Oh Gosh - I never realised this...

[pagwatch]

I saw a thread about a pregnancy with the possibilty of the chid having Downs syndrome. Don't normally click but thought the posters was looking for some support re liklihood of having a child with issues.
Anyway she is going to terminate - which of course is her choice.
But someone gently asked if she had considered the possibilty of keepingthe child and the responses were really aggressive. Then others joined in and it just seemed unessesarily hostile.
Being really dim I added that I didn't think the question was out of order but just that as the parents of children with disabilities we may have insight/knowledge that might be useful
Apparently that is grossly insensitive and terrible

Now if a woman has made up her mind I would never dream of commenting. Thats that.
But is it really outrageous and terrible and shameful to ask the question? As mothers do we not have insight into the very thing that a pregnant mother in these circs could draw on whatever her choice may unltimately be?

I was just so shocked by the hostility. It was as if the very mention of our children was offensive.

I am just going to hide that thread and avoid that topic. But the attitude was grim.
I know this is a thread about a thread but clearly cannot addthese views on there - especially as I have no doubt the OP is having a terrible time and i would not wish for a second to add to her distress. And please plaese please do not go to that thread - I am honestly not trying to shit stir - just trying to come to terms with the attitude.
So I put it here where I am hopefully amongst peers ( I very much doubt that any of the shouty contributors would have anything to do with the SN board)

Just made me glum in a way I haven't felt for a while. Thanks for letting me vent
Now please tell me why I am being foolish to be upset. Because it fely like being shameful, second class or something

Have emailed mnhq and asked for it to be moved.

Hope am not treading on anyone's toes .

oh my god, have only just read all the latest stuff. have also contacted mnhq and asked for both threads to be moved.

Gosh this is a brilliant thread, I'm glad I read it. Quite randomly too, as I have thought much the same about some of the threads in 'pregnancy' recently but didn't know where or how to express my thoughts.

I have two NT children, but who's to say they will always be that way? I think there are some alarming attitudes towards disability and can't even begin to suggest an answer to it.

Thanks for putting into words my exact feelings, it's a tricky topic and hard to quantify your felling really.

As an aside, would you mind if I ask why this topic is automatically 'hidden' in settings? I find it a little odd really.

Sorry I don't thing they belong in bereavement.
Imaginge you are posting about the death of a loved one (child or adult) something you had no choice in.
I for one wouldn't want to be posting in the same place as somaone who chose to have a termination(sorry I know that sounds hard, but can't think of a nicer way to put it) can't terminations have their ow topic.

I don't think they should be in pregnancy or bereavement really. Maybe 'other subjects' is a safer option for now.

Well dont to wannabe and hangingbelly for mailing MNHQ.

Well done is what I meant.

fio your suggestion makes more sense than min(I knew what I meant lol)

TheDevilEatsNestle it is hidden so people have to opt in, it reminds people that they are in sn and not to jump on people who feed their dc's crisps for breakfast.

Own topic would be the best way. People could block so they don't stumble across it. Other people could 'safely' use pregnancy or bereavement threads, and those who need to talk about termination could do in their own private place, presumably less upsetting for them too.

So who is going to suggest it in site stuff. Or by HQ email? Best if this thread remains relatively hidden I think.

Also means we can have this type of discussion which you can't have in the main board I think.

Oh yes I see your point now, I often read/post on threads before noticing which 'topic' they are in and I'm sure there is scope for a lot of upset if people posted here.

totally get where you are coming from. Also saddens me when I see threads that people are congratulating parents for having an amnio and they then post that everything is all right and wonderful now the horror of possibly having a child with down syndrome has been averted. I look at dd1 and am saddened that she is in a world were people feel like that and the little value they place on her life.

I am also shocked by the ignorant and stupid comments I have come across about down syndrome. I used to type huge posts about dd1 and her achievements and how fab she is and really how easy ^90% of the time she is to care for - only to have someone say - yes BUT and totally discount all of I have said and make down syndrome out to be the worst thing in the world.

I no longer read them cause I got so sick of - but you are amazing and your dd1 is x y z and I could not be like that. I got sick of sharing our story to have it thrown back in our face. So i decided I was reclaiming dd1 for us and me and I would no longer read and even comment or offer advice - this is freaking 2009 - you cannot google information - credible