DS14 punched gentle DH in chest/face multiple times. Now vanished.

[WaffleWiffle]

DS14 was being horrible to DS10 at xbox swap over time (ie DS10's turn came to an end and it was DS14's turn. This was 1pm today). DS14 was rude, taunting and generally horrible to his brother, in a way DS10 would not do if reversed.

DH went to talk to DS14 as this was happening. DS14 continued to be horrible. DH told DS14 to go to his room to calm down (Xbox is not in bedroom but is in family area upstairs), reflect and apologise before he could go on Xbox. They were standing outside of his bedroom but DS14 refused point-blank to go in.

Stand off continued. DS14's phone taken from him. Stand off continued along the lines of:

"You have lost 1h of xbox time, if you don't go in your room before I count to 5 you will lose 1h of phone time in addition.
(After count to 5)
You have lost 1h of phone & xbox, it becomes 2h if you don't go in your room before 5

Etc etc

Stand off continued and was getting nowhere so it reached the point where it was obvious this tactic was not working.

I want to add at this point that DH is the most non-confrontational person ever and is never, ever aggressive. He was calm and low-voiced throughout. But DS14 was becoming increasingly aggressive and 'squaring up' to get past DH and not go in his room. It became important to de-escalate quickly because DS14 was getting scary.

DH tried to march DS14 into his room by holding his two wrists and walking towards bedroom with him. This evidently was the wrong thing to do and we can reflect on this another day. But the result was DS pulling his arms away and throwing punches at DH.

Raining punches at DH's chest, this was the point I became involved (I was in the shower throughout all previous, could hear but knew DH is a capable parent. From this point onwards I am wrapped in a towel with wet hair...). I hear the cuffuffle and as I come out of the bathroom I see DS14 throw 2 punches at DH's face while DH tries and fails to get hold of DS's arms/hands to stop the attack.

Now in DS's room. DH holds DSs chest against the wall, which allows me to get hold of both of DSs wrists. We are trying to stop his violence and help him calm down. We are trying our best in a situation we've never known before. As you can imagine, this is a really, really stressful and dreadful situation to find ourselves in. DH and I wait maybe 90 seconds holding DS as he is throthing (literally) at the mouth to, well I don't know, attack us?

I continue to hold DSs wrists and tell DH to leave room. Then I swiftly follow, close door and tell DS he needs to CALM DOWN. DS punches (and damages) door and breaks his alarm clock (I don't know how, I was holding door closed).

DH, having caught his breath and had a few mins to check our other children are OK and not scared, is now furious. In explaining to me what happened he raises his voice for the first time (something DH very, rarely does - he's a quiet discussion kind of guy). This passes a strong message to DS, who knows how rarely DH loses his rag. DH spelled it out to me what DS had done (he physically punched me about 20 times! How I didn't retaliate , i don't know- he was battering me!) and that, a long with DHs tone of voice very quickly quietened DS behind his closed door.

I sent DH downstairs and out the way. DS silent. I opened door (mistake - I should have left him longer. Hindsight is a wonderful thing). DS is like a bull facing down a mattadore. In a very angry voice he says he want to get out.

I think he means of his room. I say no, must stay in room to calm down. He squares up to me, I think he's going to hit me . He says her not staying in here, her going and DH calls from downstairs that leaving the house might be a good idea. I agree since he's trashed his room and seems still very angry.

DS14 leaves the house. This is around 1.30-1 40pm today. DH throws his trainers out of the door as he leaves, because he's barefoot.

So that's where we are. DS has not come home. We've phoned our local family members in case he turns up at theirs and his best mates parents. He has no phone or money. Dinner is always 5.30pm

I'm starting to worry. How long should I leave him to brood before I go look for him?

Should I be out there now? Am I a bad parent for not? I feel ok to wait until usual dinner time (5.30) because that's his normal time to be in when he's out with friends. But don't know how long after that to wait? His night time curfue is 9-9.30pm in school hols, depending where he is. Should I wait until then?

I'm soooooo cross with him. Like big, big style angry for his behaviour to his Dad. But of course I'm also worried for his safety given I don't know where he is. I don't want my worry to lessen his consequences for physically assaulting another. But the worry is overtaking now. What if he's so sorrowful that he has... oh god. What if he's hurt?

