Anyone watched the shamina begum documentary on bbc 2 ?

[hellobethyname]

Just watching it now

I've changed my mind . She was a child , groomed , no idea what she was getting into .

I don't think we should demonise one child forever . There are much bigger threats out there that people don't even realise.

So when girls 15 yo girls get groomed here by Asian gangs everyone runs to their defence.

Did they know what they were doing at 15YO? Absolutely not.

Were they victims? Absolutely yes.

But when a 15YO gets groomed to join and terrorist organisation does she know what she was doing ? All of a sudden it's an "Absolutely yes" and these 15YO had to mental capacity and know how of an adult and did know what they were doing 🤯

We all know that even at the age of 15, brains are still developing. THEY ARE CHILDREN.

Those that don't want to hear her out or give her a chance are IMO selectively empathetic and borderline racist.

The baby was a British citizen.

She is probably less of a threat than half the people here in bail hostels .

I’m not even clear what she has actually done. What role has she played in terrorism (eg did she make bombs etc). I don’t feel like I’ve seen anything specific about what threat she poses.

Really? Where was it born? What nationality was its father? Where physically in the world was it? What should the UK have done?

I was involved in some of the grooming gangs prosecutions .

If I said the girls knew what they were doing - at 15 - knew they were going to flats for sex in repayment for drugs and alcohol and some version of attention what would you say ?
Call for my job ? Public hanging? Sacked ?

A child of 15 does not understand the consequences of their choices at 15 and can reflect as an adult that they were entirely wrong , duped , groomed , brainwashed .

Begum is no different. And could be managed here . Perfectly safely . More so than many others .

The government confirmed at the time they stripped her of her citizenship thag the baby would retain its citizenship (originally gained through being born to a British parent). I’m not sure if matters where the baby was born does it?

I think the Uk government should have tried to arrange for the baby to be returns to the UK from the camp.

So, so sad.

They may have known they were going to do x to get y, but as PPs have said, they are still children at 15. Making stupid decisions they will likely come to regret.

I think society could do with being far more compassionate myself.

Also, it makes me mad that my taxes are spent so badly - I.e. not rehabilitating prisoners properly etc.

It matters that the Baby was in a different country. The suggestion that the UK should have swooped in and rescued/collected/snatched a child is utterly ludicrous

Do you think they should just let them die?

Some of the interviews on that documentary are beyond the bloody pale .

Take a woman who's given birth days previously, who doesn't know what to say to stay safe , and ask her about the Manchester arena bombing .

Yeah good one . 👏👏.

This is a woman who doesn't know her arse from her elbow. Doesn't know what she can say or not say . She's lost two babies and just had a third , days previously.

Journalists are bloody vultures .
Awful.

I guarantee this lass would be less of a threat than anyone on the prevent program if allowed back to the uk . She's in the public eye . Like she's seriously gonna bomb a tube . ? The threats are from the ones we dont know
About .

I personally think we need to repatriate Shamima to the UK and deal with her here.

I want to feel more sympathy for her than I do as to me she comes across as arrogant, self satisfied and lacking in honesty and openness about her experience.

I want to feel a lot of sympathy for a young girl who I am confident went through some very harrowing experiences. But her personality on camera just seems disturbing.

I haven't watched it yet but am planning to watch it tomorrow. Totally agree with this comment. I imagine if a group of white females had made it to Syria the public attitude would have been totally different. They were vulnerable children who were brainwashed and groomed.

This^

A lot of the time I find also that people who are dead set against her being in the U.K. lack understanding around the process and manipulation that goes into grooming a child. I have worked with people who groom children and with children who have been groomed. When they talk about brainwashing, it is the truth, they have such little understanding and often by the time they do develop it a lot of damage has been done and it takes so much support to get back to normality.

I also find a lot of people who are '100% against her' also have some underlying racism that they've not reflected on,whether that is internalised racism or not...also elements of misogyny with her being called 'a little Bitch who knew what she was up to' etc

I was referring to citizenship, as that was what the comment I replied to what about. I’m not sure where the baby is born makes a difference to citizenship. a baby born in the UK is automatically a British citizen just because it is born here etc.

im not suggesting a baby be “snatched”. I am suggesting that we as a country should send aid when a British citizen is unsafe abroad…especially when that is a vulnerable baby.

Are you suggesting that if British citizens are in trouble abroad we should just leave them?

The decision to strip her of citizenship was broadcast on itv news as it was given to her as she cradled a newborn in her arms .

Then the journalist helpfully told her she'd done this .

Lovely . Makes me
Ashamed actually.

What an odd comment, this is not parallel in any way?

She SHOULD be punished but she should be dealt with by English authorities as she is British.

Sorry I meant a baby ISNT automatically a citizen of somewhere via being born there

I don't know what to make of her, but what a horror! Just imagine that was your 15YO.

Do you mean a British Citizen married to a foreign national who has been involved in terrorism and the murder of British citizens?

Yes, I think we should leave them to face justice in the country where they committed the offences.

All that stuff doesn’t affect the baby’s citizenship.

Not exactly the same thing but how many criminals in jail suddenly are remorseful when they are caught

I have seen it.
There is something I don't trust about her.
Yes,she was a child and was groomed into going.
And she had very tragic losses of babies.
I don't know. The fact she is not naming the Egyptian man. Says she never got any training. It's all a bit suspect.
I don't think she would be a threat if she came back because she would be put in prison.
I don't believe she is as innocent as she claims.
But why would she ever admit to anything? She probably knows very little. The women were treated badly. They won't have any level of intelligence.
It's a sad story.

Also what offences has she committed. Part of her not being returned means she also hasn’t actually been found guilty of anything.

@Blip Today 22:02

I personally think we need to repatriate Shamima to the UK and deal with her here.

I want to feel more sympathy for her than I do as to me she comes across as arrogant, self satisfied and lacking in honesty and openness about her experience.

I want to feel a lot of sympathy for a young girl who I am confident went through some very harrowing experiences. But her personality on camera just seems disturbing.

This.