DD17 pregnant again and BF arrested last week

[TiredNanAgain]

Hi all, new name but I’ve posted before about my DD17, her little boy who’s just turned 1 and her BF16 who is honestly causing me to tear my hair out.

It’s been a few months since I last posted so thought I’d do an update because so much has happened since then and I could really use some advice.

DD finally told him about the pregnancy in early July. I was really hoping he would take it well but he didn’t at all. He came over to ours when grandson was having his little birthday gathering with family and a few friends and they ended up arguing in the kitchen. I still don’t know what exactly about but he stormed off mid party and went outside, next thing we know he’s punched a wall down the road and broke his hand. So that kind of ruined the day for everyone as you can imagine.

He did calm down eventually and I think after a few weeks it started to sink in. He even stopped smoking weed for a short while after finding out about the pregnancy which gave me some hope. But sadly he’s back on it now, I can smell it on him again and it just makes me worry about what sort of example he’s setting.

GCSE results day was a bit of a disaster, he failed them all. DD tried to help him revise back in spring but honestly he didn’t listen and was on his phone half the time. He hasn’t gone on to do anything education wise since, says he doesn’t want to go to college and just wants to “work” but he doesn’t have a job and I still suspect he’s dealing but no proof. He gives DD money sometimes which she just says is his allowance from foster care but surely it wouldn’t be that much.

DD is back at college now and doing really well, she loves it. Her course has a work placement next year and she’s excited for that so I really don’t want her to give that up. She is about 18 weeks now and the bump is getting obvious.

Social services know about the pregnancy and have been quite supportive but said they will need to do another assessment once baby is here. His foster carer is trying her best, she’s honestly lovely and I do feel for her because she says he’s been so difficult lately and now with the pregnancy news he’s acting out even more.

The reason I’m posting really is because he was arrested last week. I don’t want to say too much but it was for fighting with another boy. He’s been given some kind of caution and they’re talking about maybe anger management sessions. I just feel like everything is spiralling again and I don’t know how to help DD without completely taking over.

She’s happy about the baby now, says she wants to keep it and that she loves him and he’s a good dad (I wouldn’t go that far). Grandson absolutely adores him and smiles at him whenever he’s around which I know makes DD happy. But I can’t shake the feeling that this is going to end in tears again.

I’m just rambling now but I feel so stuck. Do I step back completely and let her figure it out? Or do I keep trying to push her to see that this is not a stable situation for her and soon to be two children? I’m exhausted if I’m honest and don’t know if I’m making things worse by always being there to pick up the pieces.

You would hope so. I also had kids far too young (not quite as young as OPs dd though) but made sure I only had 2 with a smallish age gap. I had my youngest at 22. Now in my early 30s and they are both secondary school age, it’s lovely to have so much independence back whilst still being young.

OPs DD situation isn’t totally hopeless at this point, she just needs to see the light, realise she can do better and stop throwing her life away with this boy, make sure she doesn’t get pregnant again and concentrate building a decent life for her babies, get qualifications and job, aim towards a car and house etc.

Had a long talk with DD tonight. She still insists she loves him and that he’s a good dad. I just sat and listened for a while because I feel like if I argue with her she’ll just shut down completely. She told me he’s agreed to go to the anger management sessions after all, which is something I suppose, but then apparently he asked her if she’d stay with him if he does. She said yes of course she would which makes me wonder if he’s just doing it to keep her happy rather than for himself. They apparently had an argument the other day about him fighting again, she told him she was worried he’d get locked up if he kept going down that path and he got really upset with her.

I told her again that I’m worried about how unstable things feel right now and that she’s got to think about not just herself but grandson and the new baby. She just said she can handle it and that he’s trying. I want to believe her but I’ve seen this cycle so many times already, he’s good for a bit then it all goes wrong again.

I don’t want to ban him from the house because then I won’t know what’s going on at all. At least when he’s here I can see how he’s behaving with her and with grandson. If I tell him he’s not welcome I think she’d just go over there more and I’d lose that insight completely.

I just feel drained. I want to support her and keep her safe but also get her to see that she’s pinning all her hopes on someone who keeps letting her down. Tonight’s chat was calm and we didn’t argue which is good but I still don’t feel like we’re moving forward. I feel like we’re just going round in circles and I’m waiting for the next thing to blow up.

