So what is your theory behind the epidemic of teenage mental health issues

[AvacadoRush]

I think I now have more friends whose teenagers have mental health issues (anxiety and depression - one of my teens included) than don't. All lovely, caring, supportive parents.

So what's going on? Is it simply an increase in recognition and diagnosis, usual teenage angst being labelled? Is it a failing in parenting by our generation?

My own theory is that much of it (if not the vast bulk of it) can be put down to the internet. From the age of 11yrs - as they go to secondary school - they have smartphones which (much as we try to police it - it's like trying to stop an avalanche with an egg cup) mean then have virtually unfettered access to, well, everything. All stuff that they are completely and utterly, with brains that are not even fully developed, able to cope with.

My friend put it like this (extreme example) he said if I walked up to a group of friends and said 'I really want to stab someone' - they'd all say 'don't be crazy', explain why it was wrong etc. Type that into the internet and you will find other like-minded people. Obviously that's the nasty side of things along with porn, grooming by gangs/paedophiles etc,

On the other side is the make-up tutorials, the bloggers, vloggers, the life-styles the impossibly unrealistic standards our dc will never reach. Death by bloody comparison. Even with the awareness that half this stuff is staged and bullshit there's still that creeping sense of failure. Even as an adult, scrolling through Facebook, you can feel it.

I don't think anything I've said is new or controversial.
So my last question is what the actual fuck can we do about it?

@lightand

Yes to things mentioned. Plus, and this will be an unpopular idea, lots of parents do not believe in God now, but there did used to be grandparents who at least did, but they are slowly dying.

And that is relevant because....

I do find it alarming that all your friends' teens have mental health problems when did I say that?! I said more have than don't have. There is an implication that it might be something to do with me and my choice of friends which is highly insulting to both me and my friends.
I have skint friends, rich friends, happy friends, anxious friends, confident friends, friends who are teachers, all with dc with mental health issues.

I would suggest that if you or your teen dc don't know any teens with mental health issues, it's not because they don't have them, they just don't want to tell you about them.

I can't get on board at all with religion or lack of being the cause!

Dd(17) has recently been diagnosed with an anxiety disorder, phobias and health anxiety. She was always a bit shy and took a while to warm to new situations but during her gcse years she began to find school very stressful and it's all got a lot worse since Covid.
We have spoken a lot about her worries and there are obvious triggers but a huge one was exacerbated by tiktok. She says that she feels overwhelmed by the pressure to save the planet, do good things, raise money for every disadvantaged person/cause, fill in petitions, march for extinction rebellion/black lives matter/transphobia etc etc etc. She feels like the weight of the world is on her shoulders and then feels guilt for spending money on clothes, having fun with friends, watching TV. She has now deleted tiktok and rations her time on social media.
Academic pressure doesn't help. Constant jumping through hoops to pass exams, learn exam technique, apply to the best unis. She loves learning but hates being examined constantly.
She had a lot of freedom when she was younger, lots of tree climbing, roaming the local commons with friends, camping, cycling etc but we still have an anxious child so I don't really know the answer

She says that she feels overwhelmed by the pressure to save the planet, do good things, raise money for every disadvantaged person/cause, fill in petitions, march for extinction rebellion/black lives matter/transphobia etc etc etc. She feels like the weight of the world is on her shoulders and then feels guilt for spending money on clothes, having fun with friends, watching TV.

Absolutely. We are looking at this next generation to fix all the problems we have caused. It's a terrible burden.

There is an implication that it might be something to do with me and my choice of friends which is highly insulting to both me and my friends

Er, no ... I think it's unusual that the majority of your friends' teens have MH problems. It's not the norm, OP. You really have been unfortunate and therefore I'll excuse this nasty little dig I would suggest that if you or your teen dc don't know any teens with mental health issues, it's not because they don't have them, they just don't want to tell you about them

And I didn't say anything about god.

Honestly? I’d not say this to my friends but all of my friends with girls have all really dramatised their lives and been pretty self centred. Many of them self harmed, always in an obvious and dramatic way, all of them from loving, affluent, stable homes.

I think that they were pathologising normal anxiety and growing up. It’s the same with their friends. Social media enhances it but I don’t think it plays as big a part as peer norms and also parents who are also pathologising.

I know of two teenagers however who do have serious mental health problems. One a girl. One a boy. Both now mid twenties and both were very vulnerable people throughout their lives - as in one always was very sweet but no grip on reality, the other very sweet also but struggled with everyday life. I think those two kids did have missed signs and weren’t picked up by CAMHs. The kids themselves did not use media or talk about being depressed, strikingly they did not call attention to themselves in that way. Both unfortunately it was directly after they starting drinking and smoking dope that their went completely off the rails. Both of them have been in psychiatric wards before they were twenty and both how in supported residential care.

