Son brainwashed by Andrew Tate

[NoGoodUsernamesLeftForMe]

Until yesterday’s news about the arrest of Tate I had no idea that my son has been following this ‘influencer’. He wasn’t even on my radar. It turns out he is almost a hero figure to my 17 year old. Reading about what this man says about (and seemingly does to) women is a terrible eye opener. My boy has lapped all this up, including the conspiracy bullshit about supra-governmental forces or ‘the government’ being out to get Tate who is being framed but has done nothing wrong. It seems clear from just a glancing read in the mainstream media that the man made his fortune by producing pornography, that he rails against everything we stand for as a family. He is a misogynist and his arrest for trafficking and rape suggests much worse. He is all about making money and brags about not paying taxes. He is an angry white man who rails against the world in shouty videos.
I do not know how to handle this. My teenage son is not easy to deal with at times. Withdrawn, taciturn, the usual teenage stuff. I was initially delighted that at least he talked about it to us yesterday and we had a calm discussion. But I have since found out who this guy is and got more of a sense of the indoctrination that has taken place.
I wonder if other parents are in a similar situation? How should I handle this? I fear that the more I say against this guy the more appealing he will be to a teenager. It’s all about being different to your parents, and what this toxic man stands for could be no more different.
I don’t think removing his phone is the answer, it would only antagonise him. I need him to stay on side and to see what this icon really is like.
Any suggestions on how to handle this would be really appreciated. I am beside myself with worry about what damage this has already done to my son and how to stop this man skewing my son’s world view. As he has millions of followers it’s likely other parents here have a similar experience.
Thank you! 😢

OP I'm wondering if he's actually seen the video of the "consensual" beating with belt. It's hard to know how much people know, IYSWIM.

if he's happy with it, as a 17 year old, I'd be seriously concerned.

@Itsbiasedhere except no one said censor or ban. We’re just saying they’re twats, and the people that follow them are twats.

Let me correct you on your descriptions there. For Tate I assume you didn’t mean ‘bit of an idiot’, you meant ‘under investigation for sex crimes and money laundering’ and for Jordan Pederson you didn’t mean ‘actually very clever’, you meant ‘woefully unqualified to speak on most of the things he talks about’

You seem to think that clever equates to being a twat - no doubt you think they are ‘sticking it to the elite’, ‘telling it like it is’ and ‘defending free speech’, when they’re doing neither. They aren’t railing against the elite, they are the bloody elite. They aren’t defending free speech - if anyone criticises them they go ballistic. They aren’t ‘telling it like it is’, more often than not they’re doing the exact bloody opposite.

And people like you get suckered into buying their books and attending Hustlers University or whatever idiot thing it’s called now because, fundamentally, you are incapable of original thought - thus why you throw the word ‘woke’ around without any actual idea of what you mean by it.

Grow up or fuck off, ideally both.

Thank you for the helpful advice. And apologies, race clearly doesn’t come into this. I had not researched his background, my mistake. He seems to have a largely white male following, from what I read, but that also doesn’t matter. Angry man would be the accurate description.
Whatever his background, he is clearly influential in convincing his young followers of conspiracy theories.
Yes, changing the algorithm would be great, perhaps I can suggest some other searches. And friends who have different views. He tells me they don’t. It doesn’t help that the internet has produced such a polarised world. It’s not a friendly environment for young people (or anyone).

Tate (a bit of an idiot)

Andrew Tate is no idiot. He has methodically and rather brilliantly used the algorithms to promote himself and within three months get an income in the millions of ££££. He deliberately posts provocative, extreme stuff because he knows a ratio of 60% fans and 40% outraged = tons of posts, tons of retweets, tons of views, tons of media coverage & publicity all generating him money. His Hustler University is a complete scam…but there’s tens of thousands paying a monthly subscription fee to hear his “secrets” on keeping “bitches in line.” These subscribers (probably incels) want to be like him. He’s some sort of barbaric misogynistic throw back boasting about abusing women.

OP I think we cross posted
conspiracy theories are the least of the worries if your son worships Tate!

He seems to have a largely white male following
Is that not because the UK is 80% white? So stands to reason, most followers will be white males. Not sure why you’re trying to make this a race thing OP.

He is an angry white man who rails against the world in shouty videos.

I am taken back and somewhat appalled by this comment, why do you feel the need to bring race into this?

Also, for your information AT is mixed raced (not that it even matters)

@NoGoodUsernamesLeftForMe

How does AT actually explain how to "keep bitches in line"?
If some idiot tried to "keep me in line" I would laugh at them.
(Sorry if I sound ignorant. I don't want to Google this person).

Surely when all his followers try to use his methods or philosophy or whatever it is, they will find it doesn't work? And women around them will tell them to fuck off etc., so they will see it's stupid??

I don't have teenage sons, but when I've discussed how to adress the AT (and others of his ilk) followers with my (then) teenaged daughters we agreed that it depends what you want to achieve.

Ranty guy in pub that you'll never see again? move on
Friend/son/relative? Watch some AT videos and find a point to address. Then work it into a conversation - do you think that is a good way to talk about you, his mother, his sister, his friends?
Usually I'm not a big fan of emphasising that we should treat women well because it might be your wife/sister/mother - women are individuals deserving of the respect all humans should have regardless of their relationship to a man.

