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Teenagers

Parenting teenagers has its ups and downs. Get advice from Mumsnetters here.

Original poster

DD1 (17) and DH had a 'scuffle' last night

176 replies

MerryMarigold · 25/02/2023 16:35

I feel sad and overwhelmed. I'm not sure what to do or how to handle this. DS1 and Dh had an argument about the cat late last night, about 11.30pm. Dh let the cat out and wouldn't allow DS to let him back in as if the cat's in overnight he sometimes poos on the sofa, which is really disgusting. If the cat is out, he scratches on DS's window to come back in (DS struggles to sleep so it wakes him up and he has to get up to let him in, which he's not happy about). Hence arguing about whether he should be in or out.

Cue DS screaming and shouting at Dh and getting in his personal space. Then Dh shouting back. I was in bed already but I could hear it. It's not that unusual (DS loses it at times, I'm fairly sure there are issues but he masks well at school. He's broken his own hand in the past punching a wall). Dh was exhausted: very, very long day (including dropping DS1 to bowling and picking him up earlier in the evening). Dh pushed DS away from him. Must have been quite a hard push because DS was on the floor (so he told me) and then DS kicked Dh in the balls. I think at that point Dh walked away because that was it. I was not aware of any of this until this morning. I just heard the shouting stop and was grateful. Dh is now not speaking to ds1. He said he's still physically in pain.

It's such a mess. They have a pretty bad relationship as it is. What's an outsider's perspective on this?

OP posts:
PegasusReturns · 26/02/2023 09:29

A 17 year old boy is old enough to inflict serious harm to an adult. The OP said her son often has violent outbursts

Why are you defending a grown man?! A 17 yr old boy big and strong enough to inflict “serious harm to an adult” must have been pushed pretty bloody hard to end up on the floor?

The OP didn’t say her son often has violent outbursts. She said there’s often shouting and one occasion where he punched a wall. Not the same thing. teenagers get angry. They push boundaries. Being shoved to the floor is not an acceptable response.

MichelleScarn · 26/02/2023 09:29

Dh pushed DS away from him. Must have been quite a hard push because DS was on the floor (so he told me) and then DS kicked Dh in the balls
Op have you spoken to both DH and DS about the incident? Is dh also saying that Ds was pushed to the floor?
The ds is old enough to know his behaviour is out of order, as is DH!

SwordToFlamethrower · 26/02/2023 09:31

Get rid of the cat, it sounds fucking awful

SwordToFlamethrower · 26/02/2023 09:32

Also, get a cat litter tray

SoCunningYouCanStickATailOnItAndCallItAFox · 26/02/2023 09:49

Neuro typical people have breaking points too. No one had behaved well but there are stressors on both sides in this and it sounds like DH did walk away when it was really needed, albeit in an ideal world a de-escalation was needed sooner.
A solution needs to be found for the cat both people had valid concerns.

I think both should acknowledge the others concerns over the cat problem and apologise for what happened.

Neverknowinglyunderbold · 26/02/2023 09:50

PegasusReturns · 26/02/2023 09:29

A 17 year old boy is old enough to inflict serious harm to an adult. The OP said her son often has violent outbursts

Why are you defending a grown man?! A 17 yr old boy big and strong enough to inflict “serious harm to an adult” must have been pushed pretty bloody hard to end up on the floor?

The OP didn’t say her son often has violent outbursts. She said there’s often shouting and one occasion where he punched a wall. Not the same thing. teenagers get angry. They push boundaries. Being shoved to the floor is not an acceptable response.

Did you miss where the OP said he punched the wall so hard, he broke his arm and that he is getting more and more difficult as he gets older? He is a few months shy of 18 according to the OP. For all we know, he could be big in stature or be of equal stature to his father.

This is someone out of control and whose violence is escalating.

The DS started the violence by invading his father’s space and screaming and shouting, no doubt aggressively. That is violence too. If the DS behaved this way to his mother or younger sibling it would be seen as completely unjustifiable on MN but because his father is at the receiving end, it’s okay?

