Holidays

[HotChocolateLover]

Firstly, this is all hypothetical. I only want genuine opinions as neither DH or I know what is the right answer.

I have one DS from a previous marriage, he has a DS and DD. We have done holidays the last three years including all three, one UK based and 2 foreign. This year is a ‘staycation’ as buying a house last year completely wiped us out.

Right, so next year, the ex is considering taking DSS and DSD abroad. This would mean that if only DH, DS and I went abroad together then our holiday bill would reduce by 40%. Everyone would get a holiday and surely that’s ok? We’re just agonising over it in case the step-kids think that their dad (my DH) is picking my son over them. But if their mum is taking them away then we will have the money to go away so why should we sit at home? We can’t really afford £5-6k for a week 🤦‍♀️ I just don’t want to offend anyone. Oh and by the way, my son’s dad had never taken him anywhere, never will and doesn’t even pay maintenance.

He or she might be putting every extra penny in to their own house for their family to live in

Of course. But is it always about money? My DIY skills are shite. I do what I can with the help of the internet but I know my limits and pay people to help me. My ex is a DIY whizz. It would be a positive thing to be able to call him for help every now and again - money that would go on paying someone would be put to better use, including on themchildren.

Of course in the real world, I wouldn’t have my ex in the house and he wouldn’t help me anyway. I am also not sure what a new partner would think and how often would be reasonable to ask for help? Once a Year? Once a week? Only in an emergency?

However, I get the point kewlwife is trying to make. There are positives to co-operation for all concerned but the boundary thing makes it difficult for most ex-partners to successfully manage.

This started because I said that it wouldn't be unreasonable for co-parents/exes to contribute towards holidays with the other parent. It then turned into "yeah so what about mah house then? Does she have to pay for my new curved tv?".

Just so petty.

why is it petty?

you're trying to make a point that we should all help each other.. why cant i question if it works both ways?

we all said we wouldn't do that and you carried on anyway!

@sotiredofthislife

How I would look at it on terms of a new partner:

1. Doesn't he trust me?

2. It's to improve me and my kids QoL, will he really put his insecurities ahead of that?

3. I need to find someone who trusts me and can put his insecurities behind our QoL.

3 is especially important for women because how else does this translate in practice? Will he not want me to take a new promotion because I'll earn more money than him and he'll feel emasculated? Will he try to obstruct other relationships with friends and family that make him feel excluded?

Well, call me Right Winged but if you can't afford to have the first family you created in a decent home, what business do you have committing to another set of dependents? Especially if some of those dependents are ones that came with the new partner

It’s all relative though. You can live in a nice clean home relatively cheaply. Nothing has to be extravangant to be nice and you live within your means. Basically what you’re saying, a man can’t move on and have more children if his ex can’t afford nice new Next furniture without his help. I mean, how much little pride do you have to have that you would ask your ex to buy luxuries for your home?
Things like carpets don’t have to be expensive either. Even the cheap ones look nice and you can do payment plans.

could you also not argue that the mum shouldn't have had kids if she has to ask her ex to decorate her house and buy her furniture? (i don't think that myself tbh but its a point considering what has been said!)

or is it just men that must pay for upkeep of children and ex's?

We took the view that we couldn't control what the other parents did. My ex is wealthy, my step children's mum is not at all well off. It meant my children got great holidays with their dad, ski-ing plus summer holiday abroad while my step children got nothing with their mum.
However we always took all of them together, we just decided that no in some ways it's not fair that one set get more holidays than the other, but all of that was outside of our control. All we did was try to treat them all the same from our own perspective. It seemed to work, they still talk about those epic Eurocamp holidays now!

No I didn't say "Next" furniture. I said a nice place to live. My ex moved into a 1 bed ex-council flat because it was cheap, dated, and close. We just did the basics in there as the LL couldn't afford it but reduced the rent to pay off the stuff that was permanent monthly.

What I struggle with is when a child moves between 2 very different households. One of my friends has rents 2 bed council flat with 2 teenage girls. Their dad lives in a big house in the Cotswolds where they each have their own room. Yes he pays maintenance but they hardly go there. He sees them in London when he stays for work. The maintenance plus my friend's job do not allow her to move anywhere better privately. She lives in one of those 1k a week rent areas but the kids are in important years in local schools. Private school, I might add, that he pays for. They never bring friends home. :-(

And yes, we've all helped her do it up!

She nearly had a local exchange recently but the people opted for a bigger house further away.

I can't get how he can literally drop them off there in his fancy car and drive back to his country home.