But in this instance i think it helps to contextualise it. Is this how you think you should treat your girlfriend? or do you think this will consign you to the hordes who live in their mothers' basements? (and add: and with this attitude you are not welcome to live in mine)

Look I don't like Tate (although has he been found guilty yet?) however people were lumping Jordan Peterson in too which is obviously rediculous he is a serious academic. Speech is a spectrum You can draw the line wherever. people though usually want the line drawn so they are on the correct side of it over free speech and that is what you are doing.

I'm I'm a similar situation with my ds. It's all very, very worrying to be honest.

I’ve seen two of his videos. One in which he talks about what to do if your girlfriend catches you cheating. He fakes a female whine “but you’re cheating” then says “you pop out your machete and BAM! In her face with it, then you grab her by the neck (he is acting this out) and say shut up bitch” (I’m paraphrasing from memory bte, but that is the gist of what he says).

He also in a another video relates a two hour argument that happened after his vegetarian gf refused to cook him a steak. He ended up ending it with her, but at the end of the video he says “after she packed her bags, I made that bitch couldnt leave until she cooked me my steak!” (Laughing)

Oh, his methods work alright.,,they’re DV though. That’s the issue. You going to tell a man chocking you with a machete in your face to “fuck off”? Not likely…you’re going to go into survival mode and try to escape as soon as you can. Unless you’re a vulnerable woman who thinks they deserved it and then goes into appease the monster mode.

Sorry for spelling mistakes my dyslexia is acting up today.

I'm sorry you're going through this OP but at least it's out in the open.

Leaving aside all the bickering about free speech and terminology and wokeness - I think there's a huge difficult discussion to be had here about the lost young souls pulled in by online extremism, whether that's mens rights activism or transgender ideology (arguably the same thing of course) or whatever.

It would be really interesting to hear from those who've helped their children come back to "real life".

Is your son at college OP?

At our school, we have recently addressed some rising misogynistic attitudes and known unsavoury online behaviour via targeted PSHEE sessions with a series of sessions on toxic masculinity.

It might be worth contacting the safeguarding lead to report it.

Ask him what he likes about Tate. Agree with anything positive.
I think he does say things like work hard to achieve goals and to have high standards.
This will enable you to start having a gentle conversation around how people are flawed and yes, he does say some good things but what do you think about how he made money from cam girls etc.
you have to find out more about Tate and then be very gentle in your messaging to your ds.

@NoGoodUsernamesLeftForMe

twitter.com/femi_sorry/status/1608642623207792640?s=21

i just came across this guy giving a two minute talk on how to talk to people aboyt Andrew Tate

Ask him whether he would be happy for someone like Andrew Tate to be in a relationship with his sister or his daughter? Ask him whether it makes more sense that this nobody has made his money through his pyramid scheme of a university and through exploitation of women or through legitimate and honourable means. Then leave it there. Do not engage in a discussion. Ask him the questions and move away.

This and more. WIth teenage boys its about finding a common ground and starting conversations that they view as positive, you agreeing with them, the gently challenging the negatives. I speak with my boys very openly and honestly, i a way that also empowers them. With all the female empowerment, we often forget about boys, as arguably, naturally as a society, they have the power. I have had conversation with them about how important that power is and how they are as responsible as their sisters, girl friends, future partners, to ensure equality and respect exists. I have spoken with them about AT and how he promotes abusing the power society gives him as a man, and my boys can see that viewpoint and how dangerous AT's opinions are. Its all about gentle positive conversation, rather than trying to hit them with facts.

Honestly this was the first thing that popped into my head too - Prevent.

I think one of the first schools they went into was one I worked in. We had lots of safeguarding training with them and they are an awesome team.

Until yesterday’s news about the arrest of Tate I had no idea that my son has been following this ‘influencer’. He wasn’t even on my radar

Honestly, OP, if you hadn't even picked up that DS is 'lapping up' these ideas and they haven't manifested in general conversation with him, I wonder if he's just making himself out to be a devoted superfan to wind you up and be contrary?

I notice when DS has been absorbing questionable ideas online (which he inevitably does, through gaming communities, etc) because he'll say weird things and then we'll get to talking about them.

If you had literally no idea he had these views, it doesn't sound like they're really that strong - and if he was deliberately hiding his real feelings from you, why suddenly go all confessional with you yesterday?

I'm not saying it's fine to spout misogyny- obviously continue to set your boundaries at home, but I wouldn't panic that he's brainwashed or anything - it sounds like he's just jumping on a trend rather than having been indoctrinated, otherwise you would have picked up on it before yesterday.

Probably the best way to get him to see Tate for what he really is is show him other men that he can look up to who will tear Tate to pieces...... What I'm getting at is boys and men tend to look up to other men rather than women it's very hard to get them to listen to us, we need the Good men to stand up and drown out the bad men... The trouble is that all men seem to be very tempted by the prices that the bad men appear to score.

In regards to the comment from@Itsbiasedhere where he describes Tate as just a bit silly, I think he admires Tate and is hoping to to salvage some of his reputation by making him out to be harmless.

I think his arrogance will be his undoing .....his head is too far up his behind for him to have enough self-awareness to save himself from shooting himself in the foot all the time

It’s a good learning curve for him no? That behind the vile attitude to women is criminality and abuse.

He has abysmal standards though and I’m not going to ‘praise’ someone who works hard to abuse and exploit women.