Overheard ds's inappropriate conversation with friend

[blubberball]

DS is 14 and neuro divergent. He's quite immature for his age, and is like a younger child in his manner. I usually hear him talk to his friend about games, but last night I overheard him say to his friend on the phone "How many times did your dick go hard whilst you were talking to her?" I was a bit shocked to hear him talking to his friend like that, so I told him to say bye to his friend. It was time for his screens to go off any way, and I take his technology every night and lock it away. He seemed a bit mortified that I'd heard him say that, and cleaned his teeth and went straight to bed. He usually faffs around for an hour after screens off. I told him not to ask his friend that. A little while later, I went into his room to talk about misogyny. He didn't know what it was. I told him it's treating women and girls badly, and I said that girls aren't objects. He was embarrassed and just wanted to go to sleep. He was turned away and didn't want to talk. I thought it was important to say something.

Is this just a normal thing for teenage boys to say to their mates? I don't want him to feel shame about normal feelings of being attracted to the opposite sex, and erections. But I also want to protect girls from this attitude from boys. How do I manage this going forward? I'm planning on having more little conversations about misogyny now and then. Does anyone please have any experience with this?

It may be more a cultural thing in my case, I'm aware that the way I was raised was more conservative than most women in Britain today, because of my background.

Well, maybe todays generation is different, I haven't had much experience of parenting a teenager yet!

It is good i guess that teenagers in Britain are more confident and less shy about things though . I can see that side of things, kids dont seem hung up about things like this and seem pretty shame free. very different from generation X.

Teens have always spoke like that. Its a very normal part of developing sexually, emotionally, and their sense of right/wrong.

Its quite Downton Abbey in a really sweet way that you think "dick hard" is graphic. If you have DC i dont recommend attending any PSHE awareness sessions their school puts on to inform parents what is covered. I can only describe it as erotica 🤣 id have genuinely rather they just said "your knob can get hard if youre aroused" and i know most other parents felt the same 😂😩

You appear very out of touch with the real world.

Do you know any teenagers- boys or girls?

They were not making the girl into an 'object'.
They were discussing their own responses (well, one them was) to her.

They were discussing attraction.

Im generation x!

I dont recognise all this apparent silence from when I was growing up

We had all sorts of teen magazines talking about boys and bodies and sex as you got older of course.

Asking someone about their genitals is different to talking about your own on anonymous forum. So no I didn't say anything ironic. Hth.

Do you imagine that boys in the 1950s, 1850s, 1750s, 1650s ... BC2000 didn't talk to each other about physical arousal in the context of a girl they liked?

This isn't a new conversation

I think there's cave graffiti about it isnt there? Big knobs and what not

I'm the first to object to misogyny but I'm not convinced that was misogynistic. I agree there's a fine line between talking about sex and ladish banter that is disrespectful towards women but he was asking his friend to reveal something about his own body, not about the girl's. Not like he was saying "what a slag" or "what did her tits look like?" That would have 100 per cent been misogynistic.

yes I’m sure if he was Will from the Inbetweeners that would be a totally normal way to address his friend at 14 🙄

Don't be silly of course !y kids can do PSHE. I just think would a teenage girl want to be discussed like that by her male peers? I would have felt a bit embarrassed I guess. That's all. Not a huge deal though.

I'm surprised @blubberball is eavesdropping on her child's phone conversations though. I had a parent do that and it was horrible. They were controlling and would use it against me what I had been saying to my friends. Not that I'm saying you would be abusive or anything I guess I'm just a bit surprised. Or did you just overhear ? Which is fair enough if so.

I’d never make my son feel ashamed for something he hasn’t learnt to control yet. He and his mates were just chatting about how they keep getting random ones, that’s how the discussion started. It isn’t hurting the teacher, is it? It’s not as if they are informing her 🤣

Fair enough. I think Will was white British though ? Like I said I have a different frame of reference.

That would have been bad, much worse I agree. Ok, it seems I'm in the minority here!

But he hasn't objectified the girl?

He was just asking his friend a crude question (in a lad's banter way) in relation to his mate being aroused by talking to a girl he fancied.

I imagine that loads of teenage boys would make this kind of comment to each other.

