Anyone else with a teen girl who dresses badly? (Frumpy)

[PatsArrow]

I hope this post doesn't make me sound like a complete cow. I will caveat this by saying I love my daughter a huge amount. I think she's funny, clever, kind and a loyal friend.

She's 17. She's never been into 'girl' clothes. She always wore Spider-Man fancy dress rather than Disney Princess when she was little. She always preferred wolves and dragons to fairies etc. She's only ever worn a dress or skirt a few times in her life. She doesn't own a skirt atm.

Now, I don't care about what she wears - if it's 'feminine' or not. However, recently she been upset.
For sixth form she wears such dowdy and frumpy clothes. Badly fitting joggers with 80's style jumpers mainly. She hardly ever wears make-up. She has fairly large boobs and she tries to squash them down in a sports bra but this just makes them looks like they're in a flat bag. She's started to get upset and complaining to me about how ugly and fat she looks when someone has caught her on camera (she hates her photo taken).

I find this incredibly upsetting. She has a very womanly figure, small waist, big boobs and big hips - a much more different shape to her friends. If she's going out to a party, she can make herself look amazing - she puts on more fitted clothes and a small amount of make-up.
I've always told her she's beautiful. I've always tried to champion her in whatever she feels like wearing. I just feel like she's a bit lost. It's like she wants to exude confidence but thinks hiding away in an over-sized hoodie will do it.

In that past I've taken her shopping (she hates shopping) and have spent lots of money on nicer clothes that at the time she's enthused about. However they're never worn and end up at the back of the wardrobe.

At 17, she wants to feel attractive and confident although I know not many are truely confident at 17.

How do I help her without ruining her confidence? Last week she started saying she wanted a breast reduction. I objected but she said I can't object because I had one (I did, aged 45). I said she's too young and she said I'd told her I wished I'd had it done when I was younger (I did). She says she's saving for one to have when she's over 18.

This is all normal right? It's really upsetting to see the confident, wear-anything little girl she once was really unhappy in her appearance and hiding away in frumpy, badly fitted retro knitwear and joggers.

If anyone has been through this, where do I start? It's really heartbreaking to see her hating on herself.
I said I'd take her shopping on Sat for new bras and a pair of jeans.......

I have 1 this age and she is dressing like her friend. The issue is that she has a different body shape to many teenage girls, and needs to make small tweaks. Starting with the bra is brilliant. get her to try jumpers that are boat necked or with a lower crew neck.the currently fashionable higher necks do produce a shelf effect in those of us blessed with larger breasts. As she has a little waist, a cropped jumper over a vest may really work, a thick jumper coming down from her bust will make her into a rectangle sweatshirting material-is not her friend, unless very thin.. If you can encourage her to try jumpers in finer materials, thin cotton or Merino. If you can find these in bright colours or patterns or white/ cream!, they will look current. I think H&M is very good. Well fitted jeans and joggers are also really important. ASOS do some joggers they call a corset waist, with a smooth v waistline. They are on sale and really cheap and would look great on your girl. Get her to use a thick belt. With jeans.
Breast reduction has made me shudder ever since Ilooked it up and read about resisting the nipple! , but that would be her choiceI guess, but she can get a version of the cool girl uniform and learn to love herself too.
I hope you have a lovely Saturday.

Do your own punctuation on that post. Sorry!

Speaking as a former teenage girl with a daughter myself...I can tell you that when I was unhappy with my appearance and told my mom she would do special spa day type things. I've never been gifted with putting my hair up,or painting my nails,or doing makeup. So she would take the day and pamper the three of us ( mom, me, my younger sister) hair cuts, nails painted or if she could she'd take us to the nail salon and she'd even do my makeup. Every time she did this it made me feel pretty even if temporarily. She showed me how pretty I actually am. One day when my 4 year old is a teenager I hope to be able to carry on this impromptu confidence boost with her. Idk momma but maybe showing her instead of telling her might do the trick

This sounds familiar. It could be my daughter all over again. This is very tough and I made almost irreparable mistakes . Listen ,listen, listen. Don’t worry about her wearing what she wants ( I can see you aren’t - that you are only worried on her behalf ) . A breast reduction is drastic and she may not need it but why not ? Go along with her plan and see what the medics say - unlikely to impossible to get this on nhs so do lots of research . My daughter was an f at 17 and a similar shape - at 35 and after 1 child she is a super fit vegan runner size 10 / 32 b. However this has been at great personal cost and years of stress over body image and therapy to go with it . The restrictive diet she has and the super fitness are all part of it. It’s just the other end of the seesaw - but she’s been this way for 10 years now . Your daughters body shape may well change (did yours ?) or it may not and if a breast reduction saves her from years of self hate then that is a very good thing . Do. It ( as to my shame I did ) suggest she eats fewer Mars bars or takes better care of herself ..🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️. It did not help that me and older sister are small busted and slightly built. Buying bras (bravissimo was )great ) was a nightmare and jeans or any dresses terrible .... No wonder baggy shirts are the thing - and fine by the way ?’! If she wants you could try taking her to a very sympathetic bra shop but do try and have a chat with them first about what she might like ie no push up or plunge ! Does she look at any possible role models like her ? The world has more shapely bodies in it than 20 years ago and to my mind more acceptance . Maybe not among 17 year olds . Good luck and seek all the help you can get .

