Our Flag Means Death: Thread 2. Still utterly brilliant and we are still obsessed!

[TriceratopsRocks]

Ahoy there mateys! Hop aboard our ‘safe space ship’ thread 2, where we can continue to wax lyrical about our favourite show.

If you haven’t yet seen Our Flag Means Death, what are you waiting for? Do go watch it (on BBC iPlayer) and then come back here and join us.

You may have heard that this is a comedy about pirates and think that's not for you. But it’s actually about self-discovery, healing and found-family with a love story at its heart. It does begin as a sort of pirate workplace comedy, but in episode 4 the tone changes and that’s where the main story really starts. The joint leads are both damaged by abusive backgrounds and think they want what the other has. The show is about their healing and their respective journeys. It’s tender, romantic, funny, emotionally intelligent and utterly refreshing. It subverts genre expectations. There is comedy, absurdity and a good amount of heartbreak and despair - sometimes in the same scene! The acting is outstanding (Taika Waititi and Rhys Darby especially). But the writing, music, costumes, sets, the sheer attention to detail – for a show with only 18 half-hour episodes it is still keeping us talking, a full thread and many re-watches later. Can you tell how much I love it?

If you think this might appeal, do watch it, then come back and talk to us. It would be lovely if more were to join our crew. But be aware it's a show that needs time. The 2nd lead doesn’t arrive until the end of episode 3 and that’s when the main story starts. You need to give it at least 4 episodes. It then took me several more to fully appreciate what I was watching but then I was hooked - and had to immediately watch it all over again. If you like Good Omens, What We Do in the Shadows, Ghosts or even Bridgerton, this might be the show for you.

(I’ve kept this spoiler free, but if you scroll down you will no doubt find many, so beware!)

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/telly_addicts/5008593-our-flag-means-death-its-utterly-brilliant-and-i-am-obsessed?reply=135294204

I keep alternating between sort of sad but resigned about the cancellation to still being annoyed about it. Then this popped up on my Facebook this evening which made me really annoyed all over again!

It's just so frustrating to not know anything about what was planned for the arc for S3!
Ed and Stede's wedding was a given. And possibly going after Ricky somehow. But as for the rest? We can only guess. I can imagine DJ continuing the nods to real events we got in S1 and S2 (e.g. the RL Blackbeard really did ditch all of Stede's stuff and maroon his crew). So we may have got an alliance of pirates or a blockade of Charles Town. But I definitely don't want any more historical accuracy than that! We need them to keep their happy ending.

But yes, as long as they're together, they'll be OK. I think they're past the 'should we, shouldn't we' stage and have reached the 'how do we make this work' stage. They haven't fixed each other, because they can only fix themselves, but with the commitment they've made to each other (oh how I would've loved a wedding!) they have a solid basis for that. They'll create their own wonderful, messy blend of masculinity in the process. It will be bumpy though and there will be plenty of whims in all directions along the way, which would've been a joy to watch.
And💯this, @lizziesaurusx . DJ said they were together now and he wouldn't be splitting them up again. And we were definitely getting that wedding!

Re WWDITS, I can't believe they wrote a proper script and then didn't actually show it to any of the actors! I mean, the whole thing is basically improv - it's a competely bonkers way to make a movie. But yes, there were some properly funny laughing out loud bits, and then other bits that were... less so. I did like it a lot though and Taika was particuarly brilliant in it.

And thank you also @lizziesaurusx for that 'Boy' interview. It was really interesting, although I did keep getting distracted by Taika's eyes👀and his beautiful face. I've never seen Eagle vs Shark but it sounds interesting. A romantic comedy that isn't very romantic and often depressing; sounds very Taika!

On a separate note, that Rhys video I posted yesterday is dangerous - please be warned. Rhys and his "pineapple fritters" would not stay out of my head this afternoon, which was unfortunate as there was a moment when I supposed to be being solemn in public but was barely managing to keep from smiling! I think what I need is desensitisation therapy. Do you think watching it another 100 times might work?

