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171 replies

candlesandpitchforks · 25/05/2022 13:20

Starting a new one as other seems to have dropped into oblivion.

How we all doing ? Some of you might recognise me as the poster who had v traumatic pregnancy and I can confirm my baby boy arrived and is currently doing well ! Thank god it was bit touch and go but hurrah for NHS.

Also just me or has there been some really bonkers comments on this board of late ?

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SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 07:11

There seem to be some particularly awful regular contributors to the vicious atmosphere. Ironically who claim to be all about the (step) child, but who have utterly no empathy for anyone else or ability to understand nuance or complexity.

I find regularly name changing to be a sensible tactic for MN.

SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 07:16

And the acceptance of the incredibly low bar for fatherhood is depressing.

post about the issues in you nuclear family on and MN posters would be all over him having to pull his parenting weight and not to do all the wifework. Add in a SC, and suddenly you knew you were marrying into a life of servitude and drudgery and the poor SC will be horribly damaged if you insist their father pulls any parenting weight.

MarmaladeLime · 26/05/2022 07:22

@SoggyPaper Yes I agree. I did once consider posting about an issue I had but changing the details so it was a nuclear family having the issue. But that felt dishonest and I didn't know if the step thing was an issue. It's almost like as soon as you mention you're a 2nd wife that's it, you're a slave and must take on everything but also not take on everything as you aren't their mum.

SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 07:30

No wonder so many terrible husbands (looking at my own!) are so keen to find themselves a live in babysitter, housekeeper, and general scapegoat new wife after their first marriage breaks down. They feel entitled to it.

The ‘my poor children with their broken family’ thing becomes an incredibly effective means of preventing their wife from objecting to any of it. A

Of course, they know it’s not an attractive prospect, so they hide all of this until it’s too late. Either entirely, which is much easier to achieve when there is no low stakes way to try out living together (because you have to think about consistency for the children). Or it’s masked by the context in various convenient ways. The children are just ‘adjusting’ to new circumstances so that’s why the parenting stuff is screwed up and so on.

I mean, loads of men hide the fact that they’re a lazy, misogynistic, entitled arsehole til they’ve got their skivvy trapped. In a stepfamily he can use his children to make her into the villain for objecting to anything.

SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 07:39

@MarmaladeLime i think it’s that you have to take on everything undesirable, never show any negative feelings about it but, at the same time, you’re excluded from anything positive because you’re not their mother.

You can spend many years cooking, cleaning, looking after, entertaining, running around after a stepchild. You can buy them things and pay for them to go to university (at least in part). You can even pay their bloody child maintenance when their father isn’t working. And still you’d be unreasonable to expect to be acknowledged as an important family member at their graduations, weddings and so on.

There is no reason why it should be all the crap and none of the positives (sometimes, what should be positives are excellent ways to show you that your role is only the crap).

so many MN threads; same messages: you chose a man with children so you deserve a lifetime of punishment for that. No one should care about you.

Magda72 · 26/05/2022 07:57

There's a thread on here at the moment which I haven't commented on as tbh it got me so riled up. It's a woman who sounds fairly confused both about her own dc & the fact that her dh wants to move in with his adult children as one of them is seeing a therapist.
Every single person told her to basically let her husband go; that his dc should be his priority. Not one person acknowledged the fact that this man CHOSE to remarry and in doing so also made a commitment to his wife!
This woman also had concerns about her teen dd and her dd's dad and the whole tone of the posts was give up your marriage, let your dh's (adult!!!) dc dictate everything & go focus on your daughter you bad mother. All really patronising & dismissive & hardly any constructive advice!
One of the more patronising posts was by a well known poster who admits is not a step parent and whose own dc are not in a blended situation. Her entire commentary is based on her brother's experiences as a divorced & remarried parent & her opinion of how he and his partner handle things or how this poster thinks they should handle things!

candlesandpitchforks · 26/05/2022 08:59

Magda72 · 26/05/2022 07:57

There's a thread on here at the moment which I haven't commented on as tbh it got me so riled up. It's a woman who sounds fairly confused both about her own dc & the fact that her dh wants to move in with his adult children as one of them is seeing a therapist.
Every single person told her to basically let her husband go; that his dc should be his priority. Not one person acknowledged the fact that this man CHOSE to remarry and in doing so also made a commitment to his wife!
This woman also had concerns about her teen dd and her dd's dad and the whole tone of the posts was give up your marriage, let your dh's (adult!!!) dc dictate everything & go focus on your daughter you bad mother. All really patronising & dismissive & hardly any constructive advice!
One of the more patronising posts was by a well known poster who admits is not a step parent and whose own dc are not in a blended situation. Her entire commentary is based on her brother's experiences as a divorced & remarried parent & her opinion of how he and his partner handle things or how this poster thinks they should handle things!

