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Who the hell does this to their child?!

166 replies

Lismoa · 17/04/2022 07:46

I'm fuming and just need to vent!

We have been through an awful time with DSC's mum - crazy accusations, extreme parental alienation to the point that they've eventually been removed from her and now live with me and DH.
We wanted to take the DSC on holiday and knew she might try to block it in some way so we got a court order saying we could take them abroad and essentially forcing her permission to get the youngest a passport as he didn't have one. Initially she tried to delay things by repeatedly sending blurry photos of her own passport meaning her passport number was blurred (this was required for the application and the court had ordered she send her passport details) or photos that were so dark you couldn't read it or had the light shining brightly onto the passport number so you couldn't see. However eventually DH asked her for the passport number in person while collecting DSC and she gave him it, I'd guess because DSC were there and she didn't want to appear the bad guy blocking their holiday. The delay meant we had to pay extra to have the passport fast-tracked to make sure we had it in time but that's fine, at least we got it. After this she seemed to be starting to play ball and we thought maybe she was starting to mellow and realise that good relations were in the best interests of the children. She seemed to be being positive about the holiday to the children so we thought we were starting to make steps forward. We were so wrong!

We got away to our destination fine. She sent an unusual text on the first day saying - I'll assume you're all happy then- we thought it was her trying to make a point about DH not having told her we'd arrived (they have bare minimum contact with one another so it wouldn't have occurred to message her, DSC live full time with us and there's no contact between DH and his ex unless necessary). DH just replied saying DSC were very happy and having a great time and that was that.

On coming back into the country we were stopped at border control. She had reported oldest DSC's passport as being stolen. Apparently this was done just prior to our trip but it wasn't checked on the system on the way out the country (just checked visually rather than scanned) so they didn't clock it, nor did the country we were entering as they just did the same. Border control told us that if they had scanned his passport on the way out then he wouldn't have been allowed to leave the country and we couldn't have gone away.
We tried not to let the kids hear anything when the border control guy was telling us what was going on but the oldest kept trying to listen in and picked up on what was happening. His wee face when he realised what was going on and said to me - I know what's happened, my mum reported it as lost. She said the other week that she couldn't find my passport and would need to report it- it actually broke my heart for him. He looked absolutely broken, just devastated as the realisation hit him.
His mum has never had his passport in her possession. She has never taken him away anywhere, DH got DSS his passport after they had split up and has been the only one to ever take him away (which was only once so this holiday was a big deal to him) and has always had the passport.

Five minutes later, after literally saying - I know who it was, my mum did it- (we had been making out like it was a mistake that it had been reported stolen and he was saying - no, mum did it) he then started saying - I wonder who could have reported my passport as being stolen? That's so strange? Who would report a random person's passport as lost or stolen? -
It's obviously his way of dealing with it, by pretending to himself that she didn't do it even when he knows and was the one to say himself it was her. We went along with this, agreeing that it was all really strange and not mentioning his mum despite us all knowing fine well it was her. It feels like we're always doing this. We never say negative things about their mum and it's like we're constantly having to hide her behaviour from DSC to protect them from it so they don't get hurt or affected by it.

But I just can't get over how someone can be so bitter and twisted that they would do this to their own child in an attempt to stop them from having a nice holiday with their dad. It's so fucked up. She was prepared for her children to be all excited for going away, and she was adding to their excitement by being encouraging about the holiday, and then be turned away at the airport. I'm so so glad that the passports weren't scanned on the way out because the kids would have been completely devastated.

What I find hard sometimes though is that the kids will so easily convince themselves that she's an angel. I know it's the right thing for us to cover for her behaviour if it means they're less affected by it. It's to protect them and shield them from it but it's hard when for example even after what happened today they are talking about how they are going to show their mum their holiday photos and teach her the new words they've learned, like she's done nothing, and my mind is just screaming at her. It's better for them to see her that way though, I know, but it's just so frustrating. I felt so much anger towards her today, seeing them sitting there all anxious waiting at border control for ages while it all got sorted (which it thankfully did as DH had brought all the court documents with us just incase although DSS's passport was impounded and we'll likely need to go to court again to get another one).

I hate having such a toxic person in our lives.

OP posts:
Magda72 · 17/04/2022 09:48

I would stick to the childrens narrative so as not to cause further upset.
Keep putting them first and showing you love them, it’s good they have a secure home with you and their dad.

But this is not actually putting the children first & the denial of her behaviours will cause massive issues when they are older.
Professionals can assist with how to talk about behaviours without badmouthing the person.

