The Traitors S2 - THE AFTERMATH

[MaggieFS]

Discuss!

Yes this, they didn’t think they were all faithfuls. If Mollie did, why would she initially have voted for Harry?

I do think Harry showed he never gave a shit about Mollie though the way he rubbed it in that he had always been a traitor and then “I hope Mollie didn’t hear that” when he was saying he was the best traitor in the world. Unpleasant. There’s no way he’ll give her the steam off his piss far less any money

If that had happened, it would have been two votes each and they would have tossed a coin. If that still resulted in Harry going out and revealing he was a traitor, I suspect that Jaz would still have voted to banish because he had his suspicions about Andrew, and there's a better chance that Mollie would have voted for Andrew.

@Choux I think what made it hard for Evie was that it seemed to be Mollie & Harry that she was closest to of the final 5. I was shouting at the TV for Jaz to follow her when she left the room in tears in the morning but instead Mollie did.

If anyone wants to discuss Aus S2 ( which is now on iPlayer) there's a spoiler thread

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/telly_addicts/4991734-australian-traitors-season-2-spoilers-spoilers?page=2

You will be shouting at the TV!

@MotherofGorgons you can always set up a thread to discuss other series spoilers. Several people on these threads have said they may watch other seasons so it's not fair to spoil them here.

Anyone listening to Claud on BBC2?

Song choices on point - so far we've had Poker Face and Love the way you Lie

I thought he would go for Harry first too. I guess he figured that that would make a 50:50 vote split which might be risky, so he was banking on Mollie recognising the bleeding obvious when Harry voted to end and Jas voted to continue.

Or Jaz & Mollie would have had to vote again like when it was a 3-way split earlier on. And then the coin toss if it was still stale mate

Either way I think Jaz would have been more likely to vote Andrew then as he suspected him too, rather than Mollie voting for Harry.

Which I think she did, but still voted the wrong way in the end

They weren't allowed any discussion about the banishment vote, so Jaz never had the chance to say anything like this.

I just can’t feel sympathy for Mollie. Why go on a game show, where the clue is in the title and put all your trust in one person? Harry won because he stayed laser focused on the task in hand.

Jas - brilliant player, just not bold enough to speak up and was trying to survive by lurking in the shadows but that only protects you for so long. Zach was the same as him, but he was very vocal about his suspicions and it got him murdered.

It reminds me of the early days of Big Brother when people were outraged that some housemates went in with game plans. You’re not here to make friends! As Mollie discovered.

They have a decent amount of psychological testing before they enter - and they're cautious about people who apply; they prefer to find players from poker tournaments and strategy games and the like, so they're more likely to be able to play the game and cope with the pressure.

Harry played well. Sure, it was opportunistic, but you're never going to be able to formulate a game plan and stick to it all the way through a game that relies so much on all the players... So you have to be opportunistic and think on your feet, and he did that.

I think he annoys people more than he would because of the photos of him in private jets and the like; which is interesting because they are mostly from his girlfriend's Instagram - he doesn't post often on his own - and she is a pretty successful model.

Paul felt he had the gameplan down, but forgot to win over enough of the people. Harry was opportunistic with his game plan but had the support of a lot more people. Jaz was great but didn't have courage in his convictions, or any relationships to rely on. He didn't really have anyone's ear.

Brilliant series!

It reminds me of the early days of Big Brother when people were outraged that some housemates went in with game plans.

You do need Craig dancing and singing into the mirror "It's only a game-show, it's only a game-show" don't you?

Jaz was great but didn't have courage in his convictions, or any relationships to rely on.

He was burned early on when he raised suspicions about Paul and then suddenly everyone was saying that Jaz was being suspicious because Paul was both popular and manipulative.

And if you have courage in your convictions like Zach, you're basically setting yourself up to be murdered.

It's a difficult one.

Thanks @Stowickthevast I will go on the spoiler threads or start one.

Jas could justifiably be really pissed with Mollie because he assumed she would have an ounce of logical thinking and make the right decision.

It's to his credit that he focussed more on his excellent gameplay than being narked at mollie's terrible decision making causing him to lose out

So glad I’m not the only one who noticed this. There was definite chemistry between Mollie and Harry, and loyalty from Mollie that went beyond a friendship bond. I can’t remember him ever mentioning a girlfriend, even at the final meal when they were all opening up about what winning would mean to them. He played her like a fiddle. Fair play to Harry, he deserved his win; Jas, in not speaking up didn’t play well. I’d have liked Jas to win too.

