DH and DSCs moving in at Xmas - worried!

[Minki]

DH and I have been together 3 years and got married in August. I have two DSs, 6 and 4, who live with me and he has a girl, 11, and boy, 9 who he has 50% of the time. Him moving in means they will be here 50% of the time. I have posted separately about this but I had a horrible break up with my ex after he had an affair and left us for other woman. DH also had an affair and split with his ex which does cause some trust issues. They would be moving in with me as I have a 6 bedroom house and they have a one bed flat (kids share a room and DH sleeps on the floor when they stay!). We obviously have more than enough room although I am thinking of getting an au-pair which would mean his DCs need to share a room (one room is used as an office) which doesn't seem to be an issue given that they share at both their dad's and mum's. All the kids get on very well and seem to be looking forward to moving in but I am nervous for a number of reasons. Aside from the cost issues (who pays what etc, which we have not discussed in detail, I am hugely worried about losing control and this not feeling like my house anymore. Once they move in it will have to become home to his DCs and i am not sure I feel ready for that. It feels like it is my kids and my home and noone elses! It's not helped by the fact that I am the higher earner and use a nanny (or an au-pair) which DH works fewer hours and so has never used childcare. He will basically be at home 3 with his kids 3 afternoons a week whilst my kids are being looked after by a nanny. His kids go to school 40 minutes away from where we live so he will have to collect them from school and commute back to ours on the days they are with us. Although I like his kids, there are also tensions around parenting styles. His son, 9, is very clingy and quite demanding and it feels like he always wants his dad to himself, which is quite hard for my little ones to handle as when DSCs aren;t here, DP is available to them. Just feel that we will both want time with our own kids that we won't get and that his DS will be sulky and resentful because of it. Also worried about costs. Am struggling to pay a large mortgage and worry that I am going to end up picking up the larger share of the food bills etc. I tried to tell DP how I was feeling which he interpreted as me not wanting them to move in so need to broach this really carefully. Any advice?

And, what are you waiting for for when they move in? Why hasn't it happened so far?

Ok, I have nothing constructive to add about this situation except, if you really loved the guy you would be champing at the bit to move in. I would also be going out of my way to make the children as comfortable as possible because they are his children, he loves them and I love him. I wouldn't give a toss about my assets and home above my dH because I would be working on the basis that I hadn't entered marriage with one eye on the divorce settlement, I am guessing you must be Amerrican or have spend too much time in a a consumeristic culture for my tastes. Can you imagine if this thread were reversed and it was the dh with the big salary, big house etc and was reluctant for DW to move in until she's paid up !
I am just bemused by the whole set up . However I really came on this thread to state the facts about cohabitation council tax/befits/widows benefit etc. I have been a fraud investigator for 29 yrs, I prosecute DWP/local authority and Tax credits. Firstly, there has NEVER been an 'ok' number of days for anyone to stay over.. We look at joint commitment to household. For example, his name on electric/ sky/tv license - credit check to see if he is obtaining credit from that house. We will watch the house to see set patterns of cohabitation and if we have sufficient evidence we will follow the family on a day out to establish how the couple are 'perceived' and how finances are split. You are certainly not 'off the hook if he comes over twice a week.Council tax is a bit different, whilst it's true that you shouldn't be paying council tax in two places, if you are residing somewhere on a regular basis 5 days a week and your ctax is Band G and your DH is in a Band C. With single person discount , there is a fraud. If the Bands are the same, then best to seek advice from local authority revenue.

If you had equal earnings and equal houses, (hypothetically) what would you be doing now. ?

I'm a late comer to this thread, but I'm just wondering if the questions OP had at the start are still relevant?
If DH is getting the rooms all set up and ready (and I'm assuming this is taken out of his finances so I guess that's a contribution of sorts on his part?) then it has been agreed 100% they will be moving in?
Otherwise, how confusing for all the children involved if there are these two rooms available to DSC, but it is then decided moving in will not work.

OP, you have said a couple points which I think are fair, about how DH is getting his DC's rooms ready but your DC's rooms badly need a lick of paint. I am perhaps a little naive to this type of family set up, but I think if DH is going to be living there full time, then he should act more of a father figure to your DC as well as his own. Perhaps discussing this with him and proposing the same type of treatment- spending time and money painting your DC's rooms too, and picking up milk and other groceries to help out with the daily family routines.

Minki there is no better guide/advisor for you right now than your own intuition. Listen to it....i can hear it screaming "NO! NO! NO!" So no is the answer to them moving in.

my intuition is telling me that you do want to enjoy living with him as a couple but you don't want the reality that comes with that.

you don't want dh having ANY claim on your home in the event of a split...you've sorted this via a pre-nup and now just need to figure out a way he can contribute his 'share' without paying towards the mortgage. Easy - if he moves in then whatever you pay towards the monthly mortgage, he pays the same towards other monthly household bills, anything left over re bills you each pay half.
i can't see him agreeing or sticking to that when he doesn't even have it in him to make NORMAL contributions of buying groceries etc for the times he IS with you.
Just out of interest - who paid for the wedding rings/service etc? You must have had a discussion about finances at that point?