@LoisLane66

I might add that your breasts have to be a minimum of 500g in weight each, in order for them to be remodelled. The nipples will have to be moved and it might cause some difficulty with breast feeding if she has children in future. You also need to have a history of back problems caused by the breasts and ongoing pain relief or be depressed as noted by your GP.

Is it moving the nipple that causes those line scars on remodelled breasts?

www.marksandspencer.com/2-pack-lace-trim-full-cup-minimiser-bras-c-g/p/clp60437827?color=NAVYMIX#intid=prodColourId-60437827

Good old M&S do several minimiser bras such as above and go up to G cup - which I am now (shock!).

Can you sit down and look at things online together? Somewhere that takes returns so that she can try things on and they don't work, you can send them back? That way you can try and pick out things that might be more flattering.

I did see a post on here once about someone whose mother in law paid for her to have a virtual appointment with a stylist (sounds insulting, but it didn't seem with bad intentions). Depending on your budget, maybe that could be an option?

I have teen boys not girls but I have learnt to offer help but only when it's asked for. I was a similar baggy jumper addict as a teenager (still am) and still have terrible posture from standing to minimise my boobs.
It is a very difficult age feeling conspicuous to other kids (especially oafish boys) and I can't blame her for wanting to cover up and be inconspicuous.

Agree that a well fitting bra will help, if necessary cut the label out (or even conceal it during fitting) so she doesn't feel like a freak if she needs an F or G cup. Apart from that I'd sit it out for a few years.

Hopefully in a year or two she will be at uni or doing her own thing where she can find a style to express herself a bit more. But there's nothing wrong with being frumpy. Comfortable. Bring it on.

Nearly everyone looks fat and odd in non-posed photos as well. That's just normal! DH is on a strict ban of posting any photo of me online until I've vetted it.

Just echoing others - sounds like a very normal experience for a young woman her age - in terms of the discomfort around her body, unsure of what her style is and what she feels good in, but also extremely on-trend with the lower key, very gender neutral, comfortable garments. That’s just what young people are wearing

To be honest, at 38, I was kind of feeling the same way recently to a smaller degree!! I think we’ve all been there? Entering into a new phase in life, wishing my body was a bit different, not sure how I want to present myself to the world or what makes me feel good, and even when I do figure that out, how to get the right clothes that fit my awkward, short, larger body to achieve the thing I’m going for.

A good fitting bra was revolutionary for me - when I was her age I couldn’t find many affordable options in my size but times have changed. I liked the M&S options for quality/fit/value. I’m kind of in between sizes now so they don’t work as well for me, but I’d give them a go?

Also just a lot of love and support are great which it sounds like you’re already giving!! And a reminder that as women, we are more than our physical appearance and that she doesn’t have to worry about her style or what she looks like if she doesn’t want to.

Other than that - loads of style inspo out there and I think it’s a matter of just trying things on until you find what fits right and makes you feel happy, like you don’t want to take it off.

Also - she doesn’t need to abandon the cozy clothes entirely? It’s a look now. I guess maybe the trend doesn’t work for her the way it works for other people. But she could have a go incorporating a few different items into those looks, or have some different outfits for different contexts, right?

For sixth form she wears such dowdy and frumpy clothes. Badly fitting joggers with 80's style jumpers mainly. She hardly ever wears make-up.

She has started to get upset and complaining to me about how ugly and fat she looks when someone has caught her on camera

I don’t think one necessarily follows the other. As others have said, that’s the look at the moment for Gen Z. A lot (but not all) of the well meaning fashion advice on this thread would strip her of this self expression and make her look like a middle aged woman. Nothing wrong with looking like a middle aged woman of course, but not what I’d have wanted at 17!

To me, it sounds like she actually has a fairly well developed fashion sense, but has just struggled to find pieces that suit her body shape.

The usual scars are the anchor which is a line from the areola (pink or brown part around the nipple) to under the breast joining a curved line under the breast or the second method is just a downward scar. It depends on the shape of breasts and the figure of the female. The nipple and surrounding areola is moved, with its blood supply, to further up the breast in line with the new shape.
I personally have not had a reduction as I decided that the risks were greater than my desire to have the op. I did get a referral from my GP and did see a consultant but decided just to buy minimiser bras from M&S who have a great range. Bravissimo are more expensive and Prima Donna (sold by Rigby&Peller-the Queen's underwear provider) are even more expensive and they're ALL made in Sri-Lanka or Bangladesh no matter how much or how little you pay.

