedly destroying the ‘foundations of the state’
how exactly?'

I wouldn't give them that much credence at all, but what they have done is allowed the bile (on both sides, let's not dismiss the anti Semitic filth Meghan's army of fans has loosed over the last few days), division and let's face it, mischief to take hold. I don't give them any power, but I do think they're being used rather more than they realise. They think they're in control of the narrative.

let's not dismiss the anti Semitic filth Meghan's army of fans has loosed over the last few days

Do not imagine that those who are more in support of H&M are like this. They are a hardcore of people who I despise. There are extremes on both sides.

Ok so we’re blaming H&M for China and Russia’s emerging power, undermining the foundations of the state and sowing dissent by simply giving their version of events? They’re personally responsible are they? If not and they’re simply ‘puppets’ then why the bile?

but we aren’t blaming Clarkson, Morgan et al for their hate-filled rhetoric that stokes the public bile-spewing, the RF for their tone-deaf spending, ongoing display of institutional racism and support of sex offenders?

okey doke

I have no idea what this is about. took a break from these threads over Christmas. can you fill me in?

My eyes can't roll any further....... No, I'm not blaming Harry and Meghan, what I am saying (repeatedly), is that their whinging has provided an opportunity for those who would like to see a weakened UK and Commonwealth to spread a bit more division, whip up a bit more froth, entrench a few more on the side of 'nice H&M, horrid monarchy' with no particular analysis. I haven't the time to find the couple of articles linked to either earlier on this thread or on other threads which go some way to explaining why it might be an issue - they were interesting.

And for the last time, I don't think H&M wield any power in this - I think they're in danger of being led by the nose.

The Sussex Squad on Twitter attacking a jewish writer of an article with anti semitic crap.
They are hard core and unpleasant.

@Roussette so nothing to do with mn. thanks confused me. I don't do twitter.

Absolutely not. But of course posters on here lump supporters of M&H with Sussex Squad.

Ok so you’re not blaming them but you think they shouldn’t complain about anything in case it’s used to whip up division?

that’s hardly their responsibility is it. They’re free to live their lives as they choose.

A bit like people who don't agree with M&H and their 'modus operandi', being lumped with racists and 'haters'.

Isn’t pretty much everything on Twitter hardcore and unpleasant? 😁

@FurAndFeathers
"Ok so we’re blaming H&M for China and Russia’s emerging power, undermining the foundations of the state and sowing dissent by simply giving their version of events? They’re personally responsible are they? If not and they’re simply ‘puppets’ then why the bile?

but we aren’t blaming Clarkson, Morgan et al for their hate-filled rhetoric that stokes the public bile-spewing, the RF for their tone-deaf spending, ongoing display of institutional racism and support of sex offenders? "

Who is "we"? Your post doesn't make any sense.