Your son wasn't being disrespectful to the girl in question - if anything he was just teasing his friend.

Misogyny is about the hatred of women and having prejudiced and generally unpleasant opinions about women, and I don't think your son's comments are indicative of him feeling like that?

"Don't be silly of course !y kids can do PSHE"

Before you tell me not to be silly you might want to check what i actually said.

I couldn't agree more. I was raised in one of those devout religious households and it is terrifying to see the same types of sexual shame espoused in the name of feminism. Back in the '90s feminism helped me free myself from that shame.

Agreed - but I would go further.

In the context of a 14 year old boy who presumably has no sexual experience and limited first hand experience of the female body, if when hearing that his friend had snogged a girl and fondled her breasts through her t-shirt, him then asking, wide eyed and mouth agape: "what were her tits like?" would arguably be curiosity as opposed to misogyny.

A bit like when pre-teen/early teen girls talk about the minutiae of their first kiss. My friends and I certainly did.

OP @blubberball wasn't eavesdropping. She overheard the conversation as she was walking into his room.

By the way, this is likely an unpopular opinion but eavesdropping on your children isn't inherently bad. It depends on what is done with it. Some parents keep an eye out and ear out for their children so they can guide them adequately. Sometimes that means listening in or their conversation or looking at their phones.

The good ones among them don't use it against their children but find a way to have discussions or guide them appropriately without judgement if anything has been discovered. Some even tell their children they do this and they're okay with it. This depends on the parent-child relationship though. There has to be trust for the parents.

It's the same way some posters here have said they wouldn't have let on that they heard OP's son' conversation if they were her. Instead they'd find another time to have a general conversation with her son about inappropriate behaviour, etc so that he doesn't feel shamed for it. That's what I mean.

Point being that your mum eavesdropped AND used it against you are two different things. The first one is not so bad in itself if she'd behaved differently. The second one is a terrible standalone behaviour that I'm sure also happened in other situations besides eavesdropping on your calls. Eavesdropping isn't the problem; being controlling or abusive while also using things you say against you is the problem.

It's really important not to overreact in these situations.

Years ago, when I was a young teen, my Mum found out something where she thought I was 'at risk' (to do with a boy) and consequently my social life was restricted. She'd snooped , but also she'd not credited me with any self-control or maturity. It had long lasting impact on me because I completely clammed up and never shared anything emotional with her ever again, even as an adult.

Asking a friend 'How many times did your dick go hard when talking to her' is jokey boy banter between mates. I don't think your son meant it as a genuine question. He didn't say this to his friend in front of the girl either. Boys/men don't behave towards male friends in the same way as girls/women do towards female friends. I wouldn't say to a female friend 'Were you wet like a river when talking to him'. I wouldn't say that to a female friend as an adult, and I wouldn't have to a friend as a teenager either. Teenager boys, think saying something like that to a male friend is hilarious.The comment was directed at his friend, not the girl the friend had supposedly spoke too. It wouldn't cross their mind that it was anything other than a joke. If your son had said to his friend 'Did you see the tits on Helen at school today', yes that's inappropriate and he shouldn't speak about women in that way.

I think some women who have not been exposed to young teen boys do not understand how 'basic' and 'lavatorial' their humour can be.

I knew young teen boys who had farting competitions in public - (Longest, loudest, smelliest) yet most girls would rather die than fart in public.

I think some women who have not been exposed to young teen boys do not understand how 'basic' and 'lavatorial' their humour can be

Well, I’ve had several myself, and while I do agree there can be lav humour, neither DH or myself would have stood for the conversation the OP heard. It’s not respectful and that ‘oh, it’s okay, it’s just laddish banter’ philosophy sets the acceptance of it and that’s what you see a lot of nowadays with men in general. It’s not okay.

You do you, as they say.

You'll find far worse than a bit of jokey banter between two young lads over the phone.

Boys and men get erections. Boys might mention it.

There'll be kids with erections in class sometimes.

It's not misogynistic. A lot of erections are a response to contact/interaction with a female.

I'd be more concerned with what the friend thought of the comment. Was it something that he thought was weird or is it within the normal confines of their usual chat?