Harry and Meghan - lies?

[FurAndFeathers]

Ok I’m keeping my fingers crossed this thread will not descend into an unsubstantiated bun fight! Please bear with me.

I’m definitely no Royalist, and am pretty ambivalent about H and M but from the little I’ve read they seem to have been treated pretty badly. However I keep seeing on other threads here that their claims have all be proven to be lies, which would make me much less sympathetic to them. But I can’t find any verification for this.

So I’m asking more knowledgeable posters - what lies specifically have H&M told and where’s the evidence to the contrary please?

thank you

The thing I remember about high spending was the £500k, was it, baby shower. That was just out of this world to think of having that kind of money spent on a single event.

But that would largely be a personal feeling, someone might have, a critic, in the grand scheme of things.

Let's get things in perspective: telling the world you are going abroad and carving out your own progressive role', without having cleared the announcement with the palace, is far worse and more major than wearing a £90k dress. It's crass to ostentatiously flaunt that wealth, and you can say goodbye to claiming any credibility as an eco warrior (😆), but it's not like trying to do something weird with the royal family 'brand' as you've turned it into, and milking the institution for your private benefit.

Lots of people wear expensive clothes and it's crass and undignified. Lots of men, especially, have ridiculously expensive cars, and that's crass, and they can say goodbye to being a role model if the notch up gas guzzler purchases like that. You can get Adidas/ designer collaboration hand towels for £300. It's ridiculous. Give the money to the homeless instead. You don't admire people like this, but it's not the same as M and H going on global TV and saying the British Royal Family is racist and won't give Archie a higher title because of his heritage. That is just dragging down the Royal Family and making their position as symbolic head of an multicultural society almost unworkable - if it were to be believed.

So I sense some posters picking on minor things like clothes and saying, 'Oh, it's all unfair. It's just about wearing slightly more expensive garments.' But that's not it, because people might tut tut, but they are not, like, pinning all their criticism on relatively minor things such as clothes. It's the big things that count.

Members of the Royal Family are not allowed to accept freebies plus they are expected to promote British designers whilst carrying out engagements in the U.K.
If allegations in books are true , Meghan was annoyed she couldn’t accept freebies .

Freeloading is not expected to be consistent across a family. The problem here is the fact that the person taking the most has contributed the least and is intent upon publicly damaging the family who gave her that life of luxury. It would not go down well in any family or social group. It is just mean, selfish and ungrateful.

Either you repay, wipe the slate clean and then launch your attack or you gratefully accept and respect family traditions. What she has done shows a lack of class and an inexplicably huge sense of entitlement. She still thinks that she was the best thing that happened to the RF but history will reveal otherwise IMO.

Those who defend this aspect of her bahaviour are probably also like that which is why they cannot understand what she has done wrong.

Royal protocol prevents Kate from accepting donations from any manufacturer/designer.

'The past acceptance of atrocities committed by the British Empire..'

I don't know about the word 'acceptance'. My predecessors were probably those London street sellers who got up at 4am to buy at market and walked 10 miles a day hawking their goods, before selling off half for less than they brought them for, then stumbling home to bed at 8pm, and all on a cup of tea and half a loaf of bread.

The other ones were probably dying of starvation in Ireland. I don't know part they played in a accepting the Establishment 's atrocities. They couldn't even vote, or read.

That chart

Yes exactly. The vast majority of people had no autonomy at all in their lives. Day to day life was a grinding round of poverty, desperation and ill health. I sometimes think other nations imagine people in Britain were all sitting around drinking tea from their silver service and ordering the servants around.

My biggest bugbear was M did not seem to try to promote British fashion. I do remember she used a handbag given to her (I may be wrong about that) by a Scottish brand. It was really nice and within my budget at a stretch. I did consider buying one and I know their sales rocketed. We have lots of brilliant designers and brands in the U.K. and it would have been nice if she’d made some effort to utilise that.

Yes that was Strathberry. She never seemed to bother to promote British fashion after that and the Stella McCartney evening dress at her wedding.

When William and Kate did their trip to India, Kate wore several local designer's dresses and their sales went through the roof. I think that's a great way of showcasing local talent.

Stella McCartney didn’t need the publicity. Meghan loved her Oscar De La Renta…and some other American designer. And of course Givenchy. She just saw it as a way of having all the designer gear she wanted. I mean she hardly worked…she was pregnant after 4/5 months of marriage. Worked for less the. 12 months, went on maternity and never really came back. Even though she was supposed to be good when she worked. That amount of money on clothes was over the top.

Its not the sum of it to my mind. Yes, nearly all people suffer discrimination in one form or another but not all people suffer the additional form of racism - which only Black people or PoC suffer. So, to my mind they are experiencing further discrimination. And until white people stop telling Black people and PoC how they see things concerning discrimination and start listening to how it is experienced by those racially discriminated against - it just won’t change. (Not until white people are no longer in the majority in our society, anyway. And that’s not far that off) Surely, better for the majority of our society to stop telling the minority how things are. And stop saying that it’s the same, but with variations, for everyone. I don’t believe that is how it is. Better that we listen.

