18yo Santa visit

[sequinsequins]

We are in an unusual position in that 18yo DSS still sticks to the access rota to the absolute letter. This weekend is an access weekend, and the only day we managed to get tickets for the santa train we go to every year with 4yo DS. I had (naively it turns out) assumed that an 18yo would not want to come to see santa. It turns out I was wrong, and he does. And let's not assume this is about wanting to see DS excited or similar - this is the same DSS who didn't turn up to see DS on his birthday, as it wasn't an access weekend (he lives 3 miles away so no issue there). He will come with us and traipse along, taking any possible joy out of the day.

This is never ending and quite frankly gets me down.

Cocktail no I don't think he's autistic

Thanks mrswelly. Unfortunately DH and ex do not communicate at all though so it's extra difficult

Sorry I don't see anythng odd about an 18 year old going to visit santa with their much younger sibling.

If he skulks about and drags his heels so what? Presumably you're going for the 4 year old's sake and can manage to make it a special trip for HIM,whcih is what the santa train is all about yes?

His striking rigidly to the schedule is a different matter of course (and yes does suggest SEN) , but his actual presence during the trip is a non-issue surely?

Green sleeves if my own DS at 18 is wanting to go see Santa, and not having any of his own interests, I wod be extremely concerned. Rather than facilitating, I would bbtaking proactive steps thoughout his teenage years to address this. So no, I wouldn't just accept his droopy face on Santa visits

titchy "His striking rigidly to the schedule is a different matter of course"

As I've said repeatedly, it's absolutely not a separate matter. He is ONLY coming becuase of the rota. He'd be coming if we were going to fill the car with petrol, or to buy white spirit from b&q. None of this is to do with wanting to be with DS seeing santa

In which case you sound very controlling. We went on the Santa train with three other families last year, including several teens and lots of adults along with the little ones. It was magical and we all thoroughly enjoyed it. Yes, the teens were too hip too look excited and were putting on the agony a bit, but that was part of the fun and none of us would have thought they were weird for wanting to come. We do stockings for adults too, do you think we need some form of intervention?

What comes across is that you strongly dislike the kid and can't wait for him to "get a life" so that you don't have to keep putting up with him, because you can't possibly enjoy anything while breathing the same air as him. Poor little sod.

What have I controlled exactly greensleeves? I am very clear that I have no say in absolutely any of it

Yes indeed, poor little sod, all 6ft of him

I dont think it comes across as you really disliking him, and have indicated you would be happy to spend some time with him on non rota weekends. Sounds more that you are concerned about his development and also frustrated with the rigidity of the situation. If the 18 yo was your son, I assume you would expect that he simply would not want to come and that would not stop you taking the 4yo, which is perfectly normal.

I was referring to your post about your 4yo still wanting to go on the Santa trip at 18. I doubt very much whether you would have the same allergic reaction to your own teenaged son as you are having to your DSS.

LOL at what height should they stop wanting to go on family trips then? 5'6 maybe? Ridiculous. You just don't want him around and you had hoped now he's 18 you'd be shot of him. It doesn't work like that.

Exactly AbiRoad. Given his lack of life outside the home, I would, if he was my own child, have strongly encouraged interets and independence through, for example DoE, voluntary work, Scouting. I absolutely believe that encouraging independence is a fundamental responsibility of parenting. Facilitating listlessness so as not to rock the boat, isn't.

I did gold DofE, voluntary work, went to boarding school

still would have wanted to go with family and younger sibling on a Christmas trip

Greensleeves - you are putting words into the OPs mouth.
I don't think she despises him, she is just frustrated at the ridiculous notion of an 18 year old tagging along to something which clearly bores him just because it is his weekend to be with his dad.
If he was happy and jolly and joined in the fun I doubt it would be a problem.

Greensleeves you are rather missing the point. Do go ahead but you're so wildly off the mark that I'll stick to responding to sensible posts.