@lizziesaurusx @TriceratopsRocks

I’ve never been fussed about Ed and Stede having a ‘wedding’. They’re married the moment they swap clothes and rings in 1.4. They’ve always been married. They’re married in every time, every age, every universe. They transcend all of that. Marriage is for mere mortals. And how do you even marry yourself?

I watched ‘Boy’ last night as wanted to see what the fuss was all about.

I get the fuss. God, it’s stunning and heartbreaking. But as you’ve all noted, some hope. The focalisation through the children’s lenses and worldview is so well done. The stories children tell themselves in order to survive. And the pity of children begetting children. How do you raise a child when you never grew up yourself? Of course, ‘Boy’ is also the father.

The Dukes of Hazzard fail killed me 🤣

Every Taika film now is also spot the Pop-Pop.

Hehe ok @MrsJellybee . Remember we already had 1.9 too and the signing of the register 😁. You are, of course, absolutely correct in every word you just said, but nevertheless I did still want a wedding. Even if for purely selfish reasons! I wanted to see them make their vows to each other in public (ideally all dressed up, with Ed in a fine fabric and Stede holding a bunch of those flowers he so liked as a boy). But mainly I wanted the public declaration, because I think making their vows in front of the crew would have helped their healing - helped them to properly believe the things they still need to accept about themselves. And I wanted it for the crew. It would have been good for the crew to see them get married, after all they went through because of those two being unable to recognise or talk about their feelings. And they all deserved a good party afterwards 🎉.

Every Taika film now is also spot the Pop-Pop.

And the three I've seen so far, Cohen has tried to beat up Taika in every one 😂

@TriceratopsRocks I totally get on one level wanting the wedding. I just also wouldn’t want Jenkins to bow to the fandom and stick Ed in a blue silk dress ffs. Leather dress is fine. Chignon… eyeliner… wearing his big gun…🤤

I feel the same about the dancing. I’m 50/50…

Whilst the fanfic Celestial Bodies left me hollow, I completely understand the concept of Stede and Ed being the fabric of existence and all that’s left at the end of the universe. Time and Space don’t need a matelotage. 🤣

Oh, and yes to Cohen Holloway. It must be in his contract to beat Taika up every movie.

@TriceratopsRocks all I can say is it would be interesting to see what the YouTube algorithm did as a result.

Ads for the pineapple marketing board?!

I totally get on one level wanting the wedding. I just also wouldn’t want Jenkins to bow to the fandom and stick Ed in a blue silk dress ffs.

God no @MrsJellybee . But I don't think DJ would actually do that. And it'd definitely be a step too far for 18th century Barbados. I just see him in something that's not his leathers, but reminiscent of them. Softer, still with purple. Something that ties together Blackbeard and Ed. I'd let Stede get married in his brown leather trousers and teal shirt combo because that is 🔥, but ideally I want them both in something that brings together all aspects of their personalities, if that makes sense? I'd trust Gypsy Taylor to get it right.

Maybe I should try it. I'll report back 😁

@TriceratopsRocks The Prince-inspired clothes in 1.5 were okay for Ed. He definitely needs some frills for his ‘wedding’. Stede needs something showy too. He was born to wear silk. I just think Ed showed his feelings and commitment to Stede publicly when he burned down the Caribbean. 🔥🥰

@MrsJellybee I did think about Ed's 1.5 outfit with Stede's 1.3 white silk number because both those outfits were gorgeous. Now there's a thought. That outfit of Stede's was positively bridal. And it's what he was wearing when he and Ed first met. More symbolism for us to enjoy 😁 (especially with the angels singing along and Ed in his leathers and his big gun highlighted so prominently in that position).

But I'm not sure they'd go as fancy as 1.3/1.5 for their big day post S2. If they'd had a wedding at the end of S1 definitely those outfits would work. But after S2 I want something that better reconciles their whole personalities. So I still want something that's a cross between the leathers and the posh party looks, just in a fine fabric. And updo-Ed. I'm just fussy, I guess 😁 And demanding.

But curses!!! I've been trying to forget about Celestial Bodies! It's one of the most depressing things I've ever read. I was just flat and sad for ages after that one. Hollow is a good word. From now on I'm going to stick my fingers in my ears and sing "la, la-di-la, la" every time I see it mentioned, to try and make it go away 😁🎶🎶🎶🎶🎶🎶😂

I shan’t mention CB again other than to say it has strangely stuck with me despite me not liking it. I wonder why that is.

