DS14 punched gentle DH in chest/face multiple times. Now vanished.

[WaffleWiffle]

DS14 was being horrible to DS10 at xbox swap over time (ie DS10's turn came to an end and it was DS14's turn. This was 1pm today). DS14 was rude, taunting and generally horrible to his brother, in a way DS10 would not do if reversed.

DH went to talk to DS14 as this was happening. DS14 continued to be horrible. DH told DS14 to go to his room to calm down (Xbox is not in bedroom but is in family area upstairs), reflect and apologise before he could go on Xbox. They were standing outside of his bedroom but DS14 refused point-blank to go in.

Stand off continued. DS14's phone taken from him. Stand off continued along the lines of:

"You have lost 1h of xbox time, if you don't go in your room before I count to 5 you will lose 1h of phone time in addition.
(After count to 5)
You have lost 1h of phone & xbox, it becomes 2h if you don't go in your room before 5

Etc etc

Stand off continued and was getting nowhere so it reached the point where it was obvious this tactic was not working.

I want to add at this point that DH is the most non-confrontational person ever and is never, ever aggressive. He was calm and low-voiced throughout. But DS14 was becoming increasingly aggressive and 'squaring up' to get past DH and not go in his room. It became important to de-escalate quickly because DS14 was getting scary.

DH tried to march DS14 into his room by holding his two wrists and walking towards bedroom with him. This evidently was the wrong thing to do and we can reflect on this another day. But the result was DS pulling his arms away and throwing punches at DH.

Raining punches at DH's chest, this was the point I became involved (I was in the shower throughout all previous, could hear but knew DH is a capable parent. From this point onwards I am wrapped in a towel with wet hair...). I hear the cuffuffle and as I come out of the bathroom I see DS14 throw 2 punches at DH's face while DH tries and fails to get hold of DS's arms/hands to stop the attack.

Now in DS's room. DH holds DSs chest against the wall, which allows me to get hold of both of DSs wrists. We are trying to stop his violence and help him calm down. We are trying our best in a situation we've never known before. As you can imagine, this is a really, really stressful and dreadful situation to find ourselves in. DH and I wait maybe 90 seconds holding DS as he is throthing (literally) at the mouth to, well I don't know, attack us?

I continue to hold DSs wrists and tell DH to leave room. Then I swiftly follow, close door and tell DS he needs to CALM DOWN. DS punches (and damages) door and breaks his alarm clock (I don't know how, I was holding door closed).

DH, having caught his breath and had a few mins to check our other children are OK and not scared, is now furious. In explaining to me what happened he raises his voice for the first time (something DH very, rarely does - he's a quiet discussion kind of guy). This passes a strong message to DS, who knows how rarely DH loses his rag. DH spelled it out to me what DS had done (he physically punched me about 20 times! How I didn't retaliate , i don't know- he was battering me!) and that, a long with DHs tone of voice very quickly quietened DS behind his closed door.

I sent DH downstairs and out the way. DS silent. I opened door (mistake - I should have left him longer. Hindsight is a wonderful thing). DS is like a bull facing down a mattadore. In a very angry voice he says he want to get out.

I think he means of his room. I say no, must stay in room to calm down. He squares up to me, I think he's going to hit me . He says her not staying in here, her going and DH calls from downstairs that leaving the house might be a good idea. I agree since he's trashed his room and seems still very angry.

DS14 leaves the house. This is around 1.30-1 40pm today. DH throws his trainers out of the door as he leaves, because he's barefoot.

So that's where we are. DS has not come home. We've phoned our local family members in case he turns up at theirs and his best mates parents. He has no phone or money. Dinner is always 5.30pm

I'm starting to worry. How long should I leave him to brood before I go look for him?

Should I be out there now? Am I a bad parent for not? I feel ok to wait until usual dinner time (5.30) because that's his normal time to be in when he's out with friends. But don't know how long after that to wait? His night time curfue is 9-9.30pm in school hols, depending where he is. Should I wait until then?

I'm soooooo cross with him. Like big, big style angry for his behaviour to his Dad. But of course I'm also worried for his safety given I don't know where he is. I don't want my worry to lessen his consequences for physically assaulting another. But the worry is overtaking now. What if he's so sorrowful that he has... oh god. What if he's hurt?

