Do I let DD14 continue with her online 'friends'!?

[Wiseonce]

Used AI to summarise, apologies! It'a still very long so bear with me.

A few weeks ago we discovered DD14 had been secretly bypassing parental controls and using hidden devices/accounts to talk to a group of 'teenagers' she'd met online. We thought we had all devices locked down but she stole my old phone to bypass all controls. She considers them genuine friends and believes she has a 'girlfriend'. The major concern was that she'd shared a scary amount of real personal information with people she's never met — full name, DOB, phone number, town, school/family information, photos etc. She still believes they're definitely who they say they are. This is a girl who had to be told about Santa, tooth fairy etc at 11 and cried her eyes out, so shes very naive and trusting. There are lots of red flags with the chats- they tell her she's very mature, how to get around controls, say bad things about us and her siblings and started sexual chat early on. My DD is so naive she asked did they mean holding hands! Now she is the one sending the dirty messages as time has gone on.

We removed her phone/internet completely. Put new passwords on all devices in the house. Initially as punishment for stealing my phone but then to keep her safe when we came across all this other stuff. She was devastated and had a complete meltdown, which lasted weeks. but after a few weeks she's much happier, spending loads of time doing sport, seeing IRL friends and engaging with family again.
It's now time to start giving her phone back, as I realise a teen needs a phone but these people are also on WhatsApp and there are hundreds of messages waiting. I feel like as soon as she opens the phone she's going to be sucked straight back in again. We obviously can't prevent a determined teenager accessing strangers online forever, so we need to figure out what to do.

Would you initially lock the phone right down and gradually increase access, or give her more trust — e.g. WhatsApp/Spotify allowed provided she blocks/deletes everyone she doesn't know IRL, with occasional phone checks — and restrict it again if she breaks that trust? And what would you do about all the existing messages/contacts? Do I just let her keep her online friends? Do I delete/block the strangers?

I'm very lost and go back and forth about it. I wouldn't mind so much but she seems really obsessed. She behaved like a drug addict in withdrawal when we initially took them away. She ignores real life friends to speak to these online ones. She has screen savers of photos of them even though they have never met, she's talking about talking a gap year after school to travel to them. They are from a different country so she is literally learning their language every day, including on holiday so she can speak to them. She was on a school trip abroad and spent over 7 hours on the phone to them in 1 day instead of talking to the kids on the trip actually with her.... She even has entire photo albums of just pictures of the one she believes is/was her girlfriend and has drawn lots of photos of her. Maybe I'm old but I think it's bloody weird. And obsessive. She's never met these people!! I haven't said any of this to her face, I've been very neutral and just talked about risks and safety. But what do I do!? Please don't be judgemental I am trying my best and want to do his right so she's not sneaking around anymore. But equally they could just be online groomers!? They could be anyone!

I hope she’s learning a European language -anything else would be dodgy imv -why would this supposedly happy group of teenage girls want a naive 14 year old in their gang -they wouldn’t unless there was an ulterior motive
Can you insist she takes up hobbies outside the home at least twice a week so she is mixing with folks who might actually be interesting and maybe become good friends

There are 2 of them, I'm not sure if they know eachother in real life or just online.

We have her at 3 different sports, art and drama!! She is busy which is why it's so maddening. I believe she was up half of last night learning this (European yes) language and using the raspberry pi.

The fact it’s her perusing them makes it less sinister, I think. Still very unhealthy for her with the level of obsession and the staying up late online etc. But at least it doesn’t seem to involve one of those more warped online groups, who would definitely be pursuing her.

I wonder if you manage to limit her contact with them as much as possible they may move on eventually. I think there’s a good chance this is a phase that will end. It’s good she’s involved in lots of other activities.

Just read your updates @Wiseonce

If things have broken down between you, what do you think of removing pc screen, raspberry pi that you know of, even pc desk and chair. Everything tech related apart from tv.

She will kick off but maybe its a case of ripping off the band aid at this point.

Just get rid of it all while she is at school one day. When she asks why tell her you know she has went against your wishes and shes left you no choice. Shes betrayed you and these are the consequences.

And at the same time absolutly go through her bedroom with a fine tooth comb to attempt find the phone - but i think its likely she has taken it to school - so when she comes in house door immediately demand to go through bag, jacket and pockets and i think its likely you will find it there and then.

This has went on for so long for you now, youve tried the being nice and supportive. Maybe time for drastic action.

I would legit arrage for rubbish removal guy to come and take away pc desk, chair and anything else like screen or other tech she can use raspberry pi on.

And just tell her its all gone.