If the father was as bad as he is being made out to be, he would not have walked away but perhaps retaliated further. He showed restraint.

Moreover, we don’t know if the DS was really pushed to the floor. The OP isn’t sure herself as she intimated in her post.

PegasusReturns · 26/02/2023 10:24

Did you miss where the OP said he punched the wall so hard, he broke his arm and that he is getting more and more difficult as he gets older

I literally reference the punching the wall in my post Hmm Teenagers are often difficult. Difficult does not equal violent. If there was a history of violence against people I’m sure OP would have mentioned it.

The fact is the father shoved the son to the floor, in no world is shoving someone to the floor “restraint” and if that’s genuinely your view your perspective is warped.

Original poster
MerryMarigold · 26/02/2023 10:35

Strugglingtodomybest · 26/02/2023 09:01

Why bother reading the thread when you can see an opportunity to make a 'witty' reply 🙄

OP, I think you should do what you think will work for your family's dynamics. I would also say, try not to tie yourself up in knots over it all too, step back a bit and know that this is their relationship and they need to sort it out between themselves to a certain extent. What I discovered after our incident, was that I had been getting in between them too much, and their relationship had not been evolving naturally.

Show quote history

Thank you @Strugglingtodomybest sometimes I wonder if I've got in their way. Then other times I think I need to because there is a lot which has gone undealt with. There would be even more if I didn't say something. This situation would have been totally ignored after the event. I've said to DS and Dh they should apologise. Neither has yet or talked about it. We'll see...

OP posts:
Original poster
MerryMarigold · 26/02/2023 10:44

@PegasusReturns and @Neverknowinglyunderbold DS is slightly taller than Dh but much slighter (he's extremely slim and not physically fit). Dh is a lot stronger than DS. In fact 14yo Ds2 is probably stronger than Ds.

He didn't break his arm. He broke a small bone in his hand and we didn't realize it was broken for several days (DS still claimed it was fine right up until the x-ray result!). His outbursts are hugely emotional and he's broken things in his room at times, but he never does this around anyone else except us and is a model pupil in school (in fact a bit of a target for bullying in younger years). We set up some counseling for him last summer after GCSEs but he didn't want it.

OP posts:
Viviennemary · 26/02/2023 10:48

I don't know how old your DS is but he does sound as if he needs to be taken in hand for his violent behaviour.

rwalker · 26/02/2023 10:52

PegasusReturns · 26/02/2023 09:29

A 17 year old boy is old enough to inflict serious harm to an adult. The OP said her son often has violent outbursts

Why are you defending a grown man?! A 17 yr old boy big and strong enough to inflict “serious harm to an adult” must have been pushed pretty bloody hard to end up on the floor?

The OP didn’t say her son often has violent outbursts. She said there’s often shouting and one occasion where he punched a wall. Not the same thing. teenagers get angry. They push boundaries. Being shoved to the floor is not an acceptable response.

Her Dh tried to walk away DS was aggressively in his personal space how would you suggest her DH gets him out of his personal space
were talking an 17 year old adult lad not a child

Neverknowinglyunderbold · 26/02/2023 10:58

MerryMarigold · 26/02/2023 10:44

@PegasusReturns and @Neverknowinglyunderbold DS is slightly taller than Dh but much slighter (he's extremely slim and not physically fit). Dh is a lot stronger than DS. In fact 14yo Ds2 is probably stronger than Ds.

He didn't break his arm. He broke a small bone in his hand and we didn't realize it was broken for several days (DS still claimed it was fine right up until the x-ray result!). His outbursts are hugely emotional and he's broken things in his room at times, but he never does this around anyone else except us and is a model pupil in school (in fact a bit of a target for bullying in younger years). We set up some counseling for him last summer after GCSEs but he didn't want it.

Your son, tall and fragile, punched a wall, broke a bone or some sort, squared up to your husband, invade his space, shouting aggressor, kicked him in the groin, with emotional outbursts getting worse.

