Three Girls (BBC 9pm)

[ASauvingnonADay]

Looking forward to watching this tonight. Feel it might be one to watch with your teenagers..

Tizzy does that mean it's not true and it's made up. At the bottom of the list it says thanks to times and sikh community for the list is this fake news then?

Peter McLoughlin who wrote "Easy Meat" has a website with info on cases

www.pmclauth.com/sentenced/Grooming-Gang-Statistics/

I don't think this thread should be l

Rose If you click on all the links in the list, you will see that they take you to newspaper or BBC articles, so yes they are true.

Just because info is on an EDL site, doesn't make it untrue.

I don't want to click on links that may take meetings edl site though.

children no this thread is not about Asian grooming gangs it's about a television series depicting the real story of the Rochdale gang and the council and polices attitude towards CSE ten years ago.

However this makes us feel and however we decide to tackle it, using these cases for racist rhetoric is not ok. And it is important to point out that abusers come in all creeds and colours. There is no guide to what an abuser looks like, they can come from any level of society. If we typecast we do a disservice to all the victims whose perpetrators do not fall into those mounds.

*moulds not mounds

No, you don't need to. If you go back a couple of pages to the posts with the list of cases that Childrenofthestones posted, each case has a link to an article from elsewhere (often local press). You can click on those.

Not sure about that RoseandVioletCreams, there is an obvious bias in cases of Asian muslim men grooming young vulnerable white girls but it's not just Asian Muslims.

Its becoming obvious Childrenofthestones has an agenda. Their annoyance that posters are 'deflecting' by mentioning Saville when no one on the thread has is even mentionrd him, is very suggestive that they don't want attention to the fact white men abuse children too.

Yes GardenGeek. It's a disgrace.

I've just watched the first two parts. I'm so angry. I knew it happened and is still happening exactly as was portrayed but it's just so infuriating how these girls were/are treated. They were being treated like fully cooked, well rounded adults who had just decided one day to start drinking and hanging around with these "men"! Who trained these professionals?? I mean at the very least do they not remember being 13 and knowing so little about life and relationships let alone the context of a neglectful or abusive home life or the fact that one girl had very clear learning difficulties?? How can they treat those girls as if they had made anything like an informed decision to be in that situation. It's so fucking infuriating. I am so angry for them and for the girls right now who aren't being protected because of these stupid non thinkers. It's only going to get worse too without more funding cuts.

Personally, I'm just glad that someone has been collecting the data. And that some people have been less concerned about whether they will be called racists than in standing up for young girls in need of help.

Maybe WoodPigeonInFlight, but the collector should ideally be unbiased.

There's no denying that the likelihood of a grooming gang being Asian and Muslim is high, and that the reason why that is understood. But you also can't allow it to be used as an agenda; just as much as it can't mean anyone should be labelled racist for reporting these men

The reason the Three Girls didn't get the help they needed for so long, and the reason so many people are unaware of the scale of this problem (which is probably not helpful in preventing other children being abused) is that people have been scared to discuss and act on the issue for fear of being a branded a racist.

So it seems a shame if someone who has provided a lot of factual.information to this thread (all of which anyone can check from publically available sources) gets accused on this thread of "having an agenda".

Almost anyone who has tried to bring this issue to public attention in recent years has been called a racist/far-right for doing so. That is why we are where we are. People are scarred to discuss it openly.

So the choice really is to stop smearing as a racist everyone who tries to bring the issue to the public's attention, or to stop talking about it again and at least all be happy that no-one will call us a racist, if we really think that is the most important thing.

Personally, I know that being concerned about and having researched on and educated myself about this issue does not make me a racist.

Only just watched episode 1. Truly moving and impactful. Dread to think what is still to come.

Stones i mentioned Savile because his victims experienced the same misogyny AND classist attitudes when they reported it. THIS is your common denominator.

What did you think i was trying to do?!

