Page 23 | How much do I owe his kids?

Sssloou · 14/09/2021 09:55

Why does his wife not speak to him?

This is a huge red flag.

What has he said as to why his marriage ended?

His youngest must have been a baby when they separated.

It is v unusual for a woman with 3 pre-schoolers to kick out her DH and never speak to him.

What went on do you think?

SickOfCrap · 16/09/2021 02:48

Why are you 26 years old and already have 3 kids that aren't yours?
WHY????????????

Find a guy without kids! Seriously!
You owe them nothing!

holrosea · 16/09/2021 13:52

OP - sorry to come in with the blunt advice but FUCK HIM. You are completely ignoring and subsuming what you want and your own insticts because he is making you doubt yourself. You will make yourself ill. That hollow and sad feeling is the realisation that you are going to continue to accept a situation that is not good enough for you and the knowledge that you are not going to act on what you KNOW to be true.

And I say that from experience.

You are 26, child free, and want a happy, stable future with a partner who i willing to meet you halfway. The kids didn't even come into the discussion because he is the problem, not them.

You want a long term relationship and probably marriage - not possible with a married man.

You want a happy home and equal investment - not possible while most of his resources are going on his own debts or kids. Also, his debt clearly affects you because things like buying a house together, planning a big holiday, buying a car or any other large purchases would be affected by his debt.

The fact that he calls your valid points demands and says "it's your choice to put your life on hold" is very salient. It is your choice.

Just kick him out. The kids are his responsibility, you have made very well thought througha nd reasonable points, and he is not prepared to put the work in, even twisting it into "you are trying to control me". Juist tell him, "you're right, and you'd be better off without me trying to change you. Goodbye." Then change the locks. Do you not get a massive shot of relief just imagining that?

CoffeeBeansGalore · 16/09/2021 15:59

@hilfehilfehilfe Hello, hope you are ok. I realise you don't have to come back to the thread but I hope you have been able to sort some things out.

Original poster

hilfehilfehilfe · 16/09/2021 16:32

Hi @CoffeeBeansGalore and anyone else still reading this thread

Last week, the day after our difficult conversation DP sat me down and said he wanted to talk. He apologised very sincerely for how he had behaved and that it wasn't acceptable for him to treat me like that. He'd had an awful few days at work but that was no excuse. He said that he did understand where I was coming from and why I wanted what I wanted. He is, for various reasons, very scared of getting divorced I think because it could be easy or it could be hugely messy and ugly and upsetting and expensive. That said, he hasn't realised it was damaging our relationship - this is something I take with a pinch of salt as I did say, repeatedly, that I was unhappy about it. I will keep an eye on this in future. I had asked him to research while I deal with a life thing over a period of weeks, and he had already done everything I had asked that morning.

He has now approached his wife about getting a divorce - they do communicate but very sparsely and only ever about the kids - and she is now doing her own research before they can begin the process. But he is determined to get divorced, as quickly and smoothly as he can. Additionally, he has said that he doesn't want me to support us or feel like I'm carrying a burden so he wants to find a way to be able to contribute to our lives without him having claim over my house. This is something I need to seek legal advice over first but he will do whatever I ask of him to be able to do this.

I'm aware this could be manipulative. I'm aware he could now be love bombing me. That said, if I had very nearly lost the person I considered the love of my life then I too would be affectionate and eager to do whatever it took to save our relationship. I have told him that regardless of how tired or any other circumstance that I will not ever accept him treating me the way he did in those conversations ever again. He accepted this and apologised sincerely again. I reiterated that I don't want parental responsibility for his kids and I want to stay as dad's girlfriend and not stepmum and we talked about how we could achieve this.

At this point, we feel like we're in a good place. However, words are easy to say and actions much harder so I will be watching to see whether or not these promises materialise. I do believe they will. But I also have to be prepared to protect myself if they don't. I am wary but hopeful about the future of our relationship.

OP posts:

CoffeeBeansGalore · 16/09/2021 17:00

@hilfehilfehilfe Your update sounds like an improvement, at least for now. I hope he is being honest with you. Just remember your wants & needs are important. Good luck! I wish you all the best for the future.

DFOD · 16/09/2021 17:55

It isn’t how he treated you in those conversations with words ….it’s how he treated you for months and months by his actions - he is exploiting you at every level and now he realises he has nearly killed the golden goose - he has changed tack to reel you back in again.

Nothing has changed for him - you still get to house him and fund him and his debts. He continues to laugh all the way to the bank.

I suspect with the divorce stuff he has just thrown you a bone. His arguments don’t stack up - it’s no more ugly, messy or expensive earlier or later - and bizarre that his previously non communicative anti divorce wife is now fully on stream.

How defined is the step mum vs girlfriend role - have you said what chores you will / won’t be doing? (How about none!)

