Why are H&M "less important" now?

[thefoggiest]

Let's not make this a bashing thread!
But in another thread yesterday it occured to me that the way I see it, I just get the sense that with the queens death they almost drop a rank. But that doesnt make sense? If anything shouldn't they now feel more important? Now that her majesty has gone it just feels like they become more distant somehow. Could it be to do with the passing of a generation, so they are no longer "the youth"?

By the way this isnt based on any facts or anything I've read, just a feeling on it. Can anyone explain? Am I right or wrong?

I think that their own narrative has made them less relevant and unpalatable to many over time.

H aligned himself with HMQ on an appropriate personal / family relationship level but after her death his association with The Monarchy will be continue to judged by his past and present words and actions directly through his own media efforts rather than the spin/lies of the toxic and racist tabloids and SM.

To date these words and actions have been withdrawing from working royal public duties alongside global high profile one-sided victim narrative with ongoing opaque but pointed threats (even in recent weeks from M) that there is more dirt to dish.

The looming of his tell all book scheduled for the bumper Thanksgiving and Christmas sales market is the most pressing.

However H has been quiet, dignified, cooperative and compliant this past week in his grief especially with a huge effort of “unity” shown at the Windsor walkabout.

It depends what H&M and the RF do next.

The ball is in each of their courts - they could look to play nicely by looking to repair relationships to respectable levels or they can continue the hostilities after a period of quiet.

It depends how H&M choose to promote and position their media opportunities and if the RF fall into the dynamic of leaking / briefing against them - or if the RF see them as irrelevant?

Harry is still ahead of Andrew in the line of succession, even Harry's children are ahead of Andrew.

Harry and Meghan have always been in the Andrew and Sarah role - and to be fair, the 'spare' role is really hard I think, for years you are important until your sibling has children then you're expected to go and find something else to do. Margaret did continue with royal duties, Andrew was in the Navy until retirement and even in Charles' slimmed-down monarchy he was planning for Harry to continue with Royal duties.

We all knew that Charles would be King and William the heir but now they are front and centre instead of the Queen/Charles for constitutional matters it's still a big change to get used to. Charles and William have done some joint engagements in the past but I'm not used to seeing them working together in an official capacity so much. I hadn't anticipated them having to do so much right after the death of the Queen, I can see why they'd need to visit all four corners in the days of civil wars but nowadays - surely they could have had a bit more time to themselves?

Yes I think its this

When I was a child Princess Margaret and her children were often in the news. By the 90s Margaret was completely overshadowed by Diana and Fergie and no one was really interested in her anymore. And most people would have difficulty picking her children out of a line up.

The same will happen with Harry and Meghan. In 15 years time it's possible that William will be King, and the media will be interested in George and Charlotte and their various romances.

Harry and Meghan will be barely mentioned anymore and their children will be hopefully leading happy and fairly obscure lives somewhere.

If you are talking about their media profile it will depend on a few things:

1. The actual £££/$$$ value of H&M click bait for advertising revenue on SM and MSM sites as a baseline - determined by any ongoing interest/fixation by the general public / consumers of such media content.

2. The media and public activities of H&M themselves and what messages / content / activities they choose to align themselves with - eg business, philanthropic, positive royal associations, negative royal associations or neutral/zero royal associations.

3. The actions and words of the RF directly and indirectly. Any response to continuing allegations that may come out - claim and counterclaim etc could fuel media wars for ever.

Depends on everyones next moves. Whether they can show reconciliation publicly or at least dignified silence and acceptance and get on positively with their new roles / lives or whether they are reactive and vindictive.

I hope for all of them they can give each other space if that’s what’s needed in the coming months and years.

OP I am really puzzled by your question

I thought Meghan was the best thing ever for the monarchy.

but

1. they left
2. they have seemed more important this week, not less.

I think they were very verbal in their admiration for Her Majesty, and not so for Harry's father, brother and the rest of his family.

This is bound to have consequences on how they are included and perceived.

Setting aside Harry’s actions etc etc, just looking at who will appear at functions etc, does it not create a bit of a gap without them? The kids are going to be at school for the next 10 years or so, realistically it’s only going to be a photo op here or there during this time.