How to support the latter but remain solid for the former lot of teenagers? And how to tell? Not easy.

It's been caused by a mixture of helicopter parenting which has become the norm along with social media IMHO.

Children do not learn essential life skills including problem solving, risk taking, and decision making, when their parents or another adult are constantly present. Kids thee days have very little time out without an adult. They are shipped around from activity to activity. One of my friends daughters became incredibly anxious at the age of 13 as she had to walk a short distance (2 mins) up her road on her own in the middle of the afternoon. She would call and speak to her mum on the way in a state of heightened anxiety. And speaking to other fiends that doesn't seem that unusual. I was trekking across London to friends houses on my own at that age.

Then they are hit with social media. Constant images of perfect people with perfect lives. Reams of unadulterated opinion. People being cancelled and berated for making mistakes. I could go on and on.

No wonder our young people are depressed and anxious.

Do the following. No personal smartphones. No personal tablets. No personal television. No personal computer.
Give them only time regulated acces under supervision. Don't ever exceed an hour don't ever allow any devices after 7:30pm. Activate the family safety filters from your ISP. Then when in the home and you are no longer working, do the same to yourself.
Breath feel the freedom. Go sit next to your kid, play with the Lego, read a book beside him, propose a game, or just sit close in silence spend actual quality time.

Many different things peer pressure, Facebook, Tik Tok, Twitter, recreational drug use(before I get flamed, it is in some of our local schools). General societal pressure. I also think nowadays children get many things they want, so don't appreciate or get bored with some things. Life expectations are very high, I don't think enough is taught regarding life not being fair, that we don't get everything we want. I also think there is immense pressure re exams, having the right job or going to the right school or university. There is just so much. The box in the corner and the internet don't help. I feel sorry for parents bringing up a family nowadays, it must be very difficult.

I’m a wallower. I think a lot of people are like me, including teenagers. I have seen both a psychologist and psychiatrist as an adult in relation to birth trauma. Both were excellent, insightful professionals. I had to quit both though as I was enjoying the validation too much and realised that I didn’t want to get better. I just wanted to wallow and feel sorry for myself. The best cure for people like me is to just suck it up and get on with it. To treat my real, difficult issues, I had to starve them of oxygen and just move on. Not a popular opinion, I know.

The problem is that there is no way to separate us wallowers from people who really do benefit from mental health treatment. I think teenagers who have wallower personalities will not necessarily benefit from therapy. They will be stuck in the wallow circle and not have the maturity to see that they are not doing themselves any favours. In the past, teenagers were not offered help. The wallowers would have to learn to cope and move on naturally. Others who would benefit from professional help would suffer silently.

I want to stress that therapy is amazing for many. I also think for many teenagers it makes things worse.

@Sydendad

Do the following. No personal smartphones. No personal tablets. No personal television. No personal computer. Give them only time regulated acces under supervision. Don't ever exceed an hour don't ever allow any devices after 7:30pm. Activate the family safety filters from your ISP. Then when in the home and you are no longer working, do the same to yourself. Breath feel the freedom. Go sit next to your kid, play with the Lego, read a book beside him, propose a game, or just sit close in silence spend actual quality time.

This is exactly what I think we should be doing, but at the same time how do we prevent our DC from being isolated or the "odd ones out" compared to their friends, all of whom continue their social lives online? Happy to be "bad guys" or "strict parents" but how do we find that balance...

Snoops - there's no need to be as extreme as Sydenham suggests. Let your DC have devices but teach them how to use them responsibly by discussing their merits and their dangers.

You can't say to a teenager "you can't have a smartphone - play with your Lego instead" but you can show that you trust and respect them by guiding them how to use these wonderful devices wisely.

Missed some words out there- really do need an edit button!

... by guiding them through the potential minefield that is SM, tiktok, snap chat, the dark underbelly of the web ....

@Needanedittbuton why can't you say "you can't have a smartphone"? That's exactly the attitude that's got us into this mess. We can say no to them, even if it means they are annoyed with us, even if it means they suffer a bit. Aren't we saying that a bit of suffering is good for them?

Even if you think it's good for them to learn how to use tech responsibly, I think at the very least they should earn the money and buy it themselves. Why is there an expectation that parents should provide expensive luxury products like that? I would never have expected it from my parents as a teenager (and in fact I bought my own mobile phone aged 18 :))

I don't see why we can't say NO to our kids anymore. We are their parents and to me its clear that kids have very limted self-control. I mean they are kids even at 13-16 years old!
I think it is our duty to keep their use of electronics in check. And i dont mean they can't have access to a smartphone, but what I really object to is giving a child a 300-900 pound device as his personal property. I think that kind of spending first needs to be earned and like I recently told my 12 year old: You having a mobile is not a given. I have no obligation to give you a 600 pound device and it is not your right to have one. You are not entitled to it just because everyone else has one. I am your parent and I will give you one when I think you can exhibit self control over the usage of PC's, games and other electronics. Also I think you can live without it and I prefer your interactions with your peers to be more direct, less itty bitty , more concentrated and more personal.
And actually when I explained my thinking he took it really well and is now displaying a form of pride about not having one.