What about his “super Dad”
plans to move to the other end of the country leaving his GF and DCs behind - what’s happened to that sentiment.

I smell a rat.

I suspect the divorce will drag out, no change in financial situation for him or you and it will be a slippery slope where you become his chore whore around the kids as he love bombs you as he has stated this was his expectation.

Pay attention to how you feel and his actions.

I hope I am wrong.

DFOD · 16/09/2021 18:02

That said, if I had very nearly lost the person I considered the love of my life then I too would be affectionate and eager to do whatever it took to save our relationship.

How about if I had nearly lost the person I considered to be my meal ticket / chore whore then I too would be affectionate and eager to do whatever it took to save the relationship.

I am interested in why you may have avoided answering the Qs around why this family with 3 preschooler DCs fell apart? Do you know yourself what went on?

Ourlady · 16/09/2021 18:17

I wouldn't believe one word of what he has said. He's just trying to protect his place in your home because he's buggered if you chuck him out.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 16/09/2021 18:22

I'm aware this could be manipulative. I'm aware he could now be love bombing me

Just as well ... if his performance of "understanding" results in any real action or contribution, I'll eat my hat

Skyla2005 · 16/09/2021 18:22

His got it made hasn't he ? Why isn't he paying half the monthly bills it's not your fault his in debt. It's all or nothing now. I don't see how you could throw them out and still have a relationship with him. So carry on or end it. Your 26. Do you really want all this baggage

Wole · 16/09/2021 18:36

There isn't that much to research. Just find a solicitor and get on with it.

As for "He apologised very sincerely" no, he apologised and appeared to be very sincere. You have no idea what he means and how good and actor he may or may not be. Be wary.

HilifesProudMama · 16/09/2021 18:39

Hi All,

Thank you for your continued interest in @hilfehilfehilfe. I have been silently reading and following but I am going to butt in again.

I am not sure how many have been the OP in a post like this but I have watched many, many threads over the years , and it can be overwhelming to read an onslaught of 'LTB' when you are OP, particularly at a time when you are feeling vulnerable already. Obviously, there is much information that is not shared by OP either intentionally or unintentionally, and @hilfehilfehilfe is no different.

Some questions have stimulated a response from her, but sometimes she has chosen to keep some information private and I feel that should be respected. She has her reasons to avoid revealing some information and that should be enough. Yes, she has started a thread asking for opinions but if she chooses not to reveal information about herself and DP on a public forum then that is her choice - if other posters then choose not to comment or to leave the thread that is a consequence she will face. *@hilfehilfehilfeand I have discussed the responses and questions posed here, and I am sure she has discussed this with friends also, and has given them due consideration. MN is generally a good sounding board but I wouldn't want @hilfehilfehilfe*to feel bullied into sharing information that she does not wish to share, because some posters feel they deserve a response.

Eddielzzard · 16/09/2021 18:39

I also think he's had an 'oh fuck' moment and now it's damage limitation. OP, I think you see him now, and you won't be taken in again. He'd better start pulling up his socks, and for longer than 3 weeks.

BlackAmericanoNoSugar · 16/09/2021 18:44

Has he said that he considers you the love of his life? Because his actions up until now have been less 'love of his life' and more 'convenience of his parenting years'.

However at least you are now watching his actions as well as listening to him, so we'll see how it goes. I hope that he morphs into a better man, because that's what you deserve.

daretodenim · 16/09/2021 18:56

Is he going to reimburse you for the free accommodation he has for himself and his kids? If he really understood what he's been doing to you financially he'd be offering that. You're subsidising his and his STBExW's debts from their marriage!

Watch him like a hawk. He says the right words now but not long ago he was threatening to abandon his kids as a means of emotionally manipulating you. That's not something someone says because they're stressed at work!!

Greatdomestic · 16/09/2021 19:17

How much is he going to contribute each month?

Tell him what half the bills and food are and that he pays it each month.

Otherwise there is no change.

In my view, he's telling you what you want to hear/enough to keep you sweet. I may be wrong though.

Give it a time frame of his supposed actions to take place. If he's paying his way and got the divorce on the way and you have evidence of this in the next 3 months, great. If not, end it.

MeredithGreyishblue · 16/09/2021 20:25

@hilfehilfehilfe @HilifesProudMama Hi again!
It sounds like your spidey senses are up still which is good. If you want to give him some time, do it. Sometimes people make mistakes.
I don't want to jump into the "He's lying" camp - you know him better than we do and you're not only seeing the doves and rainbows!
Keep talking if you want to. Genuinely hope he's had his wake up call xx

Mumoftwo1990 · 16/09/2021 20:28

@hilfehilfehilfe

I am 26. My partner is 32. He earns more than I do but not loads. We have been together since summer 2019. Was not the OW. He has 3 kids from his marriage and they are 5, 7 and 8. I met them Dec 20. I love him a lot but I am starting to feel trapped and unhappy and worried that this is just how my life is going to be forever now. DP is great, thoughtful, supportive and absolutely adores me.