Here’s Stede’s blond eye-lashes to cheer you up. He’s so pretty.

He certainly is! Actually what I need now is the Rhys Darby legs thread. And maybe some pineapple fritters...

OK so I just got totally distracted by the legs thread and seem to have lost half an hour. Oops!

But thank you for the pics. Here's one back in return

My sweet summer child Those of us a year further in may have a smidgeon more <cough 113 pages cough>

Glad you're all enjoying the recs

Also, for those of you who like a bit of angst, sweet kids, remarkably little gender bollocks (which I find so American and jarring), Not Pickles

Also by the same author who wrote the Clerkenwell asset raider fic and collaborated on Work Experience, Continue Making Progress

And a short but rather lovely one I think from the 7.3 Miles author Breathe the Moment Down

Hehe I'll bet you do! Are you into 3 figures yet? If so, how do you keep track of it all? I'm doing what I can to keep mine manageable by deleting anything from my history that I'm not bothered about reading again. I bookmark my favourites for ease of finding (public recs for my top favourites and private bookmarks for 2nd tier favourites), because I re-read my favourite fics a lot. And I subscribe to authors when I like several of their works (or like Shearwater, when I want a notification for the next chapter!). If there are any other tips or tools you know of that will help keep it all manageable please do tell. I haven't looked into Collections yet, for instance. I guess they could be useful for sorting fics into categories?

And thanks for the new recs, I'll check them out 👍😁

Yep, 113 pages of history. Ridiculous 😃

I bookmark the ones I enjoy, have 5 pages of bookmarks. I subscribe to writers rather than fics generally, and usually check in on new fics a couple of times a week outside of subscriptions (exclusively Ed/Stede, no alpha omega bollocks, nope to anything with trans or gender in the tags, no mpreg, no age regression, no weird shit - necrophilia I ask you 🙄, generally no rape/non con, generally no Ed/Stede death unless really well done)

Basically I gave up all pretence of being normal and balanced 😃

Normal and balanced? Hah! I left that behind months ago 🤣

Do you never delete stuff from your history? I can't imagine getting to that number of pages and ever being able to find something again. That's why I've been deleting the less enjoyable (to me) fics - so I can find things again more easily. I'll have to have a play with collections. That might help.

Just bookmark them in your browser, @TriceratopsRock? You could do them by theme, by author...come on, find your inner Stede!

😁 Heh! I actually don't bookmark any AO3 stuff in my browser because DD sometimes uses my phone, and wanders off with it. There are fics I really wouldn't want her finding. I always delete my browser history too, for the same reason. So my phone remains 'clean' and my organisation is limited to AO3 tools. It means I've no trace of any of the fics I read and enjoyed in the 6-ish weeks before I got my AO3 login, unless I remembered the title or the author. And sadly I have the memory of a goldfish 🐟🐠🐡.

There’s some pretty, er, niche stuff on there for sure. My search for good non Stede/Ed stuff didn’t bear much fruit unfortunately.

I watched Act of Grace yesterday again and I still don’t see a marriage in that scene - at least not a consensual one. Stede hasn’t conceptualised his connection to Ed as love yet, he still needs Mary to show him the light. And Ed may see it more as a marriage but I feel at this point he is wanting to save Stede AND wanting a way out of piracy.

I really like your recommendations pages back. I also like your list of filter exclusions. Exactly mine. Mpreg? 🤮I’ve lived a sheltered life.

I’m reading the glory hole one. I was a wuss and put it off, but it’s fantastic. I’ve laughed so much. And now I’m wiping away sad tears. Stede is spot on, again. Need to finish it as need to know it ends well.

I meant on a proper computer. Firefox with the auto memory delete on and a password for the PC itself!

As I concur no-one wants their DC accidentally reading smut.

Not an option either. Everyone in the family uses 'my' PC. Phone subterfuge is the only way to go. It's mostly fine with AO3 bookmarks. But I will look at collections at some point soon, so I have a proper system before it becomes unmanageable.