DD1 (17) and DH had a 'scuffle' last night

[MerryMarigold]

I feel sad and overwhelmed. I'm not sure what to do or how to handle this. DS1 and Dh had an argument about the cat late last night, about 11.30pm. Dh let the cat out and wouldn't allow DS to let him back in as if the cat's in overnight he sometimes poos on the sofa, which is really disgusting. If the cat is out, he scratches on DS's window to come back in (DS struggles to sleep so it wakes him up and he has to get up to let him in, which he's not happy about). Hence arguing about whether he should be in or out.

Cue DS screaming and shouting at Dh and getting in his personal space. Then Dh shouting back. I was in bed already but I could hear it. It's not that unusual (DS loses it at times, I'm fairly sure there are issues but he masks well at school. He's broken his own hand in the past punching a wall). Dh was exhausted: very, very long day (including dropping DS1 to bowling and picking him up earlier in the evening). Dh pushed DS away from him. Must have been quite a hard push because DS was on the floor (so he told me) and then DS kicked Dh in the balls. I think at that point Dh walked away because that was it. I was not aware of any of this until this morning. I just heard the shouting stop and was grateful. Dh is now not speaking to ds1. He said he's still physically in pain.

It's such a mess. They have a pretty bad relationship as it is. What's an outsider's perspective on this?

Because the husband was putting the cat out all night in sub zero temperatures!

For goodness sake get a cat flap. The current set up is ridiculous.
Sorry don't know what to say about your husband and son. Just feel sorry for the cat.

@Badwithmoney it's easy to have a conversation about that without aggressively confronting somebody.

To the people blaming the DH, if this boy screams in his partner’s face, and she pushes him out of the way, will it be understandable if he punches her? After all she started it. No? Didn’t think so.

The 17 year old started it. And he’s not a baby, he knows right from wrong.

And no-one wants a cat that shits everywhere. Vile and I would be getting rid of the vile thing.

DS loses it at times, I'm fairly sure there are issues but he masks well at school. He's broken his own hand in the past punching a wall). Dh was exhausted: very, very long day (including dropping DS1 to bowling and picking him up earlier in the evening). Dh pushed DS away from him. Must have been quite a hard push because DS was on the floor

This reads as though you think your disabled son deserved to be assaulted by his dad because he's struggling with the cat waking him up at night. You explain why ds is hard work, then explain dh was really tired - like there was nothing else dh could have done.

Your cat shitting on the sofa isn't your son's problem, but it's being made his problem because the cat is disturbing him. While his dad gets to kick the cat out then enjoy a lovely night's sleep.

Your dh has behaved appallingly but you seem to think it was justified to shove him so hard he fell on the floor because he is struggling with broken sleep and his dad not caring how him kicking the cat out is disturbing your son.

With his adhd, your son is probably feeling like he's less important than the sofa at this point.

We don’t know who verbally aggravated the situation first it’s perfectly reasonable to question an adult putting an defenceless animal out in sub zero temperatures for the entire night. All we do know for definite is that the father admitted to putting hands on his son first and his father pushed him to the ground. A grown adult man showing no concern for a pet cat is a big red flag for me I would say the 17 year old showing empathy and understanding that this is not an acceptable way to treat a pet shows he is more responsible than his own father. The facts speak for themselves. Cruelty to animals cruelty to human beings same ball park IMO. The father is responsible not the 17 year old he was reacting to his cruel father subjecting the pet cat to pain and suffering and then himself being pushed forcibly to the floor!

To the people blaming the DH, if this boy screams in his partner’s face, and she pushes him out of the way, will it be understandable if he punches her? After all she started it. No? Didn’t think so.

If a man was shouting in his adult partners face because she was mistreating their pet and/or causing him disturbed nights sleep because she was neglecting an issue that she was responsible for
AND THEN she shoved him to the floor and he lashed out and kicked her

I’d think they were both abusive.

but given this is an adult child relationship AND the DS didn’t punch anyone you’re whole “what if” is largely pointless.

There is a madness in this posting as far as the cat is concerned. It is slightly crazy the amount of comments addressing the cat which seems to be looked after fine

@wishmyhousetidy you sound like an animal torturing psycho just like the OP’s husband.

wow you just sound crazy. The op clearly cares about her cat and she had requested help about the relationship between her son and husband. Calm yourself

@wishmyhousetidy I wouldn’t make excuses for my husband if he tried to throw our cat out for the night and then assaulted our teenage DS because he tried to stop him. I’m happy to be labelled crazy by somebody like you as you obviously have no empathy or compassion for defenceless animals or children.