Ultimately, you’ll hopefully focus on where the real problem is and get appropriate help, masking or no masking. Today your DH, tomorrow either you or his younger sibling. Your husband is stronger than him, you said, but that did not stop him.

If he tries this on someone else out in the big wide world, they may not just shove him out if they’re space and walk away after a kick to the groin.

Neverknowinglyunderbold · 26/02/2023 10:59
  • out of their space and walk away after a kick to the groin
Neverknowinglyunderbold · 26/02/2023 11:02

Has he had an official diagnosis of a condition? You reference several but it isn’t clear whether that is your assessment/assumption or he has been to the doctor or other appropriate professional.

PegasusReturns · 26/02/2023 11:09

Her Dh tried to walk away DS was aggressively in his personal space how would you suggest her DH gets him out of his personal space

there’s no suggestion that her DH tried to walk away, he was shouting back at the DS and then he escalated it with actual violence.

yelling back at an angry child is never going to lead to a positive resolution 🤷‍♀️

PegasusReturns · 26/02/2023 11:15

OP persevere with the offer of counselling. My DS wouldn’t do it age 15 but changed his mind at 16.

im not sure how much he got from it but it took pressure off me trying to be the fixer of everything.

chezpopbang · 26/02/2023 11:21

Husband sounds like a right dick head. Cat should not be waking child up over night. You should have cat locked somewhere he has chance to poo. With a proper litter tray. The adult should never have pushed the teenager.

Badwithmoney · 26/02/2023 11:22

Your DH has to take full responsibility for this situation escalating. You shouldn’t force a cat to stay out all night either. 17 year olds need their sleep it’s very important they get enough sleep. DH needs to apologise first.

LexMitior · 26/02/2023 11:42

Your son needs to learn to regulate his behaviour. Or he will find that someone outside the house will do it for him.

Kicking his father in the balls is beyond childish. If he did that to a stranger he would not to be so lucky as to have the matter cease.

I would support your husband. Unless he was literally pushing your son aggressively, one way to read this is that he sensibly moved your son away because it was getting heated.

Kicking someone in the genitals is not pushing boundaries. It is assault. If he did it you, OP, you would be appalled and physically hurt.

Your son is also 17 and is well accountable for his actions. First thing to do is get him engaged in something that will allow him to channel his testosterone but he had better be punished for this or your house and home life will be utterly screwed for years.

Badwithmoney · 26/02/2023 11:50

@LexMitior When you've been pushed to the ground it’s a natural reaction to lash out. He probably didn’t even mean to kick his father in the balls. Stop demonising the 17 year old his brain is not fully developed. The fathers an adult his brain is suppose to fully developed. The cat situation is cruel. The 17 year old has more empathy than the adults in this house and even the cat knows this as it scratches on the 17 year old son’s window to come in rather than die of hypothermia.

LexMitior · 26/02/2023 11:53

Give over. I see a dramatic personality in this 17 year old ego who claims that his father pushed him to floor.

The next action, kicking someone in the genitalia is contemptuous. It is immature but it is calculated.

Badwithmoney · 26/02/2023 11:56

You were not there you don’t know what happened the 17 year old reacted to a cat being mistreated and a shove from his father. The 17 year old did not start anything he was not the aggressor!

LexMitior · 26/02/2023 12:01

In a year this boy will be a man. And if this happens again, you will two adult men fighting in a house. For the sake of six months, this could look all the different.

Don't baby your son OP, it's dealing with this now because you won't get the chance again.

And if you are a fool, you'll believe your 17 year old completely at the expense of your husband. Don't do it. Think of the next 10 years, not the next two weeks

Badwithmoney · 26/02/2023 12:03

The husband admitted pushing the 17 year old and causing him to fall to the floor!

GoodChat · 26/02/2023 12:09

Badwithmoney · 26/02/2023 11:56

You were not there you don’t know what happened the 17 year old reacted to a cat being mistreated and a shove from his father. The 17 year old did not start anything he was not the aggressor!

Except the husband pushed him because he was acting aggressively