Lassies of Lallybroch - SPOILERS

[MistressFraser]

New thread to discuss both the TV series of Outlander and the books by Diana Gabaldon. Discussion of spoilers allowed, if not positively encouraged.

mistress

We should have called this thread Murtagh's Maidens, I'm worried I'm going to go on the wrong one and drop a massive spoiler

I was only thinking earlier that I'm half way through Voyager and there's no mention of Murtagh. Wondered if I'd forgotten reading what happened to him, so I googled it. Apparently towards the end of Voyager Jamie tells Claire about him dying.
I was very sad to hear that. I love the relationship between him and Jamie.

I'm worried I'm going to go on the wrong one and drop a massive spoiler

Oh god, I hadn't thought of that. I'll be the one to do that probably.

Nah, don't worry snozzle that'll definitely be me I nearly did it earlier, in fact!

I think it was also me who started off the spoilery talk on the original thread. I'm ashamed of myself

I think I need to get out of here or I'll spoil voyager!!!! And I'm enjoying it soooomuch and love to talk about it!

More knee porn fun

Thank you pixie That pic is going to be my new screensaver fab! 😛

Just placemarking. Not read the books, only watched bits of S1 but enjoying S2. Catriona Balfe deserves to win every prize going for her acting in the last episode, she broke my heart.

In other news, I live near where they film a lot of it. Very funny to see places I know and travel by regularly, totally out of context, on the telly! I can just about see 'Fort William' out of my kitchen window .

Just watched a couple of great periscope videos of Q&A sessions with SH in Rome.
He said that he fought to get Jamie to cut his hair off before the dual as he felt it was really important. But they couldn't do it because of continuity and they film out of sequence.
He also talked of spending 12 hours a day filming one sex scene and them both getting carpet burn! Those must have been such difficult days for CB!
Before filming season one he flew to London 9 times in a couple of weeks to get his hair dyed the right colour.
I can't work out how to get the link. If I do I'll share them with you.

Lady of Lallybroch present and reporting for duty!

Am part way into the fourth book now and well up for discussing spoilers.

Oh and yes that suckling scene with Frank was utterly horrid and the way he behaves later just makes her mooning about with guilt over him even more annoying.

And I also find the stereotypical bitchy women utterly despair inducing. But it was the 90s I suppose when she wrote it....

Oops, I meant lassy of Lallybroch obvs, not Lady! How presumptuous!
Fucking autocorrect

I feel sorry for Frank, despite his not-very-nice qualities: he is in love with Claire, she disappears, comes back pregnant and in love with a man he can't compete against, whilst bringing up his child. Even a nice person might struggle with that just a bit. His philandering is DG's way of making Claire and us feel a bit better about the raw deal he gets.

Fingers crossed this link works for one of the Q&A sessions with SH...
www.periscope.tv/w/ahPxTDg4MTkzMXwxa3ZKcGxWYU5CTEpFfcmqUXiVRAjYcPuFSr9fBWuUfdzk5z-TGDefLRD-qf4=

oooh, Piffpaff we must be from, very nearly, the same place!

waves at cardoon

So does everyone like book Jamie as much as TV Jamie? I've really struggled with some of the stuff book Jamie has done and he doesn't even look like SH in my head when I'm reading the books, that's how disconnected the two are

I know he's supposed to be this strong, brave, noble character but he's also a bigamist, a rapist, and a liar. Alright, so he didn't know Claire was going to be back but Laoghaire?! I mean, ffs, this is the woman who almost got his best wife killed by accusing her of being a witch!

And he's horrible to Roger, who's my favourite by the time Drums of Autumn rolls round. I loved Jamie in the first book btw, but as the series goes on, I just like him less and less.

Oh and I also struggled with the portrayal of 'The Chinese' in Voyager. Wtaf was that all about?!

I think there's no question that Jamie has changed by the time of Voyager - and that's really the question that Jamie poses to Claire, and so to us: " Sassenach, will ye take me - and risk the man I am, for the sake of the men ye knew?".

Jamie has been changed by what he has gone through and what he has done - and he and Claire suffer the consequences of that. His intentions might have been basically good, or at least not evil, with regard to Geneva and Laoghaire, but the consequences - of not being able to own or care for his son, of his attempt to care for Laoghaire failing - are painful things. It's not like he gets of scot (ha!) free.

I haven't finished Voyager, although I think I know roughly what happens, so it may be that I shift to Team Roger as I go through, but just like Claire, you fall in love, life and bad things and bad decisions happen to you, and you have to deal with the person your lover has become.

So, obviously tv Jamie is lovely to look at, but it may be that good writers will make the character develop, not completely in line with the books, but in a real, suffer the consequences of your decisions, way. That's already happened in season 2, I think.

Why is Jamie such a tosser to Roger? I haven't got that far in the fourth book yet... Am v worried about not liking Jamie anymore. Not sure my constitution is up to it...

Jamie doesn't like Roger because of something that happens in DoA, (the details of which I can't exactly remember, but I think was partly Jamie's fault).

Basically, Roger can't do anything right because he's not all huntin', shootin', fightin'. He can't even hit anything when he tries because he has 'binocular' vision or something diagnosed by the all knowing Claire. But he deserves a better fate than being lumbered with the terminally irritating Brianna .

I am alone in my not liking Jamie, I think, so don't worry about that Doll And I take your point about the things he's been through changing him mistress of course they would've.

Jamie doesn't like (understatement) Roger because he thinks he is the man who raped Brianna. It all ends well, though, and he becomes a son to Jamie.

I really like Jamie in the later books. He is what he is - a man who has been shaped by the terrible things that have happened to him. He doesn't tell Claire about Laoghaire because he is afraid she will leave. Given the life he has led, that's pretty understandable. He tries to look after Laoghaire, but ultimately that fails. He is bound by all sorts of responsibilities and his own sense of honour. His character keeps growing and changing throughout all the books, he, and us, have to live with the co sequences of all his decisions and all the awful things that keep happening to him and to Claire, for that matter.

Ok, we'll never agree on my dislike of Jamie (which is fair enough ) but are there any others that we're supposed to like but you don't?

My main one would be Brianna. I can't think of another fictional character who annoys me quite as much as she does. From the minute she was on the page, she pissed me off.

I like Ian though. I think it's mainly female characters that DG has a problem writing for.

Oh yes I love Ian (both of them). I had mixed feelings about Jenny, she's obviously a pragmatist who wanted something positive in life for her brother, hence the Laoghaire stuff. I have a vague idea that she comes back into the later stories but I've still got to get past the hump of the gathering in Fiery Cross. It will be interesting to see how she and Claire do in later life.

Is Brianna meant to be such an unlikeable, unsympathetic character?

cardoon I don't think so. I think we're all supposed to admire her, because she's so amazing and not at all spoilt. Apart from the fact that she's a whiny, self absorbed brat with barely any redeeming features as far as I can see. Hope the TV people make her more sympathetic (they've done a good job with Claire).

pixie I finally got past The Gathering, and abandoned it again. They went off to war (or something) but the getting there was tedious. Treated to every little detail, such as Claire testing to see if she has cough by swallowing.

I liked Jenny though, hope she does come back in the later books.