He won't get divorced until his wife is settled with a new boyfriend and also wants to divorce. They never communicate so they would have to be very serious for DP to even have heard of his existence. He has done very little research about divorce and is overall just concerned about not being able to afford it. I am unhappy and ashamed of this and have told him so.

He has a large amount of debt (~£15k) that he is paying off in the agreed installments. He has done no research or work to look into paying this off faster.

He doesn't parent as I would want to. I do not want children so this is not as big an issue as it might be. I think he wants a blended family with me taking on more of a step mum role. I feel they have an amazing mum already and him, they do not need a third parent and I am just a nice, safe adult they know well. He resents my attitude on this.

I own and pay for our house entirely by myself. His contribution is he buys 2/3s(ish) of our groceries as he is meant to be clearing his debt. He is currently in a good financial position (i.e. not going into his overdraft each month and living within his paycheque but not able to save etc.). We moved in together into this house May 21. I resent that I bought this house and pay for it alone in order to protect myself in the event of the relationship not working out - but now it isn't really working for me I don't feel like I can ask him to move out as it would completely uproot his life and the childrens'.

I feel like I went from an individual person to a homeowner, breadwinner, provider and stepmum in the space of a few months. I don't think I want to break up but I do want to go back to being just an individual person in with my own space. I just don't know what I owe his children - their friends are on this street, their bedrooms are here. They love me, they love our life here and they are settled and very happy. I feel horribly guilty to even have wobbles about my relationship with their dad. I feel horrible about turfing DP out too and think it would damage our relationship perhaps fatally but I just feel like I'm suffocating and I need the situation to change. How do I do the right thing by the kids - can I say it's just him that moves out, and he can still have them here during his contact time?

Please help. What's fair of me to do. I don't want to hurt anyone but I can't remember the last time I was happy.

It's going to get to a point where you will only feel more trapped so I would say consider splitting but try to have a very serious conversation with your DP first so he knows how serious you are.

KillerAntAmbush · 16/09/2021 23:04

He’s adjusting his behaviour to tell you want you want to hear to keep you on side. That doesn’t change who he is in essentials - ethically corrupt, no morals, bad parent, manipulative liar. I feel sorry for you but women do chose to stay in relationships that are bad for many reasons. However you are choosing to drag down into this sinking ship, your family and friends who care about you, because they can see the forrest AND the trees but you do not. It’s very sad, you are so young and you only have one life.

AcrossthePond55 · 17/09/2021 00:25

You know, @hilfehilfehilfe , all the things he's 'promised' to do he can do whilst living on his own. Let him truly earn his way back into your life and home. Ask him to move out until he 'gets his life together' (divorce, self-supporting, parenting classes, etc) and then you can discuss your future together. If he truly loves you, he'll be willing to prove it to you this way. He also needs to be 'transparent' as far as divorce financial negotiations. Not that you should have a say in them, but you do need to know just how he's going to come out of the divorce financially, as that will impact your future.

But my guess is that if you do, he'll revert soon enough to his nasty and gaslighting ways.

And yes, absolutely get legal advice regarding your house.

ladybrunton · 17/09/2021 07:32

I'm glad that you had the conversation and that you feel more hopeful. However nothing changes the fundamental fact that he has 3 young children and is a father and you don't want children. The path you are on will ultimately make you feel trapped and unhappy, regardless of how much you love him.

Relationships are hard, even when children aren't involved. I know you love him, but please keep thinking about how your long term future looks. If it's difficult now, it will get more difficult in the future. You shouldn't be feeling like you do at this stage in the relationship.

BraveGoldie · 17/09/2021 08:33

Thanks for posting the updates, guys. And of COURSE OP can keep whatever info she wants to herself.

OP I think it's really good that you are having these hard conversations with him and you are analysing his reactions.

I think the key from here will be to look at big actions not words or gestures. I don't think it's even necessarily that he is lying. Far more common is that people have surface beliefs and intentions and a self image of themselves as caring, which is expressed in words.... but big actions reveal the strength of character and conviction and real willingness to change/sacrifice for ones partner that lie underneath. So I would look for those, and try to resist making too many excuses for him, as you are so very kind.

OrangeTortoise · 17/09/2021 08:35

Sounds like a good conversation OP (if he lives up to his promises!). Good luck!

DishingOutDone · 17/09/2021 08:40

@HilifesProudMama the villain here is the twat sponging off your DD not mumsnet. She can hide the thread any time. Personally I don’t think she’s going to heed any advice given in any case.