The Sikh Awareness Society run by Mohan Singh who's interview on LBC I linked to earlier have some information on their website:

www.sasorg.co.uk/

Since this case the training in information sharing between professionals has vastly improved. Round here they're are MASHs (multi agency safeguarding) with processes in place to try and improve the situation. CSE still goes on and it's not a 'class issue' kids from every area and background are vulnerable. Professionally training on cse and related issues like missing and child protection is heavily invested in and though far from perfect I've not seen any child treated that way in the last few years. It did happen without a doubt in multiple cases through arrogance of professionals or ignorance or whatever other excuse but I honestly believe the situation and understanding has improved greatly. It's so sad that the victims in these cases were treated awfully and I hope they're never forgotten.

ineed I agree about the need for addressing the attitudes of the males involved.

I was reading a thread about female joggers receiving verbal abuse from men when out running; what have our boys and men learnt to think this is OK?

I have a ds and dd. They're still small but how do I even start to protect/educate them?

The reason 'we are here' is because vulnerable young girls from the wrong class are not believed because they are slags and not particularly important.

Yes there is the can't mention the elephant in the room about the race and religion of the gangs who groom because of the fear of being called racist.

But Stones is proving to have an agenda, the pretence she can't link the blog as she c&p the list (seeminly can't recall reading EDL website) and the fact she thinks mentioning sexual abuse by white men is 'deflecting'.

There's several articles linked in this thread discussing the profiles of grooming gangs (generally Asian Muslims) and individual groomers (generally white men religion not a factor).

Most common factor is once the victim is past puberty and from the wrong back ground she's probably not going to be listened to.

tizzy I agree with everything you have said.

As a society we should ALL take the blame for how those girls were viewed and treated.

Okay Tizzy I've been reading up on this issue for weeks now. I have used the EDL website, because it has a lot of info on it. Does that make me a racist or mean I have an agenda? No, it means I am looking for information where I can find it and sadly, there is not much about other than on far-right websites, for the reasons outlined above (that is, everyone else to scared of being called racist).

Don't you think that the reason stones didn't link to the EDL website is in fact to try to avoid exactly this. Which is that now, instead of discussing the issue of grooming gangs, we are discussing, and let's be frank about it, whether someone is racist or not?

In the nicest possible way, can't you see that you are doing exactly the same as has been happening for years. "Don't talk about it or you are a racist, have an agenda, have an axe to grind"

You were also wrong to accuse stones of bringing up Saville when no-one else had mentioned him - see HelenaDove's post.

Anyway, I'm going to leave the thread now but I think its a real shame if, the first time in a long while people feel able to discuss this dreadful and damaging issue, people who try to bring information and knowledge to the discussion are accused of all sorts with no, or false evidence (obvs if someone is clearly racist that is another matter, but you were wrong about the Saville thing, and your reasoning on the EDL non-linking is, I think, wrong). It will just shut the conversation down again and I think the conversation needs to be had.

And just one more point. The list stones posted is, as she said, out of date. There are some cases from 2016 which are now on the EDL website missing, and ones from 2017. So her story that she had c&p's it a year ago sounds true. She could have easily been gathering info and not remember where it came from. But heyho, let's malign and accuse someone who has tried to educate herself about grooming gangs, that will help

There is an issue in the Asian community and it needs to be addressed. There is also the same issue in the Jewish orthodox community. I don't think it was reported but there was a rabbi in Manchester who was abusing young girls. He left on a plane to Israel before he was arrested. Left his wife and kids behind.

I have not seen the program but I've been watching the cases because when I was at university at Birmingham some of the Asian men on campus were extremely disrespectful to women and I wondered what happened behind closed doors. I complained to be told I was racist. I went back again and said they needed to explain why being sexist is ok when being racist isn't. I was shut down as being 'one of those women'.

A black taxi driver from the West Indies picked us up one night from digbeth and told us to be very careful with Asian taxi drivers. He told us to never get in a taxi with one of them. It was rare for me to take a taxi and I took no notice. Always took the bus because it was cheaper.

The worst part of this is that there are girls out there today who are being abused by men like this. How do you stop it? Is our education system so bad? Where are we going wrong in our society that this happens?