One very basic thing is - if she wants to wear track pants & jumpers to school - why not get some more fashionable ones so she feels less frumpy but still in her comfort zone.

Billie Eilish (who looks like she has similar issues to your DD) has influenced a whole raft of teen girls into oversize clothes. My 13 year old DD has requested a mahoosive pair of jeans and oversize cardigan.

I have DDs 21 and 18 and they’ve both been through this body scrutiny and doubt over the years . It’s all made worse by social media and Instagram unfortunately. However there is a lot more education these days about air brushing and a lot more acceptance of different looks, shapes and sizes. However at 17 it can be hard if they don’t feel like they look right in their own mind. I understand the small waist and big hips is ‘the look’ these days but visit shapes being fashionable is so ridiculous. Try to find some positive information about body image. She will come through it , it’s a stage.

BTW big oversized hoodies and baggy jeans are in these days I’m told.

www.boots.com/dove/appearance

m.youtube.com/watch?v=s2gD80jv5ZQ

I had v large breasts from the age of 12 , don't underestimate the attention that brings to young teenagers who are not ready for that sort of attention . Yes it's disgusting but happens . I had men approaching me from a young age and even photographers giving cards asking me if I ever wanted to do topless to call them ( aged 15, days of Sam Fox)
when I tried to dress attractively I could not cope with the attention . I'm talking about fitted T-shirts instead of baggy .

I had my breasts reduced on nhs aged 21 and have never regretted it

Yes it shouldn't happen but it does and if your daughter feels anything like I did I had no interest in clothes as anything other than something to hide in .

As and F cup at that age I can assure you she has drawn unwanted attention because of her bra size and is doing all she can to hide it. So, my piece of advice is to shop for a really good fitting bra, would take her to Bravissimo and have her fitted properly. Minimising bras at that age are great, and also a good one for sport. The rest is really irrelevant.

@Firstshoes

My dd (16) wears clothes like this. Charity old man style jumpers with super baggy ripped jeans and DM style boots. I think it's just the style. She has just bought a pretty feminine prom dress tho !

This sounds like my actual clothes when I was 17. I used to nick my dad's cast off jumpers and shirts so they didn't even fit me 🤣

How about exploring some really nice versions of what she feels comfotable in anyway? Some really well fitting joggers and good quality loose retro tees, sweatshirts and jumpers.

Would she consider cargo pants? The 1980s cargos and crop top look is coming back into fashion and it works brilliantly with her figure type. I wore it to death in 1980s and 1990s (similar body type) and felt really confident in it as it can be sexy but isn't too girly.

Something like this or (bit classier this?

I’m not particularly stylish and need to look the part for work. With the womens clothing scene so fragmented these days I hired a stylist to help me out. Best thing I ever did for myself. My daughter paid attention and when it came to her needing clothes as she had grown, she asked to use her too. I spent $800, about £500 or so, for the session with my daughter which included the stylist taking care of all ordering and returning items that didn’t work. It wasn’t cheap but it was very efficient and my daughter had a fantastic experience.

Is it worth trying a stylist in a department store or a private one who can work with your daughter? I know it’s not cheap but my daughter really benefited from having a 3rd party to talk to about how to dress, use make up and beauty things.

This was me at 17 and it was a combination of a not supportive Mum (with B cup boobs not understanding why I couldn’t just shove my 28GGs into a 40DD from M&S…) but also the fashions and the way clothes were marketed not being shown on my body type. Everything was shown on flat chested women so I had no understanding of what clothes would look like on me!!!

Essentially it took time, money and experimenting to work out what looks good on me. 100% take her shopping- maybe just start with a simple goal of “jeans and a black top” with the focus on which styles and cuts suit her before engaging with anything else like patterns, colours?

Then be patient and also say it doesn’t matter if she doesn’t like it later and you can try again soon (if budget allows!)

With regards to the bra issue I wouldn't mention her curves but I would mention the support her books need to prevent back pain.

I was very much like your daughter as a teenager but on the opposite side of no hips and flat chested.
I wore baggy clothes to hide my shape. People at school made comments and baggy clothes just seemed to feel like a bit of protection.
Baggy clothes are definitely the style right now but maybe there’s been a few comments at school that have thrown her off?
You sound lovely and doing everything you can to help your daughter feel happier.
It’s good thag you’re following her lead and letting her speak to you about these things.
She definitely has a confidence issue, she feels comfortable buying and wearing new clothes in front of you but she’s probably expecting comments if she wears them around other people.
It seems like she’s comparing herself and trying to hide herself away. Could you maybe listen to some self confidence podcasts? Loads of celebrities have books about feeling empowered etc I suggest these because she’s young and might like reading from a celebrity rather than a get help book.

Books=boobs