Goawayangryman · 17/04/2022 09:49

Gosh what a terrible thing to do. Well done you for being so calm, you sound amazing.

The whole 'not talking bad' thing about the other parent is really difficult to manage. You have two competing priorities... You need to make sure that the children are capable of trusting their own judgement and acknowledging their feelings. Without undermining their love for their other parent. It is a tightrope. Professional help I reckon.

Lismoa · 17/04/2022 10:10

Your DSS is pretending his mum is innocent because the truth is too painful. Imagine that? Your mum has deliberately tried to sabotage your holiday. Tried to hurt you. That means she may not love me. Nope, pretend she's not like that. Easier. Poor kids.

Exactly, it's heart-breaking.

OP posts:
IAMGE · 17/04/2022 10:13

I feel your pain.
My ex does this to try to scupper any holidays. Document everything. Don’t speculate with the kids. Eg adults will
Sort it. Talk about it later. Etc

Lismoa · 17/04/2022 10:24

Is there a way you can encourage open dialogue with them, so at least they can get whatever it is off their chest and out in the open so they are not holding the weight of it all on their own? You don't need to counter anything they say, just give them a safe space for them to say whatever they need to?

We try our best to do this and as a result they will be very open about how they feel with anything relating to our household, however they still very much hold back on discussing anything negative to do with their mum. We have also discussed the keeping secrets aspect as the youngest has told me he has 'sad secrets', we have discussed this with their school as their school has a strong counselling and nurture focus and all the teachers are nurture trained. They haven't shared anything there yet either but are attending nurture sessions.

To answer some of the other questions and comments-
They had a social worker when they lived with her and we mentioned this to her but she wasn't concerned after speaking to him. Since coming to live with us they no longer have a social worker as it's no longer deemed necessary.

In terms of dealing with things their mum does and says, it's often done in a very underhanded way. They love her and say they miss her a lot. She doesn't do these things in front of them, hence things like she finally gave her passport number when asked when DSC were there. It's all very calculated. We don't outright pretend that she's not done things, because oftentimes they don't even know what she's done. So for example when she was purposely delaying youngest DSC's passport application, the DSC would ask what was happening with his passport and when ut would arrive and instead of saying, 'it's because your mum keeps sending blurry photos on purpose', we would be saying, 'don't worry we're getting it all sorted'. So it's not that we defend her behaviour but more that we don't share it with DSC. We do try to explain to them why certain things are not ok or not normal, but we don't directly relate it to their mum. But what is happening from that now is that they will say things are wrong or not okay, but then they don't appear to recognise those exact things happening when they are with their mum.

We are 100% going to seek out professional advice for ourselves in how to approach it and try to get them into counselling.

OP posts:
diddl · 17/04/2022 10:40

That's rather worrying isn't it?

That a child's passport was reported as stolen/lost & it had no effect at all & they could still travel out of the country?

Mellowyellow222 · 17/04/2022 10:46

@Lismoa

Is it even safe/healthy for your DSC being round her?

To be honest I've questioned this for a long time. Some of the things she has said to them in an attempt to alienate them from DH is just downright disgusting and I was shocked when the court didn't implement supervised access to ensure this wasn't able to continue. Now she has unsupervised visits and DSC have come back saying strange things at times, including youngest DSC starting to say things their mum has told them and oldest shushing him and shaking his head so he doesn't tell us and we don't know what's been said but know it's something that's not right.

This screams to me they need counselling. It’s a safe space they can be honest and not to worry about loyalties or hitting people’s feelings.

Their mum could be saying anything - they could believe anything. She is their mum and they want to believe she has their best interest at heart. Some gentle questioning from a neutral third party could help them work through this.

The sad secrets really tugs at the heart strings. Poor kid.

It’s brilliant they have you - but this woman is doing them so much damage.

Lismoa · 17/04/2022 10:49

That's rather worrying isn't it?

That a child's passport was reported as stolen/lost & it had no effect at all & they could still travel out of the country?

That did cross my mind but in this particular situation I'm glad it wasn't scanned. But in general, for other situations, it would be really worrying. They do check them visually to check that the image is of the traveller but they didn't scan it the way they did on our return. I guess they are more focused on who is coming into our country than who is leaving it (which could obviously be dangerous in terms of trafficking or abductions).

