How do I deal with this hurtful behaviour?

[Changeling78]

My DD15 can be so moody and spiteful, she will stomp around the house grunting. I went to give her a hug this morning, she shook me off and recoiled. Now, I know she doesn’t have to accept a hug from me but I also want her to realise that the way she speaks and acts towards people does affect them. It’s so hurtful. If she is tired or grumpy she makes our lives miserable. I’d say this is her personality 75% of the time.
I have to take her to collect her new glasses tonight and we’ll normally call in for Macdonalds…but I don’t want to. I know it’s childish but I’m hurt.

Car always a good place to talk you driving them in passenger seat - less pressure. Lots is probably hormones and exam stress. Mine is 17. Space works. Humour/empathy - I’m peri menopause so have mood swings etc too. I don’t tolerate rudeness and pull up on inconsiderate behaviour eg eating all of x and not telling anyone. Having a chat when I’m calmer. Basic expectations eg re laundry, not leaving pots in room. Time together we have days out shopping, lunch just 2 of us, watch film sometimes. Welcoming to her friends. A pt job from 16 has done mine good in McDonalds she’s appalled at the rude entitled behaviour of some of customers. She also volunteers with me once a week.

It sounds like you want a lot from her that she just isn't able to give. I'd back off quite a lot. Stop trying to hug her - I love my mum but I really, really, fucking hate hugging, especially when it's foisted on me, especially when it's clear that the hugger has a need that they are prioritising over mine. I love hugs from my DP but very few other people. If my stepdaughter is upset, I will ask her if she wants a hug, but it's about whether she wants to be hugged, not whether I do.

When she's moody, back off. Leave her to it. When she's in a good mood, encourage that behaviour. I think you're in an ignore the bad (unless it's really bad), praise the good situation. Being a teenage girl can be godawful and the sense I'm getting from what you say is this is about you needing affection. I'm sure she loves you, but she just may not be able to express it at the moment.

I don't think there's anything wrong with reminding her that basic courtesy still exists, and if she can't trouble herself to thank you for making her lunch or whatever, then you may feel less inclined to treat her. On the flip side, I remember being a teen and sometimes the reason I didn't speak was because it was all I could do not to stop myself from crying or exploding with rage. Not for any reason other than crazy hormones - I still remember when I was 13 being SO upset that my mum came into my tap lesson!

I do not think that her refusing hugs and you being 'so hurt' is reasonable. Esp as per your later updates it feels like a lot might be those hormones making her unreasonably irritable.

Teens are generally grumpy anyway, My DD16 has down days and I’ll ask him ONCE is he ok, if he says yes I let him know ONCE that I’m around if he’s not and wants to chat about it, nobody likes to be hen pecked about why they’re moody particularly if they don’t even know why themselves.
How is she around other people? If her attitude is aimed mostly towards you I’d expect that you’re griping her in some way. No amount of ‘cheer up’ has ever made anybody cheer up and if you’re constantly ‘trying’ to make her into a bubblier, more social member of the household she’s probably sick to death of you mithering her.
Do you spend much time with her 1:1? Does she have younger siblings and possibly feels pushed out? Do you know much about her interests / hobbies that you could home in on and show that you see her for more than a grumpy, sulky teen?
If she’s forever being told she’s miserable and moody then she’s likely to act accordingly. If she’s not being specifically antagonist, goading or creating an argument herself I’d look at yourself & your family dynamics and adjust accordingly.

To be honest if my teenager was that bad I’d want him to move out!
Maybe girls are worse than boys!?
That doesn’t sound like general teenage moodiness to me that sounds like an almost adult with no manners or respect.

I'd use the maccy trip as a talking tool. If you ask her if she wants to stop there she'll have to answer. Maybe ask if there's a different place she'd like to try?
Can you then use that time to talk? Not about your hurt, that goes with the territory but about her? She might be fed up about school, exams, homework, her spots, whatever.
Listen, let her tell you, don't try to fix it unless she wants help.

Dd is similar. Its a difficult time !

She was worse when tired. But would never accept she was tired. The first rule of being tired is to completely deny that you are tired.

I know ppl will say be nice to her, shower her with love and attention, but in all honesty I found she would buck her ideas up if I read the occasional riot act.

I'd definitely pull her up on rudeness - teenagers need reminding to say please, thanks, bye etc.

However, I think you need to consider to what extent your expectations are unreasonable. Teenagers are engaging in a process of separation from parents - this is absolutely necessary if they are to become independent adults. That might mean she doesn't look to you for hugs, or that she needs space when she's in a bad mood rather than constant chats about feelings. These aren't signs that she doesn't care about you, they're signs that she is becoming an adult.

I remember my teenage moods.

Part of it was feeling shame for my reactions. I wasn’t placated with treats, my mother gave me space. I think what helped her is she never took it personally ie — she is not my friend.

She would watch her shows, make her calls and I’d usually come around in my own way. She gave herself grace in that instance and gave me grace.

As I matured I learned to apologize for how I reacted, and that was inspired by the times I had her apologize to me when she may have been curt, or in a mood at times.

She’s a teenager — let her find her coping mechanisms ( don’t help her develop one involving treats ) and she will get through it.
Her world is a prime time drama right now and you are a supporting character — once you realize that you may be able to humor it.

This, my teenager has their moments but generally pretty good really we don't tolerate rudeness nor blaming hormones for bad behaviour

Behaviour does get a little worse when we try to much so we step back and let conversation happen naturally, we are trying to naturally navigate and try and behave the way we expect return behaviour

We are not perfect but nor is our teenager but we try

@fdgdfgdfgdfg You sound like a fantastic parent. Your DD is very lucky.

