Christmas arrangements

[StepCatsmother]

And more specifically, how much do you see your ex-P or how much does your P see his ex (depending on who is the step between you) over the festive period?

I know this might depend on how recent/friendly the split with the ex was.

I ask because I'm just curious about how 'normal' my DP's arrangements are. This is only the second Christmas since he split with his ex, and their relationship is fairly amicable as things go.

This year he has the children for Christmas Eve through to Christmas Day morning, when he will then take them back to his ex. She is taking them to her family for the rest of Christmas Day and Boxing Day. However, at handover she is planning a 'family brunch' for the 4 of them (her, DP and the 2 children - age 5 and 10). Apparently this will be an hour or 2 and DP is going because the kids will want him there.

I guess I don't know how to feel about this, at the moment I don't think I have feelings either way. I can see that doing something nice for the children is important at this time of year, but there is a little discomfort at the idea of them playing happy families. The picture doesn't entirely sit right with me but it might only be because I'm new at all this and don't know what's usual :)

stardust I would be really interested to see some empirical research or studies to back up your claims. If you can't find the time to link then even some useful search terms would be helpful?

Bellaluna - very similar situation here. My DS is starting to become very anxious when life travels from one world to the other :(

I think OP sounds like she'll make a great SM

nicki The Centre for Separated Families have a lot of resources; and they've been working closely with Canadian and Australian child psychology teams, too.

I appreciate for "veteran" stepmums, especially those for whom common sense and compassion has worked, the modern "jargon" may seem far a fetched and unecessary - but what it has done has given all children a voice and acknowledged that for some DCs, transitioning between households can create strong, bewildering emotions. I think that the demands and trappings of modern life also play a part compared with years ago.

I think it's important that parents heed the work and advice of professionals as well as that of stepparents who are more experienced than them. After all, we used to put little boys up chimneys; it was only changes in the law that stopped parents from believing it did them no harm!

I think that the demands and trappings of modern life also play a part compared with years ago.

Such as? Wracking my barins....

but what it has done has given all children a voice and acknowledged that for some DCs, transitioning between households can create strong, bewildering emotions.......I think it's important that parents heed the work and advice of professionals as well as that of stepparents who are more experienced than them. After all, we used to put little boys up chimneys;

You're comparing seeing both parents with being put up a chimney?

Ok, I'm prepared to be drastically enlightened.

Actually, it's probably best, as you've made that analogy and mentioned a specific organisation if you cite or link something specific from their work to support the analogy.

Makes it much easier all round.

Yes, I've looked at the centre for separated parenting and I can't see anything relevant to your claims. Much talk of being flexible and useful tools for use where relationships between parents are fraught but nothing so far about parents who get on well and want to spend a couple of hours together with their children having a coffee.

Maybe we are at cross purposes here so I would like to clarify what exactly you're saying? Because it sounds like you're saying that there is research to suggest that a pleasant relationship between parents who choose to spend a few hours together on special occasions is damaging for the children involved, that it confuses boundaries etc. This has certainly not been my experience or of others I know who have chosen this route. In fact CAMHS who I approached for advice when we split as my dc have autism advised that we did not have THE BIG CONVERSATION about a split or ram home how different life was going to be for them. They suggested that if we could, we should try to let them absorb it naturally with a few gentle conversations when they asked. One of my dc was not diagnosed at this time but was very young so that advice was relevant to her also. I suppose it was easier for us to do this as they were used to their Dad working away quite a bit and so it wasn't immediately obvious he wasn't around. It seems that the key is to judge each situation on it's individual merits and NOT apply the same broad techniques to every family. The theories you advocate as general guidance may work in some families but could be blunt, clumsy and damaging in others, undoing years of careful and functioning family relationships.

So with all that in mind I am very interested to read this research you speak of. Can I trouble you again for an actual link?

You are completely against children having any kind of relationship with the NRP let alone a friendly one with the ex. That is very apparent from your posts. You use words like damaging and harm when you talk about friendly relationships/working relationship between exes. You have spouted non stop about how going between houses and exes spending time with DC together will ruin a child and cause problems. Seems to me there is no "right" way for you other than no contact with the NRP. One minute you say it is damaging for children to see mum & dad getting on and doing a family thing yet you then say going between households cause problems too.

