How DO you get the message through to your teen that THIS IS IT they have ONE CHANCE to try their hardest at school

[cyb]

Because my D (nearly16) just does not get it.

La la la , yes I'll do it tomorrow, no on else is doing it, it DOESNT MATTER MUM, I've got ages before it has to be handed in, I'll do it when I've finished that other thing,I've lost the piece of paper la la la if I hear ONE MORE airy fairy wafty reason why she can't do her work .....

She's a clever girl, really clever and I think that's part of the problem, she can coast in subjects and do well but others are slipping.

She's part of an intervention programme her school have initiated to support girls who aren't achieveing their potential and even serious chats from head of years or Deputy heads only seem to elicit the same nods and 'yes I' will's' that never materialise.

TELL ME WHAT TO DO

That aside, do you have expectations? Or wouldn't she care? Has she always been like it, or since teenagerhood? What is the general ethos of the school?

Cyb - how's it going??

AF - maybe start a thread along the lines of 'Why I wish I'd tried harder at school' - then maybe it will be a thread you can show her?

I wish I'd applied myself at school - I coasted through getting good grades, I could have got excellent grades if I had faffed less and applied more. My books always looked great, everything was very attractively presented - my accounting books were very neat & tidy - but if I'd been less of a faffer/perfectionist my grades would have been so much better.

I don't think much of anything would have made me any different at the time though - but my parents expectations stopped me completely fucking it up - so I think some parental pressure is a good thing.

Another parent here with a reluctant student just starting year 10.

Argg. It really, really upsets me to hear rewards being referred to as bribes in these threads.

When I go to work, I expect to be rewarded with encouragement and respect by my employers and be paid my salary at the end of the month. Indeed my ongoing application to my job is completely contingent on this contract.

I would think it weird and deeply insulting if my contract of employment was considered to be blackmail or bribery. Its no different for children and
young people.

1. Money, socialising with friends,and access to mobiles/TV/laptops/social media are great rewards and motivators for teenagers. And (usually) completely under your control.

1. It's vital to believe that you can be effective in changing this undesirable

self-destructive, albeit common, attitude. Or the 'battle' will be lost before you even start.

1. It's never too late to make (some) changes in yr DC's behaviour whilst they are in compulsory education.

4.It is a very stressful time with much anxiety and denial for young people- this needs to be respected and the goals must be realistic.

1. Be a pushy parent and advocate for yr DC in school

1. It's entirely normal for it to be exhausting for you and your rewards might

not be immediate.

No-one knows how easy or difficult - or expensive it will be for our DC to access education and training as mature students. In future

It was all so different for us. In the past.

I presume your DD has mocks coming up? It's amazing the impact that a lower mark than the pupil is capable of can have at this stage, in terms of motivation for working for the actual exams - they suddenly grasp the reality.

Of course, it is so late in the day that it won't help you from climbing the walls meantime, but just wanted to give you some hope that it may come right at the eleventh hour - have seen it happen more than once.

Good luck!

The reward will be the A*she gets, the bribery will be what motivates her.

Another one here who would love to know this. I coasted through GCSes and A Levels, then almost failed my degree. I was immature, overwhelmed by the sudden freedom and an idiot. I wish I could go back. The study I have done since has all been done in a serious, mature way and I really wish I had the chance to apply myself to my undergrad degree in the same way. I want that somehow to work its way into my childrens' heads.
(OK the eldest started school yesterday so maybe not something I have to be panicking about right now!)

And I remember my mum saying something similar to me. University was never even an option for her (70s, female, and from not mega-rich parents) but she messed around at school and then spent much of my childhood doing her professional qualifications. When I look back and think how my parents gave me opportunities they had never had and I wasted them I could cry. And apologise a lot.

fargate it is different for children/young people. They are required by law to attend school until they are 16 and no payment is required and many or even most of them are not paid for their results/attendance. Therefore if a parent is paying a child for good results or school attendance having negotiated it in advance it is a kind of bribe (different I guess if it's given as an out of the blue unexpected reward). Not, the worst kind of bribe to be sure and I think blackmail is stretching it a bit far, but it is a bribe imo and not the same at all as a parent in contracted employment. What is it about the term bribe that upsets you? Not all bribes are wrong.

Yes but kids don't see it that way, gelatinous.

gel 'Bribe' is such an emotive, word with negative connotations and suggests some degree of coercion by the briber/spoiling/indulgence etc.

Whilst children and young people are obliged to attend school by law - they are not under any legal obligation to do any work once they get there. And the latter is the focus of this thread.

It has to be negotiated in advance and written into a contract so there is no argey-bargey about whether or not it is a 'good report' -or not

The bottom line is that what I have said actually works with all but the most delinquent teenagers. Good evidence base and personal experience.

Not going well this first week of yr 11

She has language tests next month. Says she doesn't know what to study and has no books. Says she regrets choosing languages and she cannot do it. Completely closes off and refuses to discuss it.