I saw this one Magda I was like I just bloody can't. I really feel for the op and it's interesting that most people said let him go focus on his adult child.. but completely avoided the narrative of her DD at all and there are other routes they could take that didn't mean him moving out of family home If dd grown up with DH and he's suddenly vanished I can imagine that hurting. It's also hurtful to op since as you said he bloody married her.

It sounded like the DH has checked out and is somewhat using his son as a excuse not to be around. However the pain in OPs post means it would almost be cruel to point this out. I think she knows bless her and I want to just give her a hug but undoubtedly I would get shouted down if I mentioned the above.

Fair amount of gaslight happening on posts at the moment. I'm usually waiting for the sensible posters to come along like yourself and others to come along and drown it out but fuck me theres a lot of it.

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User39498 · 26/05/2022 09:01

@Magda72 i read that thread, although not all of it. Thing is a lot of the comments in general which are critical of the SM, encourages complete lack of boundaries for the DSC which is well know that boundaries are so important for children and make them feel safe. That thread seemed like there had mean many years of no boundaries from the DH...

and the other thread about why wouldn’t you give the DSC a lift to school, but it is best for the DSC to walk 10 mins and get some exercise? Didn’t seem to matter what was actually best for DSC, just that the SM had said she wasn’t going to do something...

SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 09:02

Sometimes you just can’t touch them with a barge pole, can you?

candlesandpitchforks · 26/05/2022 09:13

@SoggyPaper your spot on, that and I find the second wife always seems to have her shit together in terms of house, finances and work.

Had I known the issues I would have faced in a blended family I would have thought twice even though I have a fairly supportive partner. It sometimes doesn't feel enough. I have to say getting rid of our family dog due to DSD actions was a particularly low point but he deserved to be kept safe and horse therapy has helped because you cannot bully a horse and they are big enough to make their presence known.

@MarmaladeLime funnily enough the jealousy from DSC came after a lot of one on one time with DSC and DH (two separate days out) and also One on one with me (as she used to get quite jealous of my time being taken up with Dd) so I carve that time out. Also because we go horse riding which she loves and DH is ridiculous on a horse. However that difference maybe because she's NNT and may have thought we would be able to vanish the baby for the entirety of her stay 3 times a week. I'm going to speak to her therapist to see if I'm approaching this like a neurologically typical person which won't work for DSD and probably won't work for my DD (who isn't diagnosed). Sigh the grind goes on.

I suspect what we need is time and a pattern to establish tbh and her mum kindly told her I died (cardiac issue in section under GA) and DSD was most unimpressed and seems to be holding this against the baby and surprisingly DH (but not me) God knows why 😵‍💫😵‍💫 but I only wish it hadn't been shared with her in such a way before we could have done in a controlled situation with proper support for her.

As I said I expected bumps I expected lots of things but I certainly didn't expect what's been thrown at me.

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MarmaladeLime · 26/05/2022 09:21

What an awful thing to have told her! Interesting what you say about spending 1 on 1 time with her having the opposite effect. Something for us to watch out for!

candlesandpitchforks · 26/05/2022 09:28

@MarmaladeLime ah so my DSD is non Neurologically typical so this crops up a lot as I approach it like a NT person and bugger it up. DSC likes patterns routine so the routine wouldn't be for a all singing dancing weekend packed for adventure each day without baby, me or DD toe. It's usually one on one but in more low key way and not for that entire duration. She's also 13 so that might come into play as she's at the age of being very less willing to please.

My DD is less like this but still shared traits and is nearly 4 so fairly willing to please still. But I buggered this up so don't follow my lead it's just what happened with us.

I feel like I manage to nail this whole situation then get thrown another curve ball and I have no fecking idea what to do 😂😭😵‍💫

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SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 09:30

Why would her mum tell her that?

