GAME OF THRONES - S6 E3 - SPOILERS AND FAN THEORY DISCUSSIONS WARNING 2am Showing Onwards!!!

[EverySongbirdSays]

SPOILER TOWN

SPOILERVILLE

SPOILERLAND

BEWARE ALL YE WHO ENTER HERE

AND WHAT DO WE SAY TO THOSE WHO COMPLAIN ABOUT SPOILERS???

WE SAY NOT TODAY!!!!!!!

I hope you'll enjoy it.

TBH I did not read it as a book, more as a reference book whenever I am obsessing about someone. The early Targaryens are very exciting, too.

I also ordered World of Ice and Fire thanks to this thread

DH and I have recently been watching/listening to the Complete Histories and Lore animations that came as extras on the blu-rays of previous seasons. They're really enjoyable, it's got the actors (all in character) narrating the history of Westeros from varying perspectives. Someone has handily made them into compilations by season and put them on YouTube, the first one is .

So, who's being an irresponsible idiot and staying up with me?

New thread will be up around 1.30 am

I won't be up then, but I will be up about 5.15 to watch it before I go to work

So, who's being an irresponsible idiot and staying up with me?

Meeeeeeeeeeeee!!!

God know. I've only had about 5 hours sleep in total the last two nights. I'll be back after I've watched it during tomorrow's morning Nap for DS

If the Rickon storyline isn't the Umbers playing a trick on Ramsay, I think Ramsay might try and befriend Rickon. Rickon is usually referred to as angry and fierce, they both like dogs, and Ramsay now has no one since losing both his girlfriend and Theon. It would amuse Ramsay to turn Rickon bad and make him his own creature, so when Jon arrives to claim Winterfell, Rickon is already in possession as the legitimate heir (assuming everyone thinks Bran is dead).

No, but I'll watch it first thing in the morning!

everysongbird Dany and Jon can't marry, as he is her nephew (Rhaegar's sister) and also has been predicted that she would have no more children. So would be a succession problem waiting to happen.

Targs regularly married brother and sister, so I dont think nephew would be much of a problem.

The succession is an issue though.

Maybe it wouldn't be a problem to daenarys but I'm not sure Jon would feel ok about it

Lemon

As readers of the books are more aware I guess, though it's been mentioned in the show, it is QUITE THE NORM in Targaryen families for siblings to marry one another to "keep the bloodline pure"

Dany had assumed she would marry her brother but he sold her to the Dothraki in exchange for their military might behind him, which notoriously didn't work.

Dany would think nothing of marrying her nephew. They most certainly can marry in that universe and potentially the Targaryen incest issue was established to make a Dany/Jon marriage possible.

The prophecy is more tricksy.... it says Dany will not have children but subject to certain seemingly impossible conditions, which may come to be fulfilled.....

But Jon is a Stark - incest isn't cool in the Stark clan. Witness Ned's response to the lannister twins.

The Prophecy of Mirri Maz Duur - COURTESY OF WESTEROS.ORG

"When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east," said Mirri Maz Duur. "When the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves. When your womb quickens again, and you bear a living child. Then he will return, and not before."

This might be a real prophecy, or it may simply be a sort of curse to strike terror and despair into Daenerys's heart. The conditions put forward have a distinct ring of fairy-tale about them, and with Martin this could just as easily be taken to work against the likelihood of them coming true as in favour of it. For what it is worth, however, it seems just possible that A Dance with Dragons has satisfied most of the conditions if read metaphorically. Consider that Quentyn Martell "the Sun's son", referring to the Martell sun journeyed from the west to the east, where he died, that in Daenerys's last chapter she notes that the Dothraki sea is going dry and the grasses are dying, two of the pyramids of Meereen collapse in smoke and ash following Viserion and Rhaegel rampaging through the city and that she menstruates (or possibly suffers a miscarriage). This of course leaves us the need for a living child, and then the "return" of Drogo... though our speculation is that if she has a child, it will be a son that she names Drogo, thereby fulfilling Mirri's claim.

Yes, Jon is a Stark

He's also a Targaryen

But Dany is unlikely to feel like a relative emotionally, having never known her. It's not like (in theory) he's being asked to marry Arya

I had to go and check because I couldn't remember their names but

Daenerys mother was Queen Rhaella

Her father was King Aerys II

They were married, they were also full siblings

But if you had a long lost uncle who turned up and said 'hey lets get married, it's cool our family doesn't mind incest' would you just say ok then it would your natural distaste at incest prevent you, regardless of whether you knew him before? No, I really don't think Jon will marry daenarys.

I think jon has just come back from the dead and there is no real telling what he might get up to at this point.

I don't know how incesteously aunt and nephew would be viewed - cousins certainly marry regularly in westeros.

If my uncle looked like Jon snow I might

But I don't think it will go down that route.

Out of interest those who don't think Jon and Dany ruling as a couple is endgame - what do you think is endgame?

I think it was intended to be the end game, but virtually every game of thrones fan can see it coming...so wonder if that will change things.

In some ways, I wish they'd waited till the books were finished before making it (well, no I don't because I think they've done a stand up job on it so far despite the deviations)

I think now endgame will be the destruction of westeros; the white walkers and their undead army will invade, Dany will ride in with the dragons (and possibly team up with JS and a third character) and end up having to destroy westeros to save it and end up 'queen of the ashes' so to speak. I do think bran will have a big part to play.

Jon will die properly, I wouldn't be surprised if he dies this series in a 'hah! You all thought he was back for good, now look!' twist.

I think Young Griff (or a character based on him) will appear this series; I feel they are trying to avoid moving the story on too much ahead of the books so I think they will 'go back' so to speak and incorporate him in some way - maybe rescuing Dany form Vaes Dothrak?

I think this series will focus on Ramsay and Jon Snow in an interesting but ultimately pointless storyline as well as the flashbacks to the Starks...all interesting and new to us, but I don't think things will move as dramatically as they have and the events in this series will have little bearing on the endgame.

Which seems odd as the seventh book won't be released until the 2020s most likely so it makes me wonder if GRRM has a real shocker planned for the end of book six that they want to be in the show but don't want to show it ahead of the book.

There was a case an uncle marrying a niece during the Dance of the Dragons. Queen Rhaenyra was married to her uncle Prince Daemon Targaryen (whom some described as Prince Oberyn times ten, and he is definitely cool, cruel, ruthless and sexy). Although the chronicles are so unreliable, that they both could be total bores in real life. They were the ultimate power couple who lost the war in some style, but their children ultimately ruled Westeros. Daemon died (?) / disappeared as a proper boss.

The prophecy about Dany being betrayed once for blood, once for gold and once for love - wasn't the first of those Mirri's own betrayal? She promised to raise Drogo, which she did, but betrayed Dany's trust by killing her baby - for the blood of her people. So we've had betrayal 1 - Mirri; betrayal 2 - Jorah; and I think we're waiting for the final one now. So whatever else happens in the endgame, Dany's going to get betrayed again. I suppose it might be Missandei, for love of Grey Worm - who knows?

It's the Long Night and The Prince That Was Promised though isn't?

The idea that Westeros will be in one endless night unless a saviour comes forth?

It's very Christ allegory

I can't cope just thinking about "tomorrow"s episode

DON'T HURT RICKON
DON'T HURT RICKON