What is she going to do about contraception going forward?

I think this actually sounds quite positive. You can’t get her to see anything - she’ll do that in her own time. You can keep the lines of communication open and you absolutely can set boundaries for her in your home. I wouldn’t ban him from visiting, I’d encourage it at set times that mean he spends time with her and with the child in your line of sight/hearing so you can really get the measure of things. Sit down to dinner together, talk, he looks after the little one, puts him to bed etc and he leaves by a sensible bedtime. No smoking in the house or garden, no visiting if he’s under the influence. He would probably benefit from routine too, and can either prove himself or mess up. If you give him as many chances as you can bear, while maintaining your boundaries (whatever those are for you) it’s more likely your daughter will see you as an ally and not a pushover or an enemy.

How can she handle it OP? She's a child. Handling it means managing and moving forward. She isn't doing any of this. She's just making it more and more complicated with another already complicated child.

They don't have a hope of making this work out in the best interests of the two babies.

I think she (and most adults) would find it hard to handle life with this boy if she didn't have any kids never mind two.

And this talk of 'loving' him. Its pie in the sky. Its lust and fantasy.

Are you happy to raise two babies? Its down to you really at the end of the day.

I'm a 'girl mom' to four DDs and I also have a boy.

The issue here is why this girl chose such an unavailable loser in the first place. Then why she was OK with his refusal to use a condom, then why she stuck with him regardless of his fecklessness, baggage, and patently obvious weaknesses as a partner and as a parent - twice. Why was she happy to take the risk of pregnancy? Did she plan both pregnancies?

She's a girl who insists she can get a square peg through a round hole, probably with an immature idea of relationships as some kind of fairy tale, where the love of the beautiful princess turns a toad into a prince, beauty tames the beast, yada yada. It's a problem of self concept and self esteem.

She needs to get therapy and to stick with it. She needs the resilience to accept some home truths about her complete lack of boundaries, and she needs some motivation to develop a healthy idea of herself, her own limitations, and what she can and cannot put others through.

Each of these teenage parents brought their own vulnerabilities to the table.

The OP can insist that the DD engage with therapy as a condition of remaining at home with her children, and can set rules about contact with the BF, e.g. if he wants to see his children, he can commit to sobriety via a 12 step programme. I would strongly encourage the OP to put her foot down very firmly and insist on compromises on the part of the daughter and the boy.

I suspect a lot of posters can relate to being hoping and having a boyfriend you desperately want to change, who you feel responsible for changing. Most of us were lucky enough to have gone through that with men who were far more decent and less troubled then the DDs boyfriend.

most of us matured out of it too x

This completely. As someone who worked with young people in care I’m a bit frustrated by her attitude towards this boy.

Yes he’s no angel but her daughter is at least half to blame for this.

Anger management is a huge pile of BS, and he's only going because he got arrested.

He'll play on his phone during the sessions, roll his eyes, plan ahead to when he can next lay his hands on some weed, and collect his certificate at the end, and nothing will change.

OP, tell your DD you're going to find and pay for a counselor for her so she can have an independent person just for her to talk all this through with. It is very possible that she's putting on an 'Everything Is GREAT' facade for your benefit to hide what she knows deep down, but won't admit to you.

Then find and pay for that counselor. Do whatever it takes to get her to keep at it.

You might find a counselor via Women's Aid (0808 2000 247).

Poor poor babies. What's her excuse regarding contraception?

She’s also a girl who knowingly had sex with a very damaged 14 year old

why on earth is he a feckless loser and she is somehow a victim

she is not ‘amazing’, she is very, very lucky to have her mum in her corner

this boy has nobody

Does she think HE can handle it? And that it’s a good thing to put another child sized responsibility on him? These are such big decisions and obligations for a 16 & 17 year old.

I wish you luck OP and hope DD can dig deep and step up to the plate for these little lives she created without it falling on you.

She wasn't OK with no condom, she felt obliged. The conversation goes:
Her: do you not have a condom?
Him: I don't use condoms.
Her: I'm not on the pill/forgot the pill, can you be careful?
Him: awww, course babe, I wouldn't hurt you.
And then he does whatever the fuck he wants anyway.
Then when she's just given birth, he's at her again. Cos, it's funny isn't it? And then she's pregnant again. And that's funny too.