That leaves C&C (both in their 70s), K&W, S&E, Anne (72). Anyone else? I don’t know how much will have to be cut down on? Or is that the plan anyway?

They asked to leave after all.

I'm surprised that they have done as much as they have TBH.

I would assume the plan would be the have the core members be Charles, his siblings (and not their children), William and Harry (and their families)
I suppose then, as Williams family grows, Harry and his family would naturally fade away as the next generation take over, same as Princess Margaret's family did, and I expect as Williams cousins will as time passes.

I think a 96 year old lady didn’t have the energy to deal with the fallout of their petulant behaviour, so they were sort of on the fringe, allowed back every now and again. They also only said nice things about her.

The badmouthing of Charles and William is likely to mean they are left out completely, rather than hanging around on the fringe, ready to dip in and out as they wish.

Charles and William will be more ruthless about their treatment than a sweet old Granny. So H&M will be left out of more and more, and become less and less important

@Readinginthesun is Beatrice now a counsellor of the state as well?

Harry and Meghan have moved up in precedence ahead of Anne and Sophie now so in one way they're more important. But William is next so I guess he's even more important and the disparity grows.

They will naturally become less important as has been pointed out. They have also not had new titles bestowed on them, unlike William and Catherine. Had they continued as working royals, perhaps they would also have received additional / new titles. Am unsure on this one though.

Wouldn't it be Princess Anne rather than Andrew?

No. The change to let women inherit over their younger brothers only took effect from the current generation (so Charlotte before Louis and Beatrice’s daughter before any hypothetical brothers). Anne still comes after Charles, Andrew and Edward in that order. Each person’s children then inherit before it goes back up a generation.

I think Peter Phillips is older than Zara anyway but it does mean that of Edward’s children, James comes before Louise.

Also, it’s each person’s children then their children, so William, George, Charlotte, Louis, Harry, Archie, Lilibet, Andrew, Beatrice, Sienna, Eugenie, August, Edward, James, Louise, Anne, Peter then his children, Zara then her children. It then goes all the way back up to Margaret (if she was still alive) and then her children etc.

I think if they hadn’t quit the royal life, they would have been given plenty to do and had a high profile. Now the Queen has gone, Charles and William have an increased workload and I think the plan was Harry would share it.

They opted not to be working royals but they still want the fame and the privilege and the money. 😅 and the English police ready to service them when they please 🫡 . We have bigger problems to police than this seriously (not to mention the extra cost for the UK taxpayer as they are suing the government for not being able to access police escort services at the earliest sign of a private jet landing in Farnborough).

Out of this real world. Back to your £11m Montecito home please soon!

Harry isn’t less important now. Press optics may seem that way, but he’s actually more important.

He’s never been second in line to the throne, like Princess Margaret, only third and lower, but he’s currently in line to be Regent if anything makes George king before he’s 18.

Things will be somewhat different now, but when George VI took the throne and his brother, the Duke of Gloucester, was in line to be regent it caused a large impact on his life. He had to be in the UK when the king was not
and basically be on standby to drop everything to temporarily do the technical bits of Kingship until his niece came of age.He had moved to Australia with his family shortly before and had to return.

And it’s going to interesting at the coronation, as Harry has pay homage to his father, kneeling before him and swearing loyalty

This is how royalty works.

He has moved down the line of succession.
He resigned his working position within the family. He has no role within it.
He no longer represents the country.

He is there only because he is the grandson of the woman who died, which is entirely right.

Even the non-working royals Beatrice and Eugenie do more in the line of duty and represent the crown and country at public events. Harry does not.

I didn't realise that. Presumably he'll have a prior engagement! Or lie?

That may change at the stroke of a pen by the new King. Do you really want any to risk it with Harry as Regent

Given that the next option is Andrew, yes I think Harry is a far better option.

The thing is William is now quite literally a heartbeat away from the crown. Charles is 73 obviously it’s possible he will go on for years but he may not, I suspect no more than ten at most. I reality has probably hit hard this week , I think Charles will try to buy the Sussex’s silence at least for a bit, he needs to get established as King, it’s going to be hard enough without scandalous memoirs and whatever, however I think Harry missed being ‘someone’ more than he cares to admit .