And yes, powerful people benefit from social divisiveness, The problem that they don’t seem to have thought through - they seem to have short memories - is that if you work to divide a society enough then the scales tip and society fractures and breaks. Society becomes largely unworkable. We’ve seen it so many times this past 120 years alone. I don’t like where our world is heading. I feel like history is absolutely repeating itself.

@Morestrangethings

My Irish born aunt was on the tube with my cousins. It stopped and she spoke to reassure her young kids and a man spat on her and called her an IRA lover and threatened to beat her up in front of my cousins. My cousin (he’s 53 now) remembers a number of such incidents in his childhood so please don’t say that only black people experienced racism in the U.K. and minimise other peoples experiences.

I think you'll find gypsies are the most discriminated against ethnic group in the UK.

The cheap clothes often are of dubious origin (sweat shops, excess clothes dumping, toxic dyes in waterways in poor countries). Don’t know if Zara has some kind of fair work/pay initiative or not. But many don’t. Yes, this accusation can levelled at more expensive designers but I’m not sure - maybe they don’t use sweat shops or maybe they hide it better.

My apologies, ohnevermind, I should not have omitted the Irish experience in the UK. The Irish suffer racism in the UK as do PoC. Absolutely. And I’m sorry your family member has experienced such episodes of racism. I’m sorry for that omission.

I wasn’t only taking about the UK, but generalising across the countries of the commonwealth, and the US.

Hopefully my omission of the Irish experience doesn’t undermine what I wrote, too much.

Thank you. PrincessofWellirs.

and I aologise for leaving out the Roma people.

Some of my ancestors left Ireland & England and probably took up small land grants in Australia, or bought small landholdings off the British Crown/Govt thereby effectively contributing to divesting Australia’s First Nations people of their land, driving them further away from their traditional land and traditional way of life, breaking up their families and much of culture in the process.

I’d like to think my ancestors were not involved in the massacres of the traditional owners but I’ve got to admit there is a possibility that they could have been. Someone did. Why did my ancestors come here in the first place? Because they couldn’t eat and work In England or and Ireland and were looking to improve the life by emigrating to Australia and being ‘settlers.’

My ancestors, both Irish and English,

did participate in a life in this country under a British govt that dispossed traditional owners, segregated them, put them on missions, stole their babies and did other atrocious things. Later it was the Australian Federal govt that continued on in this manner.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_for_the_Settlement_of_Ireland_1652
Two and a half million acres were ‘confiscated from Irish people’ during these acts

The Anglo Protestant landlord class owned 90% of the Irish land by 1860 and while some landlords went broke during the famine helping tenants while other took advantage of the opportunity it provided to clear their land of small farm holding

www.rte.ie/history/famine-ireland/2020/0805/1157526-that-diabolical-system-evictions-in-famine-ireland/

Fot many the choices were death/poorhouse or emigration. Most were already dispossessed from their land in Ireland and many died trying to escape starvation.

After the famine the Catholic Church took hold in Ireland and and had people under his boot for another century, and took the lead role in determining social policy. Being poor was to be despised and the church saw people emigrating as spreading the Catholic word so it was encouraged. There needed to be enough money to pay the church it’s due

Your comments seems to gloss over the plight of people who left

Let Meghan spend her money it's hers. Meghan is the only person to have actually worked in that family

That’s not remotely true, you know. Looking at the people who have married into the royal family in the last three generations:

Prince Philip - career naval officer
Anthony-Armstrong Jones - professional photographer
Diana Spencer - nursery worker
Mark Phillips - army officer and equestrian
Tim Laurence - career naval officer
Sarah Ferguson - worked in PR and for a publishing company
Sophie Rhys Jones - PR, and set up her own PR agency
Kate Middleton - worked for Jigsaw then her parent’s company
Meghan Markle - actress
Mike Tindall - professional rugby player
Autumn Kelly - management consultant
Jack Brooksbank - bar and brand manager
Edo Mapelli-Mozzi - property developer

(Even Princess Diana, who was only 19 when she was engaged and was the daughter of a peer - and so was the possibly the most likely to have no need to have worked had some work experience. Some have worked in demanding roles and two had their own successful businesses when they married into the royal family)

I didn’t mean to gloss over anything. I’m sorry that what I wrote led you to feel that way.

I know a bit about Irish history from my grandfather. Whose mother came from Ireland when he was just a boy. And I’ve read a bit on it too. But I can always learn more, so thank you.

I was just focusing on colonisation of Australia and it’s effects on the First Nations people. And putting my hand up to say my ancestors had to be part of this, because they were here.

At the same time I feel that I have written quite a bit about racism in Australia, and the dispossession of its Traditional owners, and you’ve responded to it twice, & both times you haven’t once acknowledged this particular subject with a response, but to say what I’ve got wrong & and left out.

I condemn what happened to the First Nation in Australia, its a shameful history, my apologies for not saying it explicitly