It depends on the circumstances of grandparents. Here op has no other adult to help her raise 2 small kids while also working and dealing with a difficult daughter.

She was 15 at the time! When I was 15 I wouldn't have had a clue what made for a damaged 14 year old. If a boy I liked had told me he had been through fostering and was doing fine for himself I'd have 100% believed him.

She is extremely lucky to have her mum in her corner, I agree. My heart breaks for the boy, who will feel like he has nobody in his. And he doesn't, not long-term.

I used to be friends with a foster carer who had a foster boy child who could have been this boy. He has since left their care and his life is... not doing very well. The odds in his life were stacked against him from the moment he was conceived by two people who were unfit to parent him, and he is, unfortunately, living according to the statistical probabilities that others have talked about in this thread. I saw it going that way from when he was 13 or 14, too. It's him who I think of when I read about this boy.

Op you cannot have a chat with your dd as equals. She is so young and clueless. She knows nothing if she thinks he is a good father, and I don’t blame her because she never had one. But you need to stop letting her do this much talking as she is some wise woman who has ever planned and sorted. She needs to start listening to you and you need to show authority. You have seen more life, you work, you are managing a home, you tell her how life works. This boy cannot be a good father because he is too young and too troubled, not because he is a bad person. She cannot expect him to take this responsibility. It was her decision to have kids. So she should know it’s her responsibility to care for them and bring them up. You need to tell her that.

Some common sense on this thresd at last. She is not your equal OP, but you keep treating her like one and letting her gab on.

And what did she say when you asked her how exactly she was going to handle it?

Exactly this. I wanted to write the exact same, this woman doesn’t realise how much help she is providing and the sacrifices she’s making as it is. I would have been fired out of the house first time round and I’m not even 20 years older then the daughter.

OP: you need to start doing less for your daughter NOW. Don’t wait til this second baby is born because you’ll find yourself burning the candle at both ends and it sounds like you are already suffering as it is and you have a full time job to hold down.

I don’t have any advice op but am interested in what course she is doing? If it had placements I’m guessing health and social care? If it is nursing she is intending on going into I’m not sure how she will manage that with 2 small babies without your help, but with shift work and uni work so just something else to think about as I’ve just finished mine with 3 children and a husband and the most stressful part was sorting out childcare for them and I’m In my 30s!

When her BF said to your DD 'do whatever' when he found out about the pregnancy - did you mention to her that having a termination was an option?
Has anyone actually discussed this with her at any point?

OP as people said in your last thread, you are being incredibly passive.

Your DD is a child, already raising a child and now bringing another one into this shit show. I would be being clear on what is acceptable behaviour from both DD and BF.

Also, as soon as your DD gives birth you need to have a plan in place for birth control.

Not sure how soon you can have a contraceptive implant after giving birth but that's the kind of thing I would be looking into. Your DD has proven she cannot be trusted on this

People judging the OP for 'allowing' her daughter to have sex are not being helpful. At the end of the day unless you prevent your teenager ever leaving the house without you, you cannot prevent them having sex if they want to. And if they really want to, they will sneak out while 'grounded' etc. If you ban the boyfriend from your house they will have sex in the park, behind the bike sheds etc. OP was working fulltime and couldn't watch her daughter 24/7.

I would have tried to insist on much more reliable contraception though but again you can't literally force a teen to do it.

All you can do is try to have the best relationship possible with them so they trust you to help them. But it's hard to get the balance of not doing everything for them.

The best outcome here would be the daughter getting some qualifications and hopefully some self esteem by going to college, with the help of college nursery, so that she can be encouraged to step up and parent these children. Unless the father can step up too, she's better off without him, and I'd agree that possibly moving away so its inconvenient for him to see her would be good, though not an easy thing to do.

She still insists she loves him and that he’s a good dad.

and this is where 95% of the problem lies. The pair of them barely function as adults, never mind parents.

The level of control some posters claim have and be willing to exert over their teens on this thread is bordering on criminal, as well as cruel and traumatic.

I’m generously assuming they’re just getting carried away with the excitement of admonishing another woman