I already said that I wouldn't have added more dependents to the mix (SC or DC with new partner) if I was struggling to adequately support my child to a standard that we, as their parents, aspire to.

kewl presumably your friend wouldn't be happy if they lived with him, either though? because that would be the obvious solution if she wanted them to have a better lifestyle...

Why is the ex who maintains the lifestyle? I own everything we have and bought the house myself. My dp couldn't have afforded in this area at all.
Does that mean exw should be upset as he now lives in a better area?? Or that my son their half sibling goes to better schools and has more income spent on him as I chose to have one child?
They could have chosen to get better jobs, invest or have less children. That's life

My DSD lives in a two bed rental with her mum, in a shite building in a shite street in a shite area of the city. DH, DS and I live in a mortgaged four bed semi in a nice street in a nice village.
Seems I should be down on my knees begging forgiveness for extravagantly providing for my own family (large deposit came from me alone) when I should have been giving money to DSDs mother to improve her housing situation. Or squander.
For example, she routinely spends £3-4K on luxury holidays for herself and SD, and that’s her priority above decent housing, so I thought the situation was acceptable using the “mother knows best” train of thought?
Now, who knows what is allowed and what isn’t?

@Kewlwife No-one here seems to agree with you. It’s great you’ve contributed but is everything you’ve said true? Do you live in a commune/cult?

Happy? I'm not sure. But his NP has made it clear that wouldn't be an option, anyway.

Hahahahaha

I live in Hampstead.

Personally I think this whole helping each other out thing is all coming from a point of financial privilege that is not always applicable.

Yes if money was no object we might all randomly pay for someone else's kitchen etc just to be nice but in our case at least we need the money we earn, we can't afford to do that for anyone and so it's not going to happen.

The same goes for holidays. We wouldn't happen to have a load of money spare when my partner's ex decided she wanted to go on holiday, and would only be able to fund one ourselves when we happen to have a big windfall. We don't organise holidays according to a big calendar of what is and isn't the child's god given right that MUST be fulfilled each year, we just go when we happen to have the opportunity.

kewl how do you even know that?

OP kewl is in a polyamorous relationship - so not a comparable lifestyle with most of us I would imagine!

Why do you think it's paying for a kitchen? It could be. Or it could be painting a wall. It could be putting up shelves. It could be calling that plumber you know so you can get "mates rates". It depends on your resources.

Because one if the girls fell out with the mum last summer and wanted to move there.

I didn't say they have a right to holiday every year.

I see kewl

tbh if he is paying school fees and maintenance (which will be a fair bit if hes a high earner even if its what CMS tell him to pay) then I think hes doing enough, and don't understand why he should fund mums lifestyle too.

If I were him, I wouldn't see it as finding her lifestyle. I'd see it as ensuring my kids don't live at one end of the socio-economic scale and I live at the other.

I mentioned private school because it is actually a source of anxiety for them to be the poor kids in a rich school. They don't bring people home. They don't accept a lot of invitations because they can't reciprocate. Their dad said they could bring friends to his in the holidays but their friends would prefer to stay local and the daughters' feel like a guest there, so why would they feel comfortable bringing their own guests?

Private school was something he wanted and she agreed to but I think it decreases his maintenance payments because he honestly doesn't give her all that much. He pays for school trips and spending money for them but she pays for uniform and school supplies.

Of course. But is it always about money?

I was just responding to Kewl who said money on top of maintenance should be paid to make the ex’s house nice. I was just challenging that suggestion by saying hang on a minute what about their own home? Don’t they want to make their own home nice for their children and also shock horror the new children too.
I would most definitely have resent any dp who paid lots of money for their ex’s house to look lovely and ours wasn’t even close to being the same. Again I’d just feel sorry for the new children in that scenario.

@Kewlwife

Why do you think it's paying for a kitchen? It could be. Or it could be painting a wall. It could be putting up shelves. It could be calling that plumber you know so you can get "mates rates". It depends on your resources.

You are incredibly pedantic you know, what a weird detail to pick on. The kitchen was obviously a random example.

Funnily enough, my partner's dad is a builder and has been known to help out SSs mum with some house stuff because of the resources at his disposal. However, not everyone knows someone with any renovation skills of contacts of use (I certainly didn't before meeting my partner) so the only way they could "help" is by basically paying for it for them. Which I don't think is their responsibility. If they happen to have a resource at their disposal that doesn't cost them anything then that is somewhat different...

But since we are here to discuss holidays, unless you own a holiday home it is unlikely that someone would have a specific resource at their disposal that would make it more logical for them to help with a holiday than for the ex that is actually going on that holiday to pay for it themselves, so the only way of "chipping in" is to pay for it for them. Which, again, is not possible or reasonable for a lot of people.

so what do you think he should do - buy her a house in a nice area?