Thanks for this! My way of update, this week I actually did as you are saying- confronted her when she came through the door and asked was there any devices in her bag/uniform she shouldn't have. She said no so I searched them. The raspberry pi was there, no sign of a phone. She reiterated she doesn't have a phone. I'm still unconvinced but have done more looking since then in her room and still haven't found one. I am praying I'm wrong and she just doesn't have one.

The raspberry pi I questioned her where she got it and she told me her school gave it to her. This seemed like nonsense, but actually I rang the school the next morning and they had!! I asked the ICT teacher why she was giving out devices that can be used as full desktop PCs without parental knowledge, to a child where there is a safeguarding concern (in fairness she wouldn't have known this) but she was very apologetic and offered to take it back. She sounded very young. She apparently hadn't thought about the fact that it would be taken outside of the school network and be a completely open pc for her to use, and since she hadn't informed any parents we weren't able to put any parental controls on them. Bit stupid for an ICT teacher really. My DD had seen them in the school and asked to use them for practicing coding and the teacher had just said yes. She said in future she won't allow these to go home without parental consent forms. She was very apologetic. I'm sure I came across as very angry.

For now I'm going to remove the monitor, keyboard etc from her room as you say (I can't dispose of them permanently as she bought them with her own money and that doesn't sit right with me) and the raspberry pi-now I know it's there it's being kept downstairs. She is very techy and actually wants to learn to code so I'm not against this is itself. If it's removed from downstairs apart from to go to school, it will be brought back to school by me with an instruction that she isn't ever allowed one again. She is aware of all of this and hasn't argued. She does seem to hate me at the moment. But she is so busy with school and seeing real life friends though I am really hoping that this all fades into the background and she just moves on. From talking to her she absolutely has not moved on yet, and we are months into this. She has never been allowed a phone back since this all started and I can't see her getting one any time soon, as awkward as that is at times.

I know I am doing the right thing. Even if these are really teens, the level of obsession with them was actually quite scary. We had been describing it as like living with a drug addict. The level of deceit, obsession and inability to think clearly about the whole thing is/was absolutely terrifying.

I am hoping in 6 months I can come back here and say I don't have any of this to worry about anymore 😭

It sounds like you handled the school very well and quite right being angry with them, hopefully they will implement parental consent forms to provent future issues.

Have you got an attic/loft, or a deep/awkward cupboard. Maybe put the tech in there like monitor/keyboard etc etc.

I intitally thought still get rid and give her rhe money, but then that'd create another issue of ber spending it on tech or worse transport to be with these online people.

Keep her close but regimented.

Im not sure how you can help her get over this obsession. Do school offer counselling service? Ideally it just fades away.

I know initially i floated a ps5 as an idea, but what do you think. Could get her a very immersive role playing game, maybe her obsession will turn there instead.

Look after yourself and hoping this difficult chapter settles for your family asap x

Thanks so much for this. I had forgotten about the PS5 idea. It is a good one actually. We are fortunate to have 2 downstairs living rooms with TV setups so actually this could work if we set it up down here. She doesn't have a TV in her room. It can be monitored but also give her the gaming outlet. We do have an attic and that's where the pc stuff will go.

In terms of counselling, she did used to go to the school counselor but she didn't find it useful. I also paid for private counselling outside school and she didn't find it great either. Neither of them she opened up to. I did float the idea of the school counselor this week again but she said no. If this obsession doesn't lift I may refer her either way. It's helpful to have another person to talk to. It's sad because she used to tell me she didn't need counselling because she had me and would tell me everything. Now she won't tell me things she's more isolated.

I hope this passes x

Have a wee look at this for ideas for immersive games, maybe you could look together at all the choices. I've actually done an immersive game in each of my toughest chapters in life, they can really take your mind off things
https://www.playstation.com/en-gb/editorial/best-open-world-games-on-ps4-ps5/

Also would you play with her? there are games designed for real co-op play. My DH and I did one called "It takes two" and there's another called "split fiction" - you literally cannot complete the game without working together and communicating.

Here's a trailer for it takes two - but this one is about a marriage in trouble, but a great game

This is Split fiction - two females trying needing to work towards friendship, very good.

Also maybe books might help here too;
Self-esteem workbook for teens
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ultimate-Self-Esteem-Workbook-Teens-Confidently/dp/1641526106?source=ps-sl-shoppingads-lpcontext&ref_=fplfs&psc=1&smid=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&utm_source=chatgpt.com

And my final idea, talking cards for parents & teens
https://shop.theschooloflife.com/products/parents-teenagers

I think your story shines a light on how even when you are doing everything right, with clubs and skill building, tech strangers are a poison that can still infiltrate our families and cause such upheaval. Thank you for sharing all that you have and I will keep an eye to see how you navigate this to a positive outcome, and i hope for you its soon. Keep a strong attitude as best you can x