I think also it sounds like his dad is enabling this rigid access rota because he believes he wouldn't see his son at all otherwise. Your DH probably knows deep down a more adult version of seeing each other should take over now but fears (understandably as your SS perhaps cajoled by his mum seems incapable/unwilling to arrange any non rota visits) he will just not see him.

My DH arranged a twice a week tea at our house for his son when he finally left home at 24. That too was set in stone as l think deep down my DH knew he wouldn't see his son for dust otherwise unless he wanted something or there was something in it for him . He too a bit like the OPs DH has tried everything over the years to make meetings/visits happen outside a 'rota' , get his son go for a pint with him , which he does with his peers regularly but never ever with his dad. He has even gets up after finished eating his birthday meal with all family , paid for by his dad and gone off to meet his mates , whilst we are still eating dessert. Happened several times and every year l watch DH asking him in vain to just come for one drink with us/him after.

Yet when he lived with us he too would insist on doing a 'Rodney' and 'traipse' along with us everywhere , whether appropriate or not (romantic meal for two for example) though he clearly has no real interest in spending time with his dad as above examples prove. It seems more to do with making a point or not wanting to miss out on anything.

I think the fact that his parents don't get and that he may be very aware that you dislike him are reasons enough why he 'slavishly' follows the rota. By following the 'rota' he is less likely to be hassled by anyone.

As for going on the Santa Train, you have explained that he likes to hang out with his Dad so it seems unsurprisingly that he wants to accompany him. I wonder if he is also doing it because he thinks you are purposely trying to exclude him? He may be uncommunicative but it doesn't mean he doesn't have views on whats going on.

Depending on what he does he may still be coming home for several years to come. My DCs do 4 and 5 year degrees, if you add in a gap year and a break immediately after Uni to find a job and raise funds for accommodation it could be a long while before you are rid of him.

IThoughtThat - I don't want "rid of him" and have not said that.

"I wonder if he is also doing it because he thinks you are purposely trying to exclude him?" - he excludes himself though. Not involved in family events due to the rota, can't come on holiday due to the rota, can't come on most day trips due to the rota, can't come on bank hols weekends away due to the rota. It's the rota that excludes him, not me.

Yes Bahhhumbug, I think you're right. It is scheduled access visits or nothing. I suspect if DH was critically ill in hospital DSS wouldn't visist unless it was an access weekend.

sequins, has your dh tried sitting down with him and discussing this with dss?

..but I bet he is abiding to the rota because it's easier for him rather than contend with upsetting his parents and possibly because he thinks it pisses you off

I don't see why it's surprising that he does it.

I also wouldn't be surprised if he thinks you are excluding him from the trip.

Yes LoveandDeath - DH has on a number of occasions spoken to him. He says DSS will look uncomfortable and just agree, but then nothing ever happens.

IThoughtThat - how exactly am I excluding him from the trip?

To be fair to him he doesn't have a mean bone in his body, so you're massively misrepresenting his intentions in suggesting he's trying to piss anyone off.

Can your DH sit down with him and have a chat about turning 18 and the responsibilities and independence that brings? If he explained that actually you all wanted to see him more outside of the arrangement, like on birthdays and holidays, but that you all, including DSS, need some flexibility with the arrangements.

If he is being guilted by his mum then that needs to be addressed too. Not just about the contact, but also because of his lack of friends or social life. It appears to me that its not only his dads he is afraid to go to.

So if he looks uncomfortable and agrees, then it does sound as though the pressure is coming from his mother to stick to the agreement? It sounds really hard for him. My own ds1 is 17 and looks quite grown up but would lack the maturity to deal with this situation.

From a legal point of view, was the EOW agreement set up through the courts or was it a private mutual agreement?

What comes across is that you strongly dislike the kid and can't wait for him to "get a life" so that you don't have to keep putting up with him, because you can't possibly enjoy anything while breathing the same air as him.

There are plenty of SM who feel exactly this way!