I can see the cause of your bafflement Floss

I think you sound great OP - its early days and if they get on well then why not?
This is mine and dp's second christmas together. Last year neither of us had our kids - me and ex h agreed when we split up 8 years ago that we would have every other christmas. We have never spent the day together since. He will see them on boxing day and he will have them for new year (we alternate).
So DP suggested the same thing to his ex (theyd split before the christmas before but still lived together so it wasnt an issue then). Last year as it was his first without children we woke up together, then I went for a drink with my family and he went to see his children who were at their aunties house. He was concerned about having to spend a few hours in his ex's company but she got plastered in the pub in the morning and didnt turn up, thats a whole nother story
Me and ex H have never got on (since way before splitting) so it wouldnt occur to do something like this. We go to parent's evenings together and I invited him for champagne in the garden when dd went to her prom this year so he could see her and take pics - not so we could "be a family". Its just not in our nature.
We dont particularly agree on parenting styles, another reason we split up. Im very relaxed but firm - he and his wife are extremely strict - I believe in listneing to a child's opinions and reasons - they believe adults are always right.
I certainly do not consider him family. My children consider they have 2 families - him and his wife and their children (mine wont call them half siblings

StepCatsMother, I think that you are doing really well and though its hard, don't be put off being a step parent - I appreciate my daughters step parents more than I can express on here, it is wonderful to see 3 other adults so committed to my child's well being and she really benefits from a diversity of view points.

From when DD was 18mths up to about 7, I spent Xmas with the ex-husband, then the ex-husband and his partner, then with both of them and my DP and our new babies. It petered out as DD got older and needed it less. The 4 of us do DD related things together and also occasionally socialize together. I am lucky in that they also spend time with my sons, recognizing b'days and what not. Ex-husband and his wife are now (as DD is 16) reminiscent of a sort of extended family, that I chat with on the phone and see on high days and holidays. I am very fond of them both.

It is early days for you, but if your relationship does progress I would imagine that you should also be included in the family brunch should it continue. I chat with ex-husband about DD one to one if I need too but once our respective partners were clearly in it for the long haul, we became 4 co-parents. I may get a right of veto over certain things but my being her mother doesn't diminish my DP and DD's step mothers role I don't think. We are 4 people who love the same person - so its not too hard, honest.

floss I missed your post as it's been deleted but conclude from the subsequent partial quotes that it's directed at me - and as you asked me earlier on this thread not to interact with you directly (and said you'd show me the same courtesy), I hope you won't be offended if I don't.

However, for the sake of clarity, I think I need to clarify that my posts have never implied that I was referring to all children (I thought I'd made that clear in the language I used but obviously not) - many posters have highlighted on this thread, cordial friendships between parents can be a positive thing for children.

All I have said in my posts is that it is not always the case and that parents should be aware that for some DCs, that model can be difficult; even though it may seem like the right thing to do. And for those who don't have that relationship, it's not always detrimental, either.

I am baffled that I have been subject to so much aggression for stating nothing more than that not all children are the same and that advice given should be taken in light of individual child's needs, rather than accepting that because something worked well for someone else's DCs, it will work well for yours.

Stardust - for some inexplicable reason, quite a few threads on this part of MN end up as bun-fights. But I can't argue with your comment that there's no "one size fits all" solution. Blended families can be really complicated at the best of times, and then factor Christmas into the equation .......

I think your emphasis has definitely been on it being a negative and damaging thing to spend time together with your ex and your joint dc. You have focused almost entirely on the children from the second family, their possible negative feelings and imagined all kinds of scenarios where discord and upset may arise if a parent goes away to spend a couple of hours with his ex and their children. Maybe you should re-read some of your previous posts. This may help you with your "bafflement"?

Petal02 it's good that you finally acknowledge that it's different for each family since others have repeatedly said that throughout this thread with very little acknowledgement.

I'm sorry I've upset you, floss but as we established up thread (When I think you must have remembered a post I'd made on another thread) I'm not a stepmum, so I'm not sure why you've said that?

It's clear that non-stepmums aren't welcome here - I hope my DDs stepmum isn't a member though....

Everyone is welcome here. I an not a SM either .

Not upset Star just pissed of with your negative twisting agenda soaked posts.

I'm not a stepmum, so I'm not sure why you've said that? Because you told me on this thread that you have been a SM.

Oh, don't worry on that score, flossy, I have been a stepmum, so have lots of experience

Nicki I suspect we all realise that its different for every family, but we all tend to draw on our own experiences.

Obviously.

stardust I agree with petal, for some reason you seem to have taken a battering and I'm not sure why

I also agree that there is no 'one size fits all approach, every situation is unique with its own dynamics.

I had a look at the Centre for Seperated Families website, which was interesting. Are you thinking of the detrimental effects that the subconscious encouragement of a reunification fantasy might have?

Has everyone got their Christmas tree up yet? I'm leaving mine til the weekend before Christmas, young pets and baubles can be an "interesting" combination!!!!

People can post anywhere, I am a step mum for what it's worth, have been for years now. I can see why people who, themselves are not SP but have dc who have a SP might post here (I hope its for good intentions)

Mine has been up since 1st December. My children were counting down the days . I can't look at it without feeling enraged though as I bought it for £50 and three days later it was reduced to £35!