OP posts:
Magda72 · 17/04/2022 10:52

But what is happening from that now is that they will say things are wrong or not okay, but then they don't appear to recognise those exact things happening when they are with their mum.
And that's the crux of it really isn't it? Their inability to acknowledge her behaviour will warp their perception of relationships/love/care in the future.
Op you sound like you're doing everything you can & they are so lucky to have you & their dad.

TheBigDilemma · 17/04/2022 10:54

I’m surprised it wasn’t scanned but I can imagine happening with the airport chaos in recent weeks.

I do think that it is quite plausible that she alerted the airport about possible abduction before your trip.

Yes, I say abduction as authorities are not there to stop families having fun holidays, these are the measures to stop international child abduction and yes, one of the deterrents is being arrested in your way back just in case you left a kid with granny abroad.

DuchessofAnkh22 · 17/04/2022 11:00

You absolutely need to be honest "only your Mum or Dad can cancel it" you need to be clear with them about things that have obvious or clear causes. Also it's fine to say "we are waiting for your Mum to send through..." as its provable.

Flaunch · 17/04/2022 11:03

What a horrible spiteful bitch she must be :(.

Glad you had a lovely time ❤️

NorthernSpirit · 17/04/2022 13:00

What a horrible human being she is. Anyone who hates their EX and uses their own children as a weapon against them is a disgusting person.

We have an EW like this. I can’t tell you the number of bat shit things she has done to her own children to ‘punish’ her EH for daring to leave her.

One of the worse things has to be agreeing to take the children to see their grandparents in France for their grandma’s 70th birthday. She ‘approved’ it in writing months before. My OH applied & paid for passports (she was also obstructive so it had to go to court).

The night before the holiday dad speaking to the kids - they were really excited that they were going to see their grandparents & had packed suitcases. He went to pick them up to take them to the airport at 7am the next day and they weren’t home. She had taken them somewhere the evening before. She wrote him an email that morning to say she had changed her mind and the kids weren’t going.

My OH sat on a plane with 2 empty seats next to him and couldn’t hold back the tears.

This time, the police got involved, as did social services. He took her back to court (she tried to lie her way out of it). The judge saw right through it and threatened to take the children off her. He also awarded all the holiday costs to my OH. On the way out of court she told my OH ‘what a disgusting piece of shit he was for taking the children’s money.’

You can’t reason with these women - they are so emotionally damaged they can’t see the harm they are doing to the children.

My now 14 YO SD is starting to realise what his mum has done. His 16 YO sister thinks her mum can do no wrong and after years of parental alienation and her mum dripping poison in her ears (the courts or social services wouldn’t do anything and were next to useless) she (my SD) now refuses to see or speak to her dad - everything is his fault and her mum can do absolutely no wrong.

It’s so sad. I really hope karma gets her for everything she has done. There is a reason she’s an ex.

Good luck 🤞

Greyarea12 · 17/04/2022 15:19

It's illegal to report a passport as lost when it's not actually lost so I would contact passport office and report her. Don't let it go because yous will fear this is going to happen on every holiday otherwise.

Finallylostit · 17/04/2022 16:24

OP - honestly they know but the pain to your DSS will be immense.

I had similar where the new SM/DP of my EX reported me to Border Security as a flight risk and child kidnapper.

10 yrs on this still reverbrates every time we go on holiday. I have been pulled in to rooms in numerous countries and questioned etc. The distress to my DCs immense about age 11 - the eldest turned round to one official and said - you never ask my Dad or my SM when we flew with them. Why don't you just ask us?

The official tried to explain it was for their safety and DC - said it has been explained and investigated. That bitch left my Dad 5 yrs ago and she is still ruining my life

Some people are just evil - big hugs to your DSS - this will happen for years. I feel your pain

Lismoa · 17/04/2022 16:55

@NorthernSpirit

What a horrible human being she is. Anyone who hates their EX and uses their own children as a weapon against them is a disgusting person.

We have an EW like this. I can’t tell you the number of bat shit things she has done to her own children to ‘punish’ her EH for daring to leave her.

One of the worse things has to be agreeing to take the children to see their grandparents in France for their grandma’s 70th birthday. She ‘approved’ it in writing months before. My OH applied & paid for passports (she was also obstructive so it had to go to court).

The night before the holiday dad speaking to the kids - they were really excited that they were going to see their grandparents & had packed suitcases. He went to pick them up to take them to the airport at 7am the next day and they weren’t home. She had taken them somewhere the evening before. She wrote him an email that morning to say she had changed her mind and the kids weren’t going.

My OH sat on a plane with 2 empty seats next to him and couldn’t hold back the tears.

