Harry has a lot to answer for.

[Corcory]

I think Harry has a lot to answer for in this whole debacle. He's a 35 year old man brought up as a Royal who should know how the whole thing works and how to ensure his wife is fully educated in the rules and regs. of being a Royal. She was his wife, why on earth was she going to HR at the Palace for help with mental health problems? Harry has loads of experience and the knowledge of where to get help, what on earth was he doing? Harry knows full well that there is a rule about not being given a royal title when it comes to Archie. Why didn't he explain this to Megan? It has absolutely nothing to do with Archie's skin colour. Why is Harry moaning about having their security removed given his father paid £4m for their security after the tax payer stopped paying after they moved to California?
It is not the Royal family's decision whither or not someone has The Metropolitan Police fly over to do security duties.
Prince William sorted the press out when they were making disparaging comments about Kate, why didn't he put his foot down as his brother did?

I’ve no doubt they could buy an inch square bit of Dumbarton as well to make them a legitimate Lord

If that isn’t grand enough he could be the Lord of the Moon. They could afford to buy a fair patch of that.

He could be Archie, King of the Moon if they did a tell more or two.

But I don't see them why break the rules for Williams children?

In 2013 Parliament abolished the rule of primogeniture meaning that the first born child of William and Catherine would be the heir regardless of sex . However under the 1917 rules only the eldest grandson of the Prince of Wales would be a Prince . Consequently if Charlotte had been born first she would have been heir to the throne but not a princess and her younger brother would have been a Prince and still ranked higher even though he was not the heir.

This was clearly nonsensical so they changed it so that all William’s children would have the title Prince or Princess to avoid the illogicality described above .

@HeadLikeAFuckinOrange

The comment was probably something to do with the newspaper articles really being insane if they had a really dark skinned baby, and could H deal with that? Not great, but it does fit with someone expressing concern.

I agree, I think there's a manipulating of context going on here.

This is what I’ve been saying on other threads. I don’t see this as a bad comment tbh... rather a sad observation. Diana was incredibly upset that the paternity of Harry was publicly questioned. And still is. If William did indeed say something like this, there is context and a reason.

@intheenddoesitreallymatter

We’re commenting disparagingly on something we know nothing about.

I imagine they aren’t allowed to leave without a team of security. It’s not as though she can pop to yo sushi for a catch up with the girls. Every move they made I imagine would have to be preapproved because it would be very dangerous to go unaccompanied.

Additionally we have no idea what happened behind closed doors. Harry could have gone to his father and brother endlessly. I’m not sure how their medical care works but I think being hospitalised is very last resort. I imagine a palace doctor would have given her some anti depressants and told her to get on with it.

I feel meghan’s reaction to becoming a royal is very typical to what a normal working/middle class person would feel at such a limitation of freedom. Yes she’s got lovely clothes and she lives in a palace but you can still be stripped of your liberties and happiness when you live in a castle.

It's apparent YOU know nothing about them, from your repeated errors above. Princess Anne, Prince Andrew, Prince Edward , and all their children, AND Prince Charles and Prince William married normal middle class working people who go out and about their social lives in pubic, drive themselves , pop into shops etc. Diana and Sarah did, Kate Anne and Camilla do. So Meghan is just the last in a long chain of non-royals who married in, Harry knows them all. It's totally non-credible that Meghan had no idea what to expect, and neither of them a had access to seek advice or support.

Harry and Meghan did not live in either a palace or a castle. They lived in a large very private country house which had been done up to their wishes at vast expense paid for by the taxpayer.

RF healthcare is provided by the top medical professionals in Britain in every specialty. They use hospitals whenever necessary. That's where Meghan got all her maternity care. Before his engagement to Meghan, Harry spoke publically about having had years of therapy for emotional problems; he actively promoted seeking help for MH problems so of course he knew what was available, where and how to get it, before and while meghan was ill.

I'm a lone voice here I think. I have no interest in the Royal Family, I think they are a COMPLETELY outdated concept along with all the formalities and fawning and just don't understand what they are FOR in this day and age. I get that some people like the whole celebrity aspect but even then they aren't actually terribly high profile, are they, as some are claiming on here. They turn up to this or that, say a few words and meet some people but it's all just pleasantries, essentially, and no-one actually really knows who they ARE. They are playing a part, putting a public face on - always. It's a pantomime really. I mean, why the fuck should someone curtsey to another human in the year 2021?!?! It's totally mind-boggling that this is still encouraged.

I don't agree with doing things for the sake of tradition just because "that's the way it's always been done". The bestowing of titles is a farce. I think H & M went into it believing that they could be the modern face of the RF, along with William and Kate. That was the narrative at the time in the media.

Personally I think the snooty advisers behind the scenes at the palace didn't like outsiders coming in and wanting to do things differently. I think old Liz and the others are so indoctrinated themselves that they probably just go along with the party line from all the advisers, following protocol. Probably thinking outside the box or modernising isn't even given head space and I think the palace missed a trick at not encouraging modernising. They seem to be clinging on to an outdated institution for dear life rather than embracing change. The queen should have stepped down years ago and let the youngsters be the public face of the royal family. She's got the mistaken belief that it's her duty to go on for as long as she's alive. Again, that's the indoctrination speaking.