That said, apparently my SC’s mum told her children, their father and all his neighbours (furious doorstep ranting) that her son was responsible for her boyfriend leaving her. No matter how upset you are you don’t tell your 5 year old that he has destroyed your romantic life. His father then, in relaying this to me, described his son as ‘a bad kid’.

So I think my bar for shit some people will say to or about their kids.

I mean, SS is very challenging and not enjoyable to spend time with. He’s aggressive and I worry about my toddler in his company. I can well believe that being intolerable was a key factor in (yet another) failed relationship. The problems with the children’s behaviour were definitely a key factor in ours failing.

But he is that way because of the toxicity in that family. He’s the black sheep and he will live down to his reputation. Future relationships will fail for both of them because they are terrible parents and terrible people.

candlesandpitchforks · 26/05/2022 09:48

@SoggyPaper that's actually diabolical I can't believe I just read that. Why why ? I mean clearly these people exist (because my DH ex) but I just can't wrap my head.

If you have a challenging ex wife in background that's one thing (and a nightmare) but combine it with challenging DH and your just on the road to hell.

I have no idea why she told her that. In my less angry state after I have had DSD glued to me making sure I wasn't about to disappear from this mortal coil again, maybe she was trying to explain badly why I wasn't responding as quickly to DSC texts (she texts me a lot during day and expects a fairly rapid response) or DSD was having a bad day. I haven't asked because I can't and honestly I have to mentally think the best when thinking about it because it will lose my nut at the damage inflicted on a child.

Anyway it was totally irrelevant as I am indeed alive (and somewhat kicking) and what happened was rare but ultimately fine. Should have known it could have happened I'm allergic to many of the decent drugs in hospital tbh but I was just focused on getting him here alive I forgot about me lol 😂

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SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 12:54

I think trying to be charitable in your interpretation is probably a good approach.

A big issue with my husband is his inability to assume good faith in anything. All actions must be interpreted through a lens of bad faith. You couldn’t just be busy and forgot something; you set out to not do it.

Of course, when I look at the things his ex did (does!) and the incredibly negative effects on my life it became increasingly hard to be charitable in interpretation. There was just too much evidence of a fundamental issue with the woman’s personal values that will never be compatible with mine. The issue manifested in a million small ways, each of which might seem petty on its own, but which cumulatively formed big problems. And also in some spectacular moments where it was just clear that the woman would always cause real issues, and is bringing her kids up with values that anathemic to me and which I cannot live with.

That all might have been OK if I had a supportive husband who could help to navigate the differences. But no. It turns out that he’s pretty dreadful and, even though he will never admit it, I think shares some of the values I think are problematic. And has his own awful values. Who describes their child as a fundamentally bad kid? Partly it’s the malign influence of his mother who is obsessed with ‘bad genes’ as the reason people are awful (including her own daughter!). But it’s also just him and his worldview.

On top of that, he’s lazy and keen to abdicate responsibility whenever possible. He recognises issues in the SC’s mother’s parenting as dreadful but just holds his hands up and says ‘I can’t do anything; I’ve got limited influence’. He expected me to do everything - including any of the thinking or problem solving required to try to mitigate the problem. ‘You’re the one with the problem; you need to help me solve it’ - which means ‘you figure it out and I’ve already pre-scapegoated you so I can complain you’re horrible’. He let me down in really profound ways.

Apparently I should have recognised all this in advance though. I knew what I was getting in to. And I shouldn’t complain because I chose a man with ‘existing’ children (because mine are not existing). 🙄

Back to the point though… I think if you are in a place where it is possible to cling to a charitable interpretation, that is a very good thing. It probably means the circumstances are good enough. You still have the capacity to practice empathy in the context; it hasn’t been so worn out that it’s decided to fuck off on a gap year in SE Asia instead!

SoggyPaper · 26/05/2022 13:08

I’ll clarify that my husband’s inability to apply empathy or interpret anything charitably is dispositional rather than contextual.

He masked this quite effectively until we were co-owners of a house with a baby on the way (in hindsight, there were indications). But it’s been abundantly clear that criticising everything and assuming everyone has bad intentions is just his default position in the world. Tbf, he’s leveraged this disposition extremely effectively in a career that capitalises on both those things!

But it’s impossible to live with. He will admit that he’s ruined past relationships by being relentlessly critical of his partners. I can absolutely believe that.