What should I do???????

I'd personally have removed ds14 from the situation with little brother, given him a telling off, and told him that until he apologises, he ain't getting the xbox.
Why the 'heavy' i.e your dh had to weigh in fuck knows.
Also - is he the bio father of your son?

Fucking hell! I’m not surprised the OP isn’t answering she came here for support.

And having read the actual thread I can confirm for the hard of reading-

1. OP was in the shower
2. DH is the father
3. OP generally considers the DH to be a calm, rational and caring parent.

No she shouldn’t have been doing it herself, she’s allowed to let her DH do some of the parenting.

And actually he’s allowed to make mistakes too.

As is the 14 year old in question. What matters is the next steps and the OP came here for advice and support on those not for a judgemental kicking.

She well and truly got a kicking. Hope she’s ok.

Why the 'heavy' i.e your dh had to weigh in fuck knows.

Because he’s as much of a parent as OP is?

@Iflyaway
At 14, he’s well aware of what consequences are and by participating in setting his own consequence, he’s learning to take ownership of his poor behaviour.

We’ve got to stop molly coddling kids. Schools have far too many badly behaved children in with no excuse other than they feel entitled and can get away with it.

This thread is truly depressing. I cannot believe people are urging the OP to apologise to her thug of a son. It's so scary to think these posters are bringing up sons, the next generation of entitled, violent men, fucking great!

Yep, the problem with violent men is their mollycoddling mothers. 🙄

Yes indeed, the whole point of this topic is to get support dealing with teenagers. Which anyone who has been through the teenage years knows is an absolute minefield.
Not only are teenagers irrational but they are inconsistent. They’re unpredictable and can flare up. Especially boys. All that testosterone is difficult to handle. So let’s pull together a bit; recognise we are not perfect, and give some positive help to each other!

Exactly, @Fleetheart!

I have been through the adolescent years with three boys, and even with the older two, who were not as difficult as ds3, there were challenges. I know I didn't do everything right - I'd never claim to be a perfect parent - but I don't think the perfect parent exists outside of the pages of parenting manuals or the fiction of mummy blogs - but the OP is willing to look at what happened and learn from it.

I also think that apologising when you have done something wrong is the right thing to do - even when there was wrong on the other side too. It models the right behaviour to the teenager, and hopefully encourages them to look at their role in what happened and apologise for what they did wrong too.

How can you say to a child 'You must apologise for what you did wrong' if you aren't prepared to do the same thing?

I don't think that apologising for what you did wrong means you can't have a hard line on violent behaviour, either. You can say 'I am sorry for doing X and Y, but hitting/pushing/violence is never acceptable, so there will be a serious consequence for that'.

I also think that apologising when you have done something wrong is the right thing to do - even when there was wrong on the other side too

No-one should apologise to a 14 year old who has battered lumps out of his parent.

No-one should apologise to a 14 year old who has battered lumps out of his parent.
I'd apologise for the manhandling. My kids are younger but I find that being willing to apologise myself makes them much more willing to themselves. Why on earth would they feel the need to behave properly when an adult can manhandle them and not admit it was wrong?

I'd apologise for the manhandling. My kids are younger but I find that being willing to apologise myself makes them much more willing to themselves

Manhandling? You mean when the little thug was battering his parent and his parent tried to stop him? I also didn't say never apologise to children did I? I also apologise to my children when I need to but if one battered me, over my dead body would I apologise to them, what a terrible lesson to teach them.

No wonder there are so many brats around when you hear pathetic parents on here! The OP and DH remained very calm. If someone is repeatedly punching you, of course you are going to restrain them! You did the right think OP but I wouldn’t have delayed dinner for everybody else for a sulking teenager.

I disagree, @Greencustard - I think it is good parenting to say “I’m sorry for the way I handled this, but hitting me/your father is utterly unacceptable.”

I think that, if the parent insists that they are 100% in the right and the child was 100% in the wrong, all that will achieve is to make the child stubbornly defensive and far less willing to see their responsibility for what went wrong, and how unacceptable the way they dealt with it was.

Basically, if both parties remain firmly entrenched in their positions, neither can move forward. One person has to make the first step, and I think it is the parent’s job who make it, and the small step of admitting you mishandled the initial disagreement may enable the child to take the bigger step of admitting that the hitting was utterly wrong.