The relationship with the Press is also outdated and embarrassing and we all know that there are stories the press are suppressing in exchange for the RF just playing the game and giving them what they want ie. being paraded now and again for the paps.

I watched all the interview out of curiosity really to see how they would present themselves and to watch the public and media response. It's been interesting. Regardless of how they went about things, I came out thinking they were right to get out, and I don't blame them one bit.

I think the royal family should seize this an opportunity to totally overhaul itself.

I think it's untrue to suggest the RF hasn't modernised - it has, but at it's own pace. It's said there is evolution, not revolution with regard to the RF.

it is your right to regard the RF as antiquated. I rather like having them. The strongest democracies around the world are constitutional monarchies like ours.

What the monarchy is not set up for is those who think they're there for revolution. It simply doesn't work like that.

I agree that H&M could have been great for the RF - but that wasn't M's end game. it was celebrity at all costs, attain WW fame and then back to Hollywood.

They lived in a large very private country house which had been done up to their wishes at vast expense paid for by the taxpayer

Incorrect.
They paid it all back.

@CurlyhairedAssassin
What a great post. I wish I'd written it. Totally agree.
I think H&M were a chance to change the RF and they blew it.

Sorry... I mean the RF had the chance and they blew it.

Why can't they modernise? Why can't they update and change things. It's so bloody archaic and antiquated.
We need transparency on financial matters, no one should be afforded any grace and favour apartments or privy purse monies unless they are in line to the throne, i.e. Charles, W&K etc.

Change is needed, we are brainwashed as a nation, and the RF are stuck in the mud. And yes the Queen should have abdicated 20 years ago. Of course she has been a wonderful asset but that time has passed.

H & M’s advisers included Australian and an American, and a Ghanaian equerry.

So fairly diverse group.

Not white British old men as her friends would have you believe

I think if you don't like the concept of a RF, you're going to find fault in all of it.

I like it. is it perfect? No.

But better that than a republic in my view.

Maybe the Queen should move over however her vow was to serve her whole life.
I'm not sure what the answer is.

However I have been given a glimpse of what happens when an elected government has too much power and not a strong enough opposition.
Having a Monarch and a second chamber of government avoids one or two people having too much power.

I want them to stay.

Charles had the right idea that it needed slimming, are people really fussed when the Duke of Gloucester turns up to open stuff?

But they have an ability to influence and make changes in ways that an elected government just can't. I'm thinking the current highlights on MH, but Diana did well with AIDs, and the DoE awards and the Princes Trust are great things.

Agree with all of the above.

British public still onside with supporting the monarchy.

Those who would do away with it would need to ally themselves to a political party advocating for change and then approach it that way.

I think it's unlikely to happen in my lifetime.
There have been times over the past 150 years when the monarch has been v unpopular but it manages to reinvent itself and the public fall back in love with them again.

@Roussette

They lived in a large very private country house which had been done up to their wishes at vast expense paid for by the taxpayer

Incorrect.
They paid it all back.

@CurlyhairedAssassin
What a great post. I wish I'd written it. Totally agree.
I think H&M were a chance to change the RF and they blew it.

Note the past tenses. That was their home before they left UK.

They  only paid for it  AFTER they stepped down from royal duty and left the UK.

oneglass
Their advisers may be from a diverse group. But do they actually listen to them? So many times I’ve read that they only listen to themselves.

hopefully they do listen. W&K will be alot more in tune I think too...

The Queen and Prince Charles have been very active in keeping the public on side. That is one of the major reasons why Harry is not getting UK funded security. The public just wouldn't stand for it.

Just thinking of the Queen, while she is still at the top I think Charles must be doing a fair chunk of the work she did. Hence W&K are picking up more of the other stuff.

Someone made a comment that Edward would end up becoming more high profile in time, and I think so too. 4 out the current top 8 are all well beyond normal retirement age.

are people really fussed when the Duke of Gloucester turns up to open stuff?

A minor royal, possibly Princess Alexandra maybe?, rocked up to the hospital where my DH was volunteering on a musical scheme - he had no idea who he was, had to Google her when he got home. But he said it gave everyone a lift - she was totally charming, spoke to everyone & made them feel like they were contributing something useful to society. So it worked for him.

Didn't the D of E say some time ago, "If they decide don't want us we'll go quietly"?
Maybe his heart was never in it, but he's quietly walked behind for decades.

that's a lovely story @ScribblingPixie.

And therein lies the RF's power. Wouldn't be quite the same with a here today, gone tomorrow Presidency (ie if we were a republic).

@2bazookas, PC married an aristocrat. PD was not middle class.

What will happen to PH when they split up?

If he keeps his nose clean the Palace will do a PR exercise and have him back as a working Royal.

But what about the children. The unborn one is likely not to have a British passport even.

The children will be very minor Royals. Both entitled to a British passport as children of a British national, exactly the same as any other child of a British citizen born abroad.

For the people saying that Meghan didn't have a clue what she was getting into

Watch their engagement interview.
They both said they have had talks about what is expected of her etc etc