What should I do???????

I also think there is a lot of minimising regarding how bad ds14 behaviour was towards ds10. The younger child shouldn't have to put up with being bullied in his own home. He was being absolutely foul and for no reason. I wouldn't let that go unpunished either.
I'd ban Xbox and phone for a start. He can earn those back with improved behaviour. I wouldn't want ds10 doing an activity by himself with ds14 - you just expose him to further bullying and ds10 might not even want that level of interaction with his brother. I do agree that more involvement in the home, chores and family activities are a good way to make him reconnect with you all. I would also have him on a strict school then home regime for a while - he could go to organised sports clubs but no hanging out with his mates after. He needs to feel that his behaviour has unpleasant consequences for himself.

Wtf to some of these responses- need to apologise to him? Shouldn't have interrupted his fucking game?

No wonder there are so many violent men about if this is how they have been bought up. It's ok to repeatedly punch someone because you have been told you can't go on the X-Box?! Listen to yourselves!

Posters suggesting that police are contacted to come round for a chat -
1 - this really doesn't happen anymore, possibly a PCSO but very unlikely a cop. There just aren't enough.
2 - if OP tells police what happened they WILL make a report of a crime and therefore husband and son will both be named on the report. It may not go any further but this is what happens even if you just phone to ask advice.

@Passthecherrycoke you are spot on!

As the mother of 3 now adult sons you and your husband got it very wrong Op.

A minor negative sibling interaction ended very badly because of your parenting.

Your son reacted (badly) to a situation your husband created and then you added to it all. Two of you restraining him.... dear god you should have just walked away from him and discussed things when everyone was calm.

The first bit that stands out to me is counting to 5! WTF! I stopped doing this with my kids when they were about 6 not to 14! And holding his wrists, really? You are treating this child like a toddler. He's 14 ffs! You should have just said no Xbox today and left him too it. Then there would have been no punching.

OP if you’re still reading. One thing I’ve found works (TBF ive Not had to issue a consequence to my teen for a long time now- but 10 year old still goes on thin ice from time to time) is when they’re in the middle of the bad behaviour, remove the audience- so if he’s having a go at ds2, call DS2 into another room with you, if he follows to wind him up then you both ignore him. Only if it becomes physical do you step in between them. But really if he’s getting no response from verbal stuff he’s unlikely to escalate to physical. Then later, when he is calmed you inform him of what his consequences are for his earlier behaviour. You don’t need to engage at all while he is in a “mood” you can give the same consequence to him later with much less of a reaction from him.

That's appalling behaviour from a 14 year old . At 14 he really should know better.

@pallisers how's Robyn these days?

At 14 a teenage boy should be able to follow the rules of the house and if he can't maybe he should live elsewhere ? With somebody who can deal with this behaviour like a military school perhaps?

😂😂😂

Yes he was taunting his brother but it sounds like things escalated unnecessarily straight away! Why not just say "hey if you carry on with that you won't be going on the Xbox at all". End off. He'd probably have shut up.

I've no idea why it became "1 hr... 2hrs... bla bla bla". Its almost like your teenager was being goaded. It's all very well expressing how calm your DH is but that doesn't dismiss the alpha male shit that your DH was pulling. That's how it reads to me anyway!

Regardless of this of course your DS should absolutely not have punched his father. That is disgraceful, even if goaded and demeaned. I hope you've all spoken and you have all learnt from this.

At 14 a teenage boy should be able to follow the rules of the house and if he can't maybe he should live elsewhere
I’m glad OP is his mother, and not you.
I know a 15 year old who came into school dishevelled because his mum kicked him out the house and he had to sleep under a car all night.
An absolute disgrace.

Of course your DS was out of order. But I agree that your DH got it wrong. I have a 17 yr old DS and he has never been violent - never thrown a punch at a person, a door or trashed his room. Of course he has on occasions been very angry and rude. But in those situations I would never seek to confine him, shut him in his room or hold onto him and restrict him physically. If you give someone no alternatives then you are saying my way or the highway. You've narrowed down their options and given them no choices. Using physical measures is very likely to arouse a physical response.

