Downton Abbey Discussion continued...

[ErikNorseman]

Here!

I haven't seen the Xmas special but do remember the engagement being announced as that's what tipped bates's evil mrs off that she'd been had instead of selling her story.

I doubt anything will come of Richard's desire for revenge since he is busy pining after the Khaleesi in Slavers' Bay right now. Although he will have some free time this time next year unless they change things round a bit....

It just didn't strike me as remotely believable that Mary would dump him for Matthew. It really didn't.

port mentalist - thanks, that's him.

Mordion - except that he turned out to be violent and controlling. Mary asked mumsnetters who told her to ltb.

I can't imagine Richard would have let Mary get away with being such a cold fish - he would have walled her up again I'm sure. Matthew needs to handle his women better.

Richard and Mary were very well suited. Both incredibly ruthless.

Sir Richard's wee was hotter than Cousin Matthew.

I miss Sir Richard and his dastardly ways.

But Sir Richard was, or looked like he was, approaching 60 he probably couldn't've got it up either condom or not

I've seen the 2011 xmas special now and all makes sense...!

I don't think Sir R was really Lady Mary's type at all. I see what you mean but really I think she hankers after somethin' wiiiiilllddddd. Hence Pamuk. She was definitely not thinking with her head there.

"I've seen what happiness is and I know that I won't be!"

remember, from Series 1??? How true, how true I'm thinking.

Sir Richard was so powerful and forceful, his magnificent member would have been far too scared to not comply.

Approaching 60? He's 51 Now. He was 50 last year (unless something wibbly wobbly has happened). Mary doesn't deserve him anyway, he's better off with the Khaleesi (although obviously that is going to end in tears soon enough).

As I see it, its all rather simple. Mary is terrified of becoming pregnant for one of two reasons.

A) She is scared the drs would be able to tell she has already given birth so this is not her first pregnancy so scandal ensues. The Turk remember? She went off to America to stay with her granny for a while remember? I reckon she had the child in the States and had it adopted all very hush hush. Richard the baddie knows all this and is nowhere to be seen at the moment because he is he is busy tracking down the baby and plotting his revenge on Mary. In years to come the baby will come back to try and claim Downton for himself (bound to have been a boy) but thats another storyline

Or

B) Mary is not keen to have a baby because she actually had an abortion which somehow rendered her infertile, she knows this but doesn't want to tell Matthew in case he didn't want to marry her.

Am I right or am I right?

Hmmm, I don't think either of those are right although both are interesting. The way I see it JF only deals with what is happening in the here and now. It's almost as if he forgets that the series used to have these other interesting characters and storylines. It's my major peeve with Downton Abbey to be honest.

I'll bet my bottom dollar that the name Pamuk will never be uttered on DA again and as for Richard he is long forgotten. It will be a fertility issue but not one related to an abortion or a hidden pregnancy.

He may not be forgotten but since he got a better offer and is unavailable, that's that.

When did Mary go to America?

yes squoosh apart from the interminably depressing Bates and Anna story

some interesting ideas there. Did Mary actually leave and go to America? I thought that was the plan but then she got engaged to Matthew so it wasn't necessary.

It is funny, I have been thinking Carsen is Mary's dad throughout the whole series. But that means Carsen and Cora..... I don't know. She did say she had known she'd been married for her wealth and that Lord 6 didn't love her at first, so perhaps in those lonely days... Or is the neighbour Mary's father? Old withered arm. Is that the real reason why they didn't want him to marry Edith?

Bloody hell, apart from the ever rumbling on Bates saga. How could I forget!

Withered arm won't be back either, we'll not hear a peep about him ever again. Edith has bounce back marevellously well considering

ZZZen those are interesting thoughts; there IS a resemblance between Mary and Carson but if that were the case she wouldn't be regarded as LADY Mary would she? unless only Carson and Cora know

There's an interesting personal story about DH's GM who was bought up in a Lord's house in Cornwall and as soon as she realised she wasn't one of the actual children left the House.The mother kept contact with her sending money etc.
We've visited the place and the resemblance between DH also DS to the family in the paintings is striking. I've a theory that she was born BEFORE the parents married. Its sad 'cos she never officially knew who her parents were. we've tried local censuses etc. to no avail AFAIK she was like a ghost in the House.

that's strange, especially if there was a family resemblance. I presume she was conceived out of wedlock, maybe by a relation of the couple whose children she lived with. If she had been a love-child of the man of the house with a mistress, I doubt she would have been taken in.

Mary didn't get engaged to Matthew for ages, he proposed, she wouldn't give him an answer because she felt she would have to tell him about the Turkish Delight she had enjoyed previously, but there was family pressure not to tell, they dithered, WW1 broke out and off went Matt who then got engaged to Lavinia.

I was hoping that Bates was guilty- there's a nasty streak about him (remember how vicious he sounded when he called his first wife a bitch last season?) and wife's friend mentioned how terrified of him wife was- she had no reason to lie to Anna.
But JF is so unbearably sentimental that he's bound to be innocent.

What was the point of Shirley McLaine btw? She was only in the show a couple of episodes and was strangely listless compared to Maggie.

And why do Thomas and O'Brien now hate each other? They used to BFF. I totally missed (or blanked) that storyline.

There was a storyline in the last series where Thomas got totally ripped off ov a load of black market food, was that when he fell out with O'Brien?