To not want SD coming on these holidays anymore?

[QueenCarmel]

SD is 13. DH and I have been together since she was 5, and we have DD5 and 3. We used to have SD three nights a week but since she started secondary, she’s stopped coming in the week and now rarely at weekends either. We are stricter than her mum on things like homework (she’s behind and it’s rarely done), bedtimes and screen time so she prefers to be at her mum’s house. When she’s here, it’s always under duress and she’s not pleasant to be around. Unfortunately, we have no contact order and have been advised that we are unlikely to get increased time as she’s old enough to decide.

We haven’t seen her since the end of May and she’s ignoring DH’s calls and texts (he has been inviting her here and also to things like the cinema or for a meal with just him). He has just received an email from her mum saying:

”X doesn’t want to come to your house anymore so stop messaging her about it. It’s harassment. She will see you on Saturday if you take her to (nearby city) as she needs new clothes and trainers. She’ll still come on the holidays too.”

The holidays are New York for my sister’s wedding in November and we have been planning a big Caribbean break for next year. I don’t think it’s fair for her to check out of our family entirely except for very expensive holidays.

Tbh the wedding isn't a holiday is it? And her behaviour is problematic. I wouldn't want to risk a young teen with that kind of behaviour in New York tbh. I just couldn't risk it. Anything could happen to her if she sneaks off.

No to the wedding and if she wants to be treated like an adult, give her a budget to work with for her clothes and trainer shopping.

You can't really go round saying it's harassment to try and talk to someone, but yet they're eager to go on holiday with you for free and accept unlimited gifts.

I think that's all you really need to say to both of them and see how they respond.

It’s a difficult one but I think as it’s your sisters wedding she stays at home

as to the other holiday I would decide nearer the time

I would ask dh to have a word with her, tell her he loves her and wants to be in her life, but she has to do the humdrum as well as the exciting, it’s all part of growing up

It’s really difficult, because I wouldn’t want to take her either, but equally I don’t think your DH should be going on holiday and excluding some of his children.

i think I’d say no to the wedding. It’s your family’s event, not his, and she has chosen not to be part of your family any more. She is old enough to know that choices have consequences, and it doesn’t really sound like you can trust her not to spoil the day for your sister. Caribbean? To be honest if it’s not booked yet I’d cancel, do something smaller with your children and maybe he can take DSD somewhere alone.

Could this possibly be because it’s just her and her Dad ? Does she get that 1:1 time with him?

Think of it from her perspective , whether you think it rational or not remember she is a child - she comes to see her Dad in a house that is a family home that she is on the outside of because she doesn’t live there. She is sharing her time with her dad with you and 2 siblings who get their dad all the time. This can feel very isolating. No matter how hard you try she could still feel like an outsider. The fact that she’s lovely as you say when she’s alone with him but isn’t when she is with you all is a clear sign here.

To be clear, DH has been calling and messaging her regularly, asking her to do all kinds of things together from getting Starbucks to coming fo ours for lunch to a UK beach weekend with him. She’s said no (or not replied). I have been messaging her once a week just to say I hope she’s okay etc.

And to the poster who suggested it, yes I could go to my sister’s wedding alone, but DDs are really excited to go and see their cousins and family we don’t see often. It’d be a shame for them and DH to miss it.

OP, I am in the exact same boat.
My DSD just turned 15, I've known her since she was born.

Myself and DH have 3 DC together.
About 2 years ago, DSD stopped coming over; before that she would come over every 2 weeks and be bloody miserable when she was here. Going up to her room, ignoring her brothers, ALWAYS getting a headache.
It was tough work when she was here.

Visiting then became very sporadic along with ignoring calls & texts or coming over to see her grandparents but not us.
A year ago she had a conversation with DH and just said she basically didn't like him.
He told her that her comments really hurt. He backed off a bit but would still stay in touch.

We invited her on numerous trips over the years, always says no.
I feel bad for her brothers as they were very close to her but she started blocking DS (now 12) when he was 9 and trying to text her. He was upset by it all & now rarely asks for her.
It was tough as they would always ask when she was coming over, then it was 'why doesnt she want to see us'.

In the past few months, she's slowly back on the scene and has come to visit and gone for dinner. It was all nice & no issues.

I massively empathise with you as our situations sound very similar.
I'd love for us all to have a closer relationship but it doesn't seem to be on the cards for us.
Poor DH has always wanted to be involved but he isn't treated like the 2nd parent. Sometimes I think he's just seen as an ATM.
He wouldn't be involved in any decision making when it comes to DSD.

I don't think it's fair for DSD mam to say to your DH that DSD doesn't want to come over but will be happy to go shopping & on holidays. DH should address that, along the lines of 'I will be happy to take DSD shopping and we'd love to have her on holidays, however I am surprised she would like to go shopping since she doesn't want to see me. Can we meet up to discuss this'

Talking in person much better than hiding behind an email!!

My attitude at the moment is to still be in touch with DSD, I'll text to see how she is, or we will invite her over.
The lines of communication are open and I just hope one day she will see we aren't bad people & we want the best for her.