What was the root of the problem? Your younger son did not hand over the controls of the machine at the right time. We are all very aware that younger siblings are capable of needling and winding up their older siblings. In your house this worked a dream - his brother got really cross, frustrated and upset, lost control and got himself in a whole heap of trouble.

Your younger son needs to understand that he needs to play fair - to hand over the controls at the right time. Your older son may well have friends who aren't as limited in their screen time or having to share with an annoying younger brother so he may well already feel like he is not being treated fairly (rightly or wrongly).

Of course how your older son reacted wasn't good. From his point of view he was being treated unfairly - unfairness rankles and frustrates hugely doesn't it? It's the bane of the child and teenage existence. But if you put an angry and frustrated person in a corner they will often resort to fighting their way out. Cornering and body blocking a very angry person is not a good idea. The fight or flight response is instinctive. Your son experienced and acted on both.

When our boys start to grow we need to recognise that it's only moral authority - not physical authority - that works. My son has been taller than me for 4 years so any thought of physical constraint is pointless. As a lone parent I have to assert authority through calm intervention not cornering him. Standing back till things have calmed down and finding appropriate responses to situations - trying to be fair but firm. Of course I don't always get it right - I get cross and frustrated, I have to walk away. And sometimes I have to apologise when I get things wrong al- because I'm the grown up and I need to model adult behaviour. As a result DS apologises too when he gets things wrong. And we know that saying sorry and seeing a situation from someone else's point of view is often the hardest thing to do.

And we need to understand that as our young men are turning into adults they are trying to assert their independence flushed with hormones. If I as an adult was in a very heated argument where I felt wronged and treated unfairly and my partner tried to shut me in a room or hold my wrists I would get even angrier.

A physical response begets a physical response.

I'm not for one minute excusing squaring up to a parent and throwing punches. You will no doubt have determined by now how to sanction his behaviour. There are plenty of parents on here who will urge the toughest of punishments. I would urge you both to reflect on how you could respond differently in future to de-escalate. We can always be learning and gaining perspective on how to parent increasingly challenging young people. Avoiding the crisis and prevention are always better than punishment.

I hope you all get over this soon. I know how bruising conflict is. Parenting is a long and tough game - not about winning and being right. We all fail often.

Hope you’re OK, OP.

I bet things feel better today.

It had nothing to do with younger DS not handing the controller over in time. Older DS was 'sledging' younger one, was told off for it and lost his temper.

What does sledging mean? I think @Bouledeneige post is excellent

Sorry - it means haranguing him about the game he was playing, being nasty, cheering the opponent on etc.

Always remember the MN rule: No matter how badly and aggressively a teen behaves, it is always the DH's fault! Only a matter of time till they tell you to leave the bastard!

^this

Yes another rule: even if your child is bartering you to death you are not allowed to touch them. Ever. Just die instead.

Battering not bartering!

Oh c’mon. I dont want to bash OP but just read the opening post-

"You have lost 1h of xbox time, if you don't go in your room before I count to 5 you will lose 1h of phone time in addition.
(After count to 5)
You have lost 1h of phone & xbox, it becomes 2h if you don't go in your room before 5

Etc etc”

The boy is 14! He’s being counted at like a new parent trying out 123 magic on their 2 year old.

I thought the whole point of this topic - Teenagers - was to discuss how to cope with issues that teenagers have and parenting them through it, even when it gets tough and we feel that we can't cope.

Otherwise why have a topic of that title if all people want to do is say "yeah teenagers are little shits they've really got it coming how dare they have issues" and then congratulate parents on their punishments.

Just a thought ....

Why is everyone so precious about the xbox (in the middle of a game) blah blah.

Who gives a damn.
He is the CHILD ....

I would stop the xbox, take the phone and expect answers.
He cant think his got away with this disgusting behaviour, his old enough to know better

I'd personally have removed ds14 from the situation with little brother, given him a telling off, and told him that until he apologises, he ain't getting the xbox.
Why the 'heavy' i.e your dh had to weigh in fuck knows.
Also - is he the bio father of your son?

You've been asked this a few times and haven't answered from what I can see. A reason for that?