Harry, Mollie and Jaz up on Claudia's show in a minute.

I think most of them did. Especially compared to last year's lot. Still having got over the ridiculous behaviour from Wilf from last year. Everything about him was so dislikable.

Which is probably why "the blondes" got labelled as boring and undeserving. They didn't get neurotic. Evie seemed especially calm - and Claudia mentioned other player choose to speak to her so evidently she was consistenty calm.

I would like to have seem more "in plain sight" task for the traitors. Harry was so rarely challenged and i don't think ever challenged without forwarning he would be - till Anfrew said his name at the fire pit.

He therefore hand the upper hand.at all times. One or two more plain sight tasks would mean he night have lost his cool - meaning the "fahf-fulls" might have something to work off.

I found it very uncomfortable viewing and felt like I was watching somebody be coercively controlled. Hard lesson for Molllie but hopefully one that will take her through life and help her dodge manipulative men.

I think it gets to a point where it isn't about the money, but your sense of self. Jas has been totally vindicated so he's probably disappointed but essentially fine. Mollie is probably more upset about the betrayal than losing the money. Even if Harry split it with her, which he won't, she still has that feeling of being fooled, used and played, which Jas hasn't.

Did you ever watch Split or Steal on Goldenballs? The happiest players were always the ones where both had split, not where they'd stolen and won. They had half the money they would have had if they'd stolen, but they had mutual trust, support and goodwill of each other and as corny as it sounds, that really is worth more.

I'm on another forum and someone who's only watched the last 2 episodes is saying how disgusted they are people are celebrating Harry's victory because of the traits he showed 🙄

For a start you wouldn't have seen the full picture if not watching it all

Secondly ITS A GAME SHOW. He couldn't have it where both he and Mollie won because they were on opposing sides. I think he was starting to incline towards sharing with Andrew, but Andrew put him under the bus first because he didn't trust him. I must be an awful person, because in the lead up to other traitors going under it, each time I said "they need to go under the bus"

I think unconscious bias was at play - if Harry wasn't a young nice sweet looking young man and instead was a shaven headed tattooed "hard" looking man (for example) who played EXACTLY the same game as Harry, would Mollie have been as trusting of him

Also he's in the army, so as people have said, was treating this as a mission. The others were on the opposing side so had to be seen as the "enemy" in the GAME SHOW. I've watched SAS who dares wins and Ant and co often say about how focused they get on their missions

I don't think he was as awful as people are making out, as he was torn about voting Johnny, I don't think he'd have voted him if the others hadn't, but again he was competition and then was a good point to get rid as it wasn't just him voting for him. It would have been interesting for him to recruit Johnny, who I liked, but there wasn't the chance to. He was torn about Mollie too as I think he genuinely liked her, however again, it's a gameshow and they were on opposing sides, they couldn't both win and she was the one who still blindly trusted him despite 2 MASSIVE hints. He even said at the end how he was looking forward to going back to being normal Harry. He was on his mission and now it ended.

Lastly it's a game show, I must be awful as I identified when I'd put people under the bus as a traitor, and lastly 93k is a massive amount of money to "normal" people let's not forget these are all normal people, not celebrities/influencers (good) so it is a life changing amount of money, and financial security. Yes Harry has an influencer girlfriend but if I'm his family I'd be saying to put a decent chunk in savings or on a house, as you don't know what the future holds. What is he's discharged from the army due to an accident - we've seen how little help our ex servicemen get.

Lastly yes I would put someone I'd known 2 weeks under the bus if it was between them and me getting 90k!!! I must be an awful person according to the other forum!

Rant over, dons tin hat! 😬

@LeatherJacketWedding Jas did speak up, but obviously had to balance this with remaining sufficiently under the radar so as not to be murdered. There was a clear plan to murder the more vocal and opinionated players (with a sprinkling of 'neutral' murders to throw people off the scent)

It's rubbish to say Jas didn't play well - it was a fine line to tread and when the other Faithfuls shut him down (because they weren't thinking as logically as he was) he was in the difficult position of having to keep his head down enough to stay in the game. If Jas had been more forceful in his views earlier, it's highly likely he'd have been murdered- and then people would have criticised him for not play

I didn't take Zach's comment on Uncloaked as a spoiler - remember it's pre recorded so they would just edit anything out. I thought he was referring to the fact that he had had several different theories that had been wrong and Faithfuls had been banished as a result.

Not paying well

Playing not paying!!

Mollie and Claudia discussing how she is right now and adamant that she is fine.