This time, the police got involved, as did social services. He took her back to court (she tried to lie her way out of it). The judge saw right through it and threatened to take the children off her. He also awarded all the holiday costs to my OH. On the way out of court she told my OH ‘what a disgusting piece of shit he was for taking the children’s money.’

You can’t reason with these women - they are so emotionally damaged they can’t see the harm they are doing to the children.

My now 14 YO SD is starting to realise what his mum has done. His 16 YO sister thinks her mum can do no wrong and after years of parental alienation and her mum dripping poison in her ears (the courts or social services wouldn’t do anything and were next to useless) she (my SD) now refuses to see or speak to her dad - everything is his fault and her mum can do absolutely no wrong.

It’s so sad. I really hope karma gets her for everything she has done. There is a reason she’s an ex.

Good luck 🤞

That's awful! I'm glad your 14 year old SD is seeing through it but that must be so hard for your DH that the 16 year old has had the wool put over her eyes.
OP posts:
Lismoa · 17/04/2022 17:17

It's illegal to report a passport as lost when it's not actually lost so I would contact passport office and report her. Don't let it go because yous will fear this is going to happen on every holiday otherwise.

Is this true? I've looked online but can't find anything. If it is we will definitely report.

OP posts:
Sundancerintherain · 17/04/2022 17:33

I have a cousin who was exactly like the exW in this situation.
She gaslit her poor DC, lied to everyone about her exH and was basically batshit. The family tried to talk to her about it and it became apparent that punishing her when was far more important than her DC's happiness.
In the long run her DC saw through her lies and manipulation.

Sundancerintherain · 17/04/2022 17:34
  • exH, not when.
Palavah · 17/04/2022 17:39

@Fluxcapacitator

You sound as though you are doing an amazing job, and clearly are putting the children first. Maybe speak to a professional about how to address the mothers behaviour with the dcs. My feeling is you may need to be more honest about her behaviour being unacceptable as it sounds confusing for them if it is all covered up.
I came on to say this. If you keep covering up for her then your facilitating that behaviour and teaching the children that it should be covered up, plus denying them the opportunity to express their hurt/confusion/anger and supporting them working through that.

I understand you're trying to protect them but you wouldn't want to make it worse.

apricotlane · 17/04/2022 18:02

This bothers me because I don't think I could cope if another woman was mothering my child. She sounds awful but I honestly don't know if I could handle it at all as my need to be everything to my child is all-consuming (though I am aware of it and know that there are unhealthy aspects of it). Try a new approach? Working with her? That sounds ridiculous I know, I just hate fragmented family set-ups, they cause so many issues. Is it worth trying something different to what you've been doing so far...

AndAsIfByMagic · 17/04/2022 18:11

I think you need to stop hiding her behaviour from the children. Let her deal with her nastiness when they ask her why she's such a cow.

Getyourarseofffthequattro · 17/04/2022 18:21

@apricotlane

This bothers me because I don't think I could cope if another woman was mothering my child. She sounds awful but I honestly don't know if I could handle it at all as my need to be everything to my child is all-consuming (though I am aware of it and know that there are unhealthy aspects of it). Try a new approach? Working with her? That sounds ridiculous I know, I just hate fragmented family set-ups, they cause so many issues. Is it worth trying something different to what you've been doing so far...
Presumably if you actually care for you child properly though you wouldn't end up in this scenario. It would be a harsh court to award primary residency to a father where the mother was previously main carer unless there were actual issues. The default is generally mum (or primary parent, which ofc can be dad but is usually mum)

You cannot "work with" people like this. She hates her ex more than she loves her children. That's not okay, don't work with that. She doesn't deserve any sympathy.

Op it's awful. Take @Magda72 advice, she is practically always spot on on this subject.

Greyarea12 · 17/04/2022 18:27

@Lismoa

It's illegal to report a passport as lost when it's not actually lost so I would contact passport office and report her. Don't let it go because yous will fear this is going to happen on every holiday otherwise.

Is this true? I've looked online but can't find anything. If it is we will definitely report.

Yeah me solicitor told me. (I was having bother with ex around my child's passport)
Goawayangryman · 17/04/2022 19:32

@apricotlane. You can never be everything to your child, or anyone, really. To think you can be, is a bit narcissistic. Your children are their own people. The OP's partner's ex sounds absolutely horrible so "working with" someone like this is not the way to go. Parallel parenting probably is. Abusers don't need accommodations and understanding, they need shutting down.