Some people need to seriously calm down on this thread.

I feel sorry for the 17 year old he’s been made out to be a violent adolescent after reacting to being shoved to ground by his own Dad just for trying to stop the poor cat being put out all night in the freezing cold. What was OP doing just ignoring all this and laying in bed?

Surprised to see so many defending the DH, and calling the DS violent, explosive etc., when the DH was the first to physically attack, and quite a powerful attack too, not just a little push away. Someone being "in your face" doesn't justify pushing them so hard they fall over, an act that can and does kill people if they hit their head wrong when they fall.

Kicking someone in the balls can be the kind of physical attack that people use when they know their opponent is bigger and stronger and willing to violently demonstrate that, and they want to incapacitate them fast by hitting a weak spot — it's the sort of thing that's mentioned a lot when women talk about what they could do if a man attacked them (though whether it's a good idea in that situation is another question). It's often the response of the scared, weaker party. It's not okay, not at all, but it's not the kind of thing an aggressive bloke trying to show that he's the big boss now would do.

And for all we know the fact he ended up on the for was a dramatic over reaction and he deliberately fell to the floor

as for the cat if it was mine and shitting on the furniture it’d be outside re homed or put to sleep

Wow, I've never had such a response to a thread. I'll have to mention the cat(s) more often. And dog. Did I mention the dog is a Cockapoo? 🤣 That could spark the MN crowd.

Seriously though, the debate between DH and DS on here I have gone through plenty of times in my own head. The fact there is no consensus is because they are both in the wrong I think, which is what I felt. I'll do my best, but ultimately it's not up to me to fix either of them. Thanks for the posters pointing that out. As a mother I can take too much responsibility. I can support DS in getting counseling. I can warn Dh about his relationship with his son. That's about all. If they don't want to listen then it's not my responsibility - although, sadly, it is still my problem.

Way to go. Washing your hands of your husband shoving your son around.

A word of caution: my father stood by and watched as my mother behaved badly towards me, half heartedly intervening only when things really escalated.

i have very little to do worth either parent now.

Your son will always remember your role in ignoring the violence of his father.

That's weirdly passive.
I'd be taking the DH and the Ds aside separately for a discussion/chat about this. Not in a 'need a stern word' way, but in a 'come on let's talk, things have been tricky for you recently haven't they' way.
I'd be wanting to talk to them about their approach, some perspective on how I see it and a constructive chat about what might improve it.
I'd also be reminding them of how on cloud 9 they were when they had a good time together and appreciated each other.

Surely if your DH is struggling with something or making things worse you'd discuss it with him if it wasany topic never mind one that was impacting the mental health of your teen Ds!

The fact you're not using your influence as mum and wife to try to help improve things is odd to me. You could play an important role to help as sounding board, coach, much needed outside perspective, diplomat, arbitrator etc etc.

Sorry, just re-read your post and I had focused on the 'not my responsibility' bit over the warnings and support for counselling bits.
My fault for skim reading.

I know you feel it’s not about the cat, but it kind of is, because the point is that your DS was correct, and your DH would not admit that DH was in the wrong and instead escalated to physically trying to dominate your DS. It was predictable and inevitable that your DS would respond physically to that. Your DH was literally teaching your DS that “might is right” and that violence is the way to solve conflict. I suspect that many of your problems with DS originate in DH’s behaviour.

This argument simply wouldn’t have happened if your DH had listened calmly to DS, thought about his points, and admitted that he was in the wrong. I’m guessing that your DH rarely listens to another’s point of view and allows it to change his mind?

In English winters it is too cold for cats to be outdoors at night and it can make them very ill, even kill them. Last night was a very heavy frost in South East. If you want an ‘outdoors cat’ then you need to build a heated shelter in the garden, I know people who have those. And a cat that poos on the sofa instead of in a litter tray is either old or ill. Is there perhaps a small room with a wipeable floor (toilet? Cupboard?) where cat and litter tray could be shut in over night? Shutting a cat outside in freezing temperatures is animal abuse.

If you allow your DH to abuse an animal, you can’t be surprised when your DS abuses your DH.

And your DH ‘refusing to speak’ to DS is a massive red flag. Stonewalling is emotionally abusive.

Good luck. Sounds exhausting and I can see you’re caught in the middle. But please start noticing your husband’s emotionally abusive behaviour. To the cat, to your DS, and I suspect also to you.

Poor cat. He needs a vet visit. In the meantime put a puppy pad on the sofa

Then re home your poor cat

Well aren't you a gem 🙄

This. Cats over humans any day