If she doesn't know what to study now (after a year of the subject) what the fuck do I do ?

her teachers praise her behaviour and just repeat the same old line "needs to try harder" but don't manage to convey any practical steps she/we shold be taking. Just that "she is a nice girl" and "should do well" even though her predicted grades are now slipping to D's

she won't get to do A levels if she doesn't get 5 gcse's at grade c and above at our local 6th form college

there are no jobs around here, apart from supermarkets

I would struggle very badly to support her in resitting gcse's after watching her throw yr 10 and yr 11 away. Have tried to get her visualise how she will feel to see her mates getting on and doing A levels, while she gets left behind...she accepts that but still won't work at it

< cries again >

AF - can you afford some tutoring? I would go in and see the teachers, find out the syllabus, get the text books and find a tutor too, if necessary. I think when they really do feel lost in a morass of not understanding, they shut down.

Get positive and take action.

And I agree with fargate. I have always expected a lot from my dc, in the sense that I expect them to perform well and achieve the best they are able to, and in return they get the best I can manage in terms of help, support and having a nice time. We don't do actual rewards as in if you get x, we'll give you y, but there is a kind of ongoing negotiation process re screen time/friends/homework etc.

AnyFucker - in your situation, I'd ask the teacher, get the books and try and do it with her. Maybe even put sentences on the fridge etc, although those last two suggestions may be naive of me. Clearly you've tried. Languages are tough and involve a lot of skills, like memorisation, that aren't involved in a lot of GCSE subjects now. I tutored two girls in Spanish at secondary school (I was an English teacher for a while) and they simply couldn't believe they had to sit down and memorise things. There's also really embarassing things involved in languages like pronunciation. Kids hate that

I only started studying about six weeks before my exams. I got what your daughter needs. She needs to do her coursework and get decent grades there. Maybe head of year could let you know what is required when so you could keep an eye on it?

Bribery too could work.

On a more general note, I've read about half this thread. I don't have teenagers yet but it did make me think about myself.

I was very average at school. I did have an 'academic' home but there wasn't alot of parental input in my education at that point. I didn't study, I didn't care. I was bored stiff at achool. I was definitely of the 'could try harder' brigade. I got average to good GCSEs. Nothing special.

I wangled my way into a very good university as I read lots of books just before the interview.

I loved university. I was given lots of freedom, lots of challenge. I worked like a demon, got a first and excelled. You wouldn't have picked me out from the crowd at school.

Different environments bring out different things. It may be that school just isn't qute what your floats your child's boat.

Hully...she has had a tutor before for a year, specifically for maths. She enjoyed the extra support (and attention ) but her maths didn't improve.

Finances are not what they were either in this house (fucking recession)

I think I will make an appt to see her form tutor. I am making her worse and shutting her down even more, I am afraid, which was why we pulled back last year, but that didn't help either. She just had a minimal-work year, let her grades slide even more and here we are. Fuck.

What doesn't help is that we are also having problems with boundaries, general attitude towards us and some risky behaviours (not too bad at the moment due to our intervention but potentially bad) so our eyes have been off the ball with school work to some extent.

And then I think step back and let her fail. But what will she dooooo ?

Gimme a toddler, any day.

hully I've had to take a hard line with very clear rewards and consequences because my son was desperately under-acheiving, dis-engaged and messing about in class and getting a reputation for being a troublemaker. It was becoming a vicious circle as he experienced school as so un-rewarding.

If he doesn't act like someone fast approaching adulthood he doesn't get the anticipated rewards of being older.

I've also 'threatened' tutoring in the past [embaressed] - even tho' I couldn't actually afford it - because I felt my son needed help with his organisational/study skills and a mentoring relationship with a man.

I think your kind advice to AF could really help her daughter. Yoga, meditation and relaxation tapes can be useful for the very real (and understandable) anxiety.

BTW AnyFucker, IME GCSE language students are often given lists of sentences to memorise to use in orals. That's the sort of thing I meant.

I have to stop panicking, for a start, don't I ?

< renews prescription for mogadon >

latrucha, i love your story and I know it's true for some people.

But this kid ain't gonna get into college, never mind Uni

< starts sewing the Morrison's uniform >

if she doesn't apply herself

fargate what exactly was your hard line with rewards/consequences ?

cyb sorry for hijack

you said you had noticed a difference recently...is it still the case ?

I'm like that tiger mother person, I get really really involved. I could pass a chemistry gcse tomorrow. The downside is they seek me out to work with them, because "I learn better that way." Be careful what you wish for.

But that aside, most of the world are utterly involved in their kids' education and absolutely don't understand our hands-off, let em fail approach. I say get in there, hover, heliccopter, whatever it takes to get em through it. So there.

Hully...how can you helicoptor someone who just will not do it ?

There is that.

Would she sit down with biscuits with you and draw up a contract?