Totally normal teen behavoir. We had this from 15 til 17 and now mine is lovely! Patience, love and a gentle reminder that youre a human being…she’ll still be a grumpy bugger, but It’ll pass.

@Changeling78 at her age, everything you say and do feels extreme to her. I remember how just being near my poor mum felt so annoying. I couldn't control it. I just disliked her for no reason and things were so bad my wonderful mum had to go on anti depressants and I was the good kid! It only lasted a couple of years and now we are best friends.

It's unfair, unreasonable but it is temporary and just hormones.

Try to take a step back from her. Let her be. She will come to you for affection or treats when she wants them. Don't fuss over her. She isn't in the headspace to want to be with mum. She just wants her phone, her mates and maybe a boyfriend. Everything else sucks to her.

In the meantime, you can pull her up when she is being really rude and point out she wouldn't speak to her pals that way and still have them so she needs to check her cheek! She'll roll her eyes and huff but she will hear you.

Hang in there. This phase is like terrible twos and isn't forever.

She's old enough to make her own lunch and do more things for herself if she's being rude and not thanking you for it. I'd say the not hugging is typical grumpy teen behaviour.

I'd also be calling her out on the rudeness every time (not the hug thing).

they can be absolute moody fuckers that brings down the mood of the entire household at that age. Conversely when they're in a good mood they lift everyone (that's my experience of me, being at boarding school surrounded by girls that age, and my DCs)

TBH it's a now-win situation. So just say "have a nice day" etc, bin the hugs, but tell her that you expect a minimum of politeness, son not just grabbing the lunch you have made for her. Consequence: if she forgets to do it again, she makes her own lunches.

Don't tie McD to today's non-hug. But just don't go - don't mention it, don't offer it as a reward, nothing. Next time you need to run errands with her, and she's not moody: McD or something. She'll work it out (like Pavlov's dogs)

I won’t comment on the parenting but please stop trying to force physical affection on her. If you INSIST on “keep trying to hug her” because of your own hang ups with your parents, ask first. It is not ok to force yourself on someone if they don’t want it.

She bears the consequences of her actions and in actions and the rest of the household enjoy themselves irrespective. Don't give a child such power.

Bad manners and anti social behaviour earn consequences. Tell her what is or isn't acceptable and outline what she can lose.

When my teenager acts this way, I assume something is upsetting them. Usually it is an age appropriate boundary they want to put in place but in subconsciously not ready to relinquish control off. I would have thought that a moody teenager needs a macdonalds even more than an a non moody one. Out and out rude behaviour needs calling out but the shrugging off a hug is communication you’re choosing to view as hurtful rather than information.
In biological terms, human teenagers used to go off and join another tribe. It was biologically useful for 15-24 years old to want to get away from their own families otherwise they’d never be brave enough to leave. It fades in mid twenties. It does totally press my buttons when my teenagers take me for granted, unreasonably moody etc but I’m so glad I’m here as their soft place to land anytime they want. My Mum was section when I was a child so I know what if I s like not to have that.

Personally, once they hit 14 I view my “active parenting” days as over. I’ve had my opportunity to shape them and now it’s up to them to decide who they want to be. Im now a safe place for them to land as they work their way to adulthood. I offer advice and am always there in an instant if they want me, but shut up and leave them if they don’t want it. I offer them lifts even when I would rather be in bed and they’re welcome to hid out in their rooms as much as they want.

Is it bad manners though or wanting to interact differently and rebelling a bit when that isn’t accepted. Also once teenagers it is up to them how well mannered they want to be surely?

This. Eldest son was vile as a teen. When he left for university I felt 99% relief. His younger brother was much more relaxed without him there. The whole house had a different feel to it. There were no sudden explosions. No worries, when his bedroom door flew open, about what tirade was about to be unleashed. I might be mother of the year. I might be a total bitch. Equally likely to be either.He shared a flat in halls in his first year and houses with friends in second and third. Living with others who behaved just like him was absolutely transformative. He finally saw his selfish, entitled ,rude behaviour reflected back at him and realised why everyone at home had been so exhausted by it. He phoned and apologised. He is great now.
Count the months Op.
Avoid creating situations where you expect a positive reaction and will feel hurt when you don't get one.
Don't initiate hugs. Let your daughter seek one if she wants rather than forcing one on her.
A lot of us peri and post menopausal women don't want to be touched. She is a raging ball of hormones. Maybe she doesn't want to be touched either just now.I love my husband but before HRT I had to consciously stop myself screaming " Get off me".
Pick your battles.
Don't reward vile behaviour. Bit don't punish her for not wanting something you want.
Speak to her quietly and calmly everytime she responds with anger and rudeness. It may de escalate the situation, it may not, but if she doesn't get a screaming reaction back she will quickly end up with nowhere to take it.

I had a few years of this with my son. I would secretly cry after our interactions. Always knew it would come and that it would be a phase but hurtful none the less.

I made sure to picked my battles very carefully and stayed out of his way mostly. He’s a lovely man now and we’re very close.

Teenagers can be fucking awful, up to a point I'm willing to make allowances for hormones etc but they still need to know they can't treat people like shite and get away with it.

Thanks. It all evens out in the end though.

I sat on my phone and paid so little attention during swimming lessons that I didn't notice when she nearly drowned and the swimming teacher had to rescue her.

Imaginative play with her dolls and toys was the closest thing to torture I've ever experienced.

When she was little she once told my Mum that "I love Daddy but he likes the computer more than me" That one was a hell of a wake up call.

So no, not fantastic. But much better as the parent of a teen than I ever was as the parent of a small child.