Oops - posted too soon - that post is just my opinion, and my way of doing things won’t work for everyone, so I respect your opinion too, @Greencustard.

I disagree, @Greencustard**

That's fine. I also disagree with everything you've said, so we'll leave it at that.

Some people are terrified to show any sign of fallibility to their DC. They’re scared the DC will take it as a sign they’re a clueless parent and walk all over them. The truth is if you’ve done your job right all they’ll see is respect and honesty working both ways. But I suppose if you haven’t modelled respect and honesty so far then your fear could be valid...

Manhandling? You mean when the little thug was battering his parent and his parent tried to stop him?

You have it in the wrong order. The father grabbed the boy first and tried to drag him to his room.

It does seem a big blow up for something relatively minor. I would have said "Ds1 stop that now and apologise to ds2 before you use the Xbox" No apology would mean no Xbox, I'd take the lead and so job sorted. Later on when all was calm I'd have a chat about expecting better in future and explain if it was repeated there would be no Xbox that day regardless of apology.

You have it in the wrong order. The father grabbed the boy first and tried to drag him to his room

The father did not 'drag' him to his room. Not one part of the fathers actions justifies the son throwing multiple punches at his parent.

But DS14 was becoming increasingly aggressive and 'squaring up' to get past DH and not go in his room. It became important to de-escalate quickly because DS14 was getting scary

DH tried to march DS14 into his room by holding his two wrists and walking towards bedroom with him. This evidently was the wrong thing to do and we can reflect on this another day. But the result was DS pulling his arms away and throwing punches at DH

The father did not 'drag' him to his room.

What you’ve quoted confirms this is what he tried to do. OP uses the word “March”. DS was resisting so the result will have been his father dragging him by the wrists until DS pulled his arms free.

DH tried to march DS14 into his room by holding his two wrists and walking towards bedroom with him.

Not one part of the fathers actions justifies the son throwing multiple punches at his parent.

Who said it did?

I have to say I am surprised that no one picked up on the fact that the OP seems to have given a quite an edited version of the truth. Plus she was in the shower most of the time so wasnt there to witess what actually happened. I assume that the version we have seen is the one her dh gave her.

So the teen is an awful person from start to finish. Not one word about him saying that this is unsusual, he is struggling atm with x and y. Nothing.
And the DH is a meek man who wouldnt do boo to a goose. All gentle, never raise his voice ever, never got into any confrontation (really, never in his life he actually encountered someone who was aggressive towards him?) and will never do any harm to anyone.

In reality, both of them acted in a way that wasnt acceptable.
Strangely enough, it has been enough for the parent to apologise (no mention of what he will do to change his behaviour). But the teen had to be pusnished and not just but had to find his own punishment .
I think its a shame because what this teen REALLY needs is time 'IN' rarher than time 'OUT'. There are many studies that show, for example, that chldren who bullying other childre actually benefit from being supported and helped (byt the other children in the class, the whole family) rather than being pusnished and excluded.
The way the P and her dh have approach things (punishing, threatening, treating like a child rather than a teen etc...) clearly isnt working but they are doing more of the same hoping it will work. This is where madmess lies imo.

My post up thread about this being on the "Teens" topic:

Otherwise why have a topic of that title if all people want to do is say "yeah teenagers are little shits they've really got it coming how dare they have issues"

Cue various posters coming on saying "yeah teenagers are little shits they've really got it coming" etc.

There are many studies that show, for example, that chldren who bullying other childre actually benefit from being supported and helped (byt the other children in the class, the whole family) rather than being pusnished and excluded.

I don't doubt it. What's the impact on the child being bullied to see their bully being given loads of support and extra attention because they were a bully? What's the impact on the rest of the class when they see that bullying someone will result in lots of attention being showered on them?

What's the impact on the child being bullied to see their bully being given loads of support and extra attention because they were a bully? What's the impact on the rest of the class when they see that bullying someone will result in lots of attention being showered on them?

If done properly, the impact on others is that they see bullying can be stopped by intervention. That they can have a better relationship with their ex bully than before. But i agree that victims need to be shown their needs are paramount and nothing beats a heartfelt apology.

AppleKatie how do you know DH is the father? OP was asked the question directly several times and didn't answer.