This needs a sit down family meeting type of thing between the 3 of you. Neither she nor her mother get to dictate the terms of your relationship and she needs to understand there are consequences for her actions. If she cannot be respectful of your rule’s for 3 days a week, and given some of the behaviours you have described, then there is no way she can be trusted to behave for longer periods thousands of miles away.
I would definitely not take her to the wedding, not remotely fair on anyone to risk her behaviour there. then perhaps you could discuss rebuilding the relationships
starting with her dad meeting up with her, moving onto shorter visits to your home and to interact with her siblings and eventually staying on a regular basis. If you make progress then you can decide on the big holiday next year.

Ignore the mum in your DH keeping in contact with SD. He should keep checking in with her and saying things like ‘pizza for dinner on Friday if you want to come over.

wedding abroad is a tricky one. That’s I would be very tempted to not take her. She will Absolutely take the opportunity to do her own thing and disappear off. Your DH can only monitor so much.

just say that as it’s a wedding and not a holiday, you’ve decided to keep the trip short and don’t do as Much sightseeing.

as for next years holiday, i’d make it a condition of good behaviour and weekly visits.

Tough shit if she says it’s blackmail, not being an active part of the family and sneaking out shouldn’t be got away with.

Thank you for sharing, that sounds similar. I hope your SD comes through it soon. I think ours finds us a bit boring and uncool. Her mum has a new boyfriend who has older teens and I think she’d rather be in their vicinity than ours with the younger kids because it makes her feel more grown up. But to be honest this new step family isn’t a very good influence and it makes us really worried.

Yes let's push her away further.

This post nails it for me- if you wouldn’t exclude your own children from holidays etc for being moody teens, then you can’t exclude her.

I think the short break in UK together is a very good idea. See if she accepts that, and then maybe a few other outings in the summer holidays. Maybe that will help as a reset.
I think you and DH have to make some attempt to improve the situation. Plan some things and invite her to them. If she says no because not glam enough.. DH needs to point out that she can't just see him on holidays and not during the rest of the year as well. I'm surprised her mum is agreeing to that. Its spoiling her.

Your sister's wedding is not a holiday. You are there to support your sister.
Your DS to look after your young children whilst you do so.

Weddings may sound exciting, but they can be really boring for kids. She won't know anyone except you and her dad, it will be a room full of strange adults and no one paying her attention. Even if it is in NY.. It's not a holiday. Same goes for the Rehearsal Dinner and so on... long drawn out social occasions that centre around people she doesn't know. That's enough to make any teen miserable. Cant your DH promise her a proper NY trip some other time? Does she like sight seeing or is it about shopping?

The Caribbean is some way off - things may have changed by then hopefully.

I think if you have rules for your own children and you have reasonable rules for SDD then she ought to try to meet them... especially if its about doing homework, going to bed on time etc.. I don't think that's harsh. Its difficult to have one rule for one and another for everyone else... and DH should explain that to her. The issue is that she's allowed to do what she wants at her mums, if I'm reading your post right.

This, for me, would be the crux of the matter. Her relationship with her dad is at a place where he has no authority any more, and she cannot be trusted. I absolutely would not be taking her to the wedding trip, because it is a situation with drama written all over it.

The girl and her stupid mother need to learn that actions have consequences.

I can’t imagine any scenario that could lead to it, but if I hadn’t seen my own children for six months, I wouldn’t be taking them on an expensive holiday. I’d want to arrange low-key, consistent reunions, not the potential for a lot of drama which could make the relationship even worse.

We invited her on a UK city break in May and she didn’t want to. DH invited her for a seaside weekend with just him and she didn’t reply. She doesn’t want to spend time with us.

NY is about shopping and social media content for her. She will know my parents too but yes, I agree it’ll be boring for her. We have a lot of family events and meals to attend. I don’t particularly want to do all of those with just DDs whilst SD gets to go on a big shopping trip with DH; it’s primarily a family event.

Is she invited to your sister's wedding?

Yes she is but we haven’t booked it yet.

She is probably quite excited about New York then. I'm sure she will behave beautifully at the wedding and even help your dh with the little ones if she is promised a shopping trip will take place after the wedding as a thanks for her help

A thanks for her help? She a member of the family, she shouldn’t need to be bartered with to act as such. She goes along with the family events or she doesn’t go, end of imo.

let them do the shopping trip but no to the holidays

I personally agree with you OP.
I get that she's a teenager in a difficult juncture in her life but I also don't feel that she should be allowed to treat her dad or you like cash cows. Fair enough, she doesn't want to visit. That's her decision and you are respecting that but you're also leaving the door open for her if and when she changes her mind. That to me demonstrates a loving home awaiting her return when she's ready.
What I don't agree with is enabling this grabby attitude of I'll only come over if I get money spent on me or I get to go on a lavish holiday.
Most of the people commenting on here have never been a step parent. Its way harder than being a biological parent and until youve experienced it, you'll never fully understand.
I'll await the flaming.......

I agree with this entirely.

And I certainly wouldn't be impressed by the mother's imperious demand's either.

This is why we need the 'laugh' emoji back.

Thanks for letting me know. I look forward to hearing from her regarding the shopping trip and the uk seaside break holiday I suggested. I won’t text her if she feels I am harassing her so will wait to hear from her. That leaves the ball in her court and you can see what happens next before making any big decisions about the other holidays.