The flip side of knowing it’s his disposition and worldview is that I can feel confident that I am accurate in my interpretation that he is being horrible on purpose. He assumes bad faith in everyone else because that’s how he operates in the world. That realisation makes some of the things he’s done that I might have attributed to being stressed or whatever look very different. He didn’t financially abuse me because he was stressed, out if his depth and didn’t know what to do. He meant to do it. He was calculating and deliberative in how he did it. And the poor, confused martyr act was just that. He’s been doing bad things and playing the poor innocent angel/confused fool to get away with it all his life.

I now interpret his stories about how he used the assumptions the teachers made about him being small (he’s really short) and quiet to get away with fighting with kids who annoyed him very differently. His narrative is that people routinely underestimate him. He was much stronger than they realised etc. But that’s not the full story. Having had him pull the same trick on me many times: he’s small, quiet, a poor confused father, out of his depth, etc so he couldn’t possibly be being awful or cruel. Indeed, the fact he knows people will perceive him as such (he’s told me many times), means that he is purposefully play acting to abuse me and then present himself as the victim.

It’s especially effective as I had ADHD (pretty sure; awaiting diagnosis appointment) and it means I don’t always present as a nice, quiet, tidy victim. Corner me like a wild animal and I will bite because I have no other choice. He knows this and is willing to manipulate it. It’s huge scale gaslighting of the whole world.

candlesandpitchforks · 26/05/2022 13:28

@SoggyPaper firstly I'm glad your getting a diagnosis because with better understanding about yourself you can protect yourself against people like your DP ex's wife and husband who would take advantage.

Thing is there's no such thing as the perfect female victim. There will always be a way to discredit her but good people, people with empathy will see past the not being a "good victim" and see the matter for what it is. I have to say I get my teeth out too if necessary.

Are you still with your DP ? I'm not gonna lie he sounds like you should run for hills screaming tbh. I'm sorry you have suffered all of this, that is a lot 💐

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blackOrWhite · 26/05/2022 13:40

Hello 👋
Another one in dysfunctional SM role here. Struggling to navigate, getting guilt tripped all the time but slowly finding my way out of this madness.
Learning how to set boundaries. And this one is super hard when there is so many expectations from everyone.

Being told by DSD9 that I behave like a 5 years old child because I refused to sit in the back of the car for her. Obviously I became enemy no 1, unwelcomed in my own home when she is there. Evil looks, talking back and tantrums became the norm since I laid any boundaries.

No more trips together. We were going to go away for 5 nights in June but because I refuse to sit in the back, DP said he is just going to go with DD.

Know your place in the hierarchy, SM Confused

Babyghirl · 26/05/2022 14:06

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harriethoyle · 26/05/2022 14:16

Agreed re child in the front and me in the back! It happened once and it was made clear it would not be happening again... and tbf to my DH, once I'd explained why it was problematic, it hasn't happened again.

MarmaladeLime · 26/05/2022 15:06

Car seat wars sound ridiculous frankly. Especially when a booster seat has to be moved. There is no need for a child to sit up front over an adult.

Babyghirl · 26/05/2022 15:11

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Youseethethingis1 · 26/05/2022 15:14

@Babyghirl it sounds like he's hell bent on bringing up an insufferable pain in the arse to be honest. I'd enjoy the peace for 5 in days and seriously consider whether I want to hang around to see what the teen years bring.
Honestly can't understand how these men reached adulthood with so little awareness.

Babyghirl · 26/05/2022 15:46

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candlesandpitchforks · 26/05/2022 16:14

Come join the crowd @blackOrWhite I prefer the nickname evil sms lol but everyone has their preference lol !

Car seats sounds massively hard and not about car seats if that makes sense. It's about control and your place in the family hierarchy. @Babyghirl is right though calling out Disney dadding in a jokey way (once he knows what it is) is a good idea.

I do this but after I had the convo of what type of humans do we want to create and what do we want for them in the future a few times and how to help them (it's rolling talking topic because I like to talk about things . It does help that he has DSD and I have DD and it helps acknowledging the parts of parenting I found hard as he let is guard down and did the same as it was a topic around a topic. Does that make any sense.

Disney dadding comes from a place of guilt and it's worth exploring that with DP. Also try this podcast it's amazing on Spotify open.spotify.com/show/17eQLWrjnuRUGt7gRx1yxt?si=Sl5HV2DDTq2YwPaR14Toyg just know your not alone

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