My theory is that adults are now listening rather than dismissing teenagers struggling with their mental health, and that the internet has created a tidal wave of issues with self image, bullying, popularity etc.

I’m sure it’s true about more recognition, but also greater pathologising of what are probably normal teenage feelings. I think it’s quite normal to feel crap a lot of the time as a teen. I know I did but I didn’t grow up to have any real MH issues.

Oh, most of the above, just too many pressures sadly.

The school curriculum also doesn't help, no outlet for creativity, no chance to really succeed if you are not academic ( thanks Michael Gove). No chance to problem solve, to explore, be curious, be self motivated.

Too much provided and not enough freedoms, time to 'be', time to be bored, let your brain rest. We spend so much time with children 'booked in to do..', they can't think for themselves.

It is a careful balance but also kids need some resilience and recognition of what real MH issues are, otherwise it devalues MH.
In the right circumstances I called my DS out. He talked of MH issues, lack of motivation,not getting stuff done etc.
I suggested he may just be 'bored' and if so what had he planned to address it. I went so far as to say - 'do you think you may just be a procrastinator, a bit lazy, I know I have that personality trait if left to my own devices without a plan'. I challenged his perception of MH issues.

After a week, he came back and agreed with me, he'd used the strategies I'd suggested to get his day off to a good start, including going for a walk and being outdoor, he'd made a plan of things he wanted to do, a manageable one task a day so that he achieved and succeeded. With support he was empowered.
Talking onwards, he did admit he'd realised he hasn't MH issues, just a lazy procrastinator at times. He'd taken responsibility rather than blaming MH like this was a reason, something he couldn't do anything about.

Not saying that is everyone, but in my case I'm glad I challenged him, I'm glad I suggested strategies that empowered him.

Of course you can say no to your children - I frequently say no to DD. However, I'm nurturing my DD into adulthood and independence in small steps.

We bought the smart phone and the laptop. She knows they are valuable items - I showed her how many hours I'd had to work on NMW to earn it after tax! She knows it's to be treated with care and we trust her to use the apps responsibly and have ongoing discussions about how to do so.

And as we don't want her to have an angst ridden teenagerhood, we also acknowledge you can have a lot of fun in the Internet.

What are you planning to do - send them off to university with an Amish like naiviety?

With support he was empowered

Brilliant!

This is exactly what I think we should be doing, but at the same time how do we prevent our DC from being isolated or the "odd ones out" compared to their friends, all of whom continue their social lives online? Happy to be "bad guys" or "strict parents" but how do we find that balance...

The idea that they get isolated if they don't have access to social media is a very flawed idea and part of the endemic nature of the problem. It is simply not true. My kid has no access to social media whatsoever does not own a smartphone and has a very healthy social life and allthough I am sure he feels a bit different I don't think that is damaging him.
However we had this attitude since they were born. I can imagine it is very difficult to change once you have allready bought them a phone and given them full access to social media, gaming etc.

*With support he was empowered

Brilliant!*

Not sure of the inference there!

If a few questions (support) to encourage self reflection work by bringing about a change in behaviour, I'm all for it.

I agree with this @Sydendad. I don’t think the alternatives are either let them have smartphones/social media or “Amish-like naivety” :) Plenty of adults use the internet as a tool for work/paying bills etc, but get their fun elsewhere. That’s what I want to encourage in my kids, but if they get to 15/16 and want to earn the money and buy their own tech I won’t stop them. I have also been quite strict on screens since birth and we don’t own iPads/iPhones etc, so it’s not a huge leap. It’s probably more difficult if as parents you are using social media a lot.

Also think that there’s nothing wrong with kids learning it’s ok to be a bit different. Yes, you don’t want them to be total outcasts but it’s good for them to know that you have principles that you stick to, even if it means not following the herd.

Being a teenager has always been a bit rubbish. I think it’s the new in thing to call teenage angst MH problems at the moment. You could easily describe emos, goths, punks etc as having MH issues for example.

This is probably on balance a good thing as it might help teenagers get the help they need for their issues and raises awareness of the more serious MH concerns.

@ArgyleIsle

*With support he was empowered

Brilliant!*

Not sure of the inference there!

If a few questions (support) to encourage self reflection work by bringing about a change in behaviour, I'm all for it.

Inference? I'm saying your strategy and the outcome were brilliant.

Christ! this is a touchy thread - I'm off before I start worrying about my MH