b) you don't want his kids there 50% of the time as it won't feel like 'your' home anymore...and it wouldn't be because you would have to factor in their wants and needs when making decisions. You will also no doubt miss having your 'own' space. Plus you can't tell them to shut up or get out if they get on your nerves because their dad lives there. Also, you are aware that his dc could end up living with you full time permanently at any point and you will not really be in a position to say no to that-not without putting your relationship at risk anyway.

my advice to you -
You CAN'T have the 'nuclear family' set up with him - accept it.
You are NOT selfish for wanting the kind of set up you want but because this involves other human beings (as opposed to peices of furniture) you WILL have to compromise if you truly do want to live with him.
You already have a niggly feeling that he is expecting you to financially subsidise him and his dc....and because there is a lack of mature conversation/communication re the finances i would agree with you.
you KNOW the answer is NO but you just don't want to have to face it or say it out loud - or tell him that. Find the courage to do so.

Spend another year or so living apart but learning how to merge and balance the finances/children and having those uncomfortable/personal conversations about financial contributions...and then put them into practice for a while before making a final decision on moving in.

Actually minki I dont thnk we are that similar. We started from the same point pretty much - but we have chosen to handle it very differently.

My issue is not what happens to the house if we split up -( I would give my partner a percentage of the increase in equity form the day he moved in eg if the house was work £ 1 million when he moved in - and its now worth £1.3 M , a percentage of that equity increase is morally his since he does all the upkeep/ DIY etc) I want to ensure that the house is left to my childern if I die first - his kids are inline for a big inheritance from their mothers side. I also do not regard 'marriage' as the glue that will stick us together. We will probably get maried one day - but only after all the niggly things about blending families are resolved, with compromise and to both our our satisfaction. Some of those things have been very difficult to manage - in particular trust - for us both. Both of us were poorly treated in our marriages and learning to fully trust again takes time - its not something that a wedding ring can magic up.

The financial disparity - again - I have chosen to share everything. Maybe Im a mug - but I cant see how you can live with someone as partners and say eg - "I can afford to go out for dinner , you can't so i'm going on my own because Im not paying for you" .. etc etc etc. Where does it end ?

You partner (and his ex) made very different choices to you. You deided when you had kids, to work very hard, and a gbig nice house and money - at the expense of time with the kids( not a critisism - so did I) Your partner and his ex chose time with their kids over a bigger house/ more money /career success. I think you resent that he and his kids will benefit from your sacrifices.. I dont think you really respect his choices - and I dont think he is doing one thing to make YOUr life easier .... I think he expects to reap the benefit of your big house and higher income without lifting any of the burden from you. Honestly it is ridiculous to imagine him in your house looking after his own children whilst yours are cared for by a nanny ...

I do not know how you resolve any of this - but I do think you need to take a very hard look at your motivations for marrying this man - and listen to your gut instinct whch is SCREAMING at you NOT to move him in

Kittensinmydinner, I am not consumerism nor am I American. We live pretty frugally (1 low key holiday last year), the house needs load of work to it, but it is OUR house, my only asset, and I would be pretty stupid to, in your words, "not give a toss" about my assets, and steam ahead assuming all is going to be wonderful. It may be but it also may not and sorry, but I think it would be plain stupid not to protect myself. And, again, I don't need advice on council tax, thank you.

Regarding DSC's rooms, the two rooms they would use are available and they use them when they are here but they are not their dedicated bedrooms yet. Last year I had a new roof put on the house (long overdue, bad leaks etc) and at the same time ended up doing a loft conversion on the basis that it was a lot cheaper to do it all at once and would add value although I really could not afford it and on reflection probably wouldn't do it if I had my time again. That added another bedroom and bathroom. I paid for it all with a re-mortgage. The only costs that DH would be spending would be on furniture for their rooms and the assumption was, I think, that I would help.

In terms of how he could contribute if/when he does move in, if he does not pay towards the mortgage then I would ask him to pay half the bills. My mortgage is around £2,500, bills come to another £900 although I would not ask him to pay towards household insurance (£120 per month), so he would basically be paying around £390 per month in bills. Not sure it is fair on him though to say that he can't contribute to mortgage but it means he will get an interest in the same amount and so things will invariably get messy when we do split.

RomillyJane, is really really isn't like that. There has never been, and would never be, a situation when I am going out for dinner and he isn't, or I am taking my kids somewhere and he isn't. As I said above, he actually has more disposable income than I do as I pay 1k more than him in childcare and 1.5k more in mortgage and bills, so any extra income is gone.

Kittensinmydinner, in that case, the council must be prosecuting thousands of couples where one of them stays over at the other's a couple of nights a week. I don't get tax credits or anything else like that so not sure of your other points?

If he had equal assets and an equal house then, er, we would be a v different place. I guess one of us would sell and put all the money in the other house (and halve the mortgage) which means that I could work part-time (yay!) plus pretty much all the risk goes away as he has exactly the same amount to lose as I do so if we split we likely both walk away with what we started with. A much much easier situation.

Piratepoo, they were supposed to be moving in at Xmas but he didn't get their rooms ready in time. He said he wants their rooms finished (beds, desks, wardrobes, cupboards, book shelves etc) before they move in. Again, i was a bit surprised as my kids' rooms don't have desks/cupboards etc, and I asked why they needed to have all this before they move in (surely you just need bed, wardrobe and can get the other bits when we have time) but he is adamant that it all has to be perfect before he will set a date. Not sure he is using this to stall for time and, as I am more than happy to delay, I have not pushed/raised it again.

I'd give up kittens - the OP trusts her financial and legal advisors, and hopefully, they put their advice in writing.

At least then, if and when the OP and her DH discover that they have lost their Capital Gains Tax Relief on one or other of their properties, or are ordered to pay back the CT reduction they've been claiming, she can seek recompense from the professionals who advised her that marriage makes no difference - although sadly, it will probably be her DH, rather than she, who is most affected financially.

I wasn't going to post again as I've posted at length and tried to offer support but you haven't responded minki - think I might have upset you at the beginning of the thread. BUT do you mean you pay £2,500 per month mortgage and £900 per month on bills.........surely not? If so I have some difficulty equating that with your comment that you live frugally!

PFL I see you keep popping back on the thread to make more sarcastic comments - you're nothing if not persistent. Why are you so judgemental I wonder?

Do they need desks for homework etc?

nana maybe for similar reasons to you?

BUT do you mean you pay £2,500 per month mortgage and £900 per month on bills.........surely not? If so I have some difficulty equating that with your comment that you live frugally!

Mind you, it does sound as if the OPs DCs live frugally; desks and bookcases in their rooms seem to be considered a luxury!

OP has a big mortgage. Why is that so difficult to understand? She's already stated she has a big house and recently remortgaged to get the loft done. Bills can very quickly add up too. She's also explained she pays a lot of insurance.

Peruvian. I'm not sure what your motivation is to keep haranguing the OP with nasty comments. This isn't aibu - it's meant to be a supportive forum. It's a weird way to entertain yourself.

You can disagree with the OP but there is no need to be so scathing all the time. You come across very badly.

Yes, the mortgage is just under 2.5k per month. The outstanding amount is 490k. Check out the average cost of a property in London and you won't be so alarmed. Bills come to around £900, yes. Gas £168, electricity £60, insurance £130, council tax £130, phone/internet, £65, water £55, and (going to get blasted for this) cleaner £250 per month. That does not include my travel (£100 per month for travel card) or mobile phone (£50). The only luxury I can see there is the cleaner but, as I said, I work full time and want to spend my time at the weekend with my children rather than cleaning/ironing.

Hello everyone,
Could we take this opportunity to remind you that this place is supposed to make parents' lives easier? We're hoping that if everyone takes a deep breath the thread can continue, however.

The point about the desks/cupboards is that they are not essential. If DH wanted to move in, he could. The rooms are ready and available but he doesn't want to until they are completely finished. I don't consider desks in their rooms entirely necessary, no, not when there is a big table in the kitchen and lounge that they can use.

so....earlier in the thread, you didn't want your DH and his children to move in and were actively seeking to put it off and there was an issue over who was going to be in which bedroom as you wanted an office to be able to work from home. Now....he can move in if he wants to but it's him that's delaying the issue by insisting the children's rooms are up to standard?

I am confused !

Minki, you don't need to defend your lifestyle. I think it's very positive to post here and I wish I had sought input many years ago when DH moved into my mortgage free house.

You started this thread 2 months ago and have had varying opinions which I hoped have had some value to you.

What are your current thoughts on your DH moving in?

In the deleted post, Minki said she was leaving the thread, so she may not respond.

I realised after I'd posted that you might live in London minki and you're right to point out that mortgage repayments in the capital are incredibly high. I know someone who is hoping to privately rent in SW London and so was looking online last night and the rents were scary - around £900 per week for a 3 bed.

Right I'm out of here, as I don't think the thread is helping you minki and seems like you have had enough as one of your posts has been deleted. This issue has gone around and around in circles and now the talk has turned to desks and chairs (or not!) for bedrooms.

I agree with you're right DurpDurp about PFL's posts - and she knows how to insult with her sarcastic comments without breaking the talk guidelines! Sad really.

Thanks YSD I think it is a very good idea for minki to leave the thread!

Re: money for groceries. Can you not text him one afternoon when he's meant to be coming over and say"can you pick up a few days groceries I haven't had a chance and there's nothing for tea!"

If you are working full time and him part time then there's probably more opportunity for him to nip to Tescos anyway.

If he comes home with 3 days worth of food then you are moving (a teeny tiny bit) towards being a bit closer to feeling like a family.

If he comes home and announces that you owe him £42.86 then that will give you another answer.

Re: council tax - if I was you I'd give them a ring. Many years ago I was living in a slightly complex domestic situation. I phoned both sets of councils and got an answer. Years later someone was asking on Mumsnet about a similar situation. I said what I'd done. Then someone else came on and said they'd been in a similar situation but had been given completely different advice. Then a third person came on and said they'd been given different info again. We compared and our situations were very very similar. It seems to not be very clear. And when there's a muddle it's always useful to be able to say "I called on the 14th August and 2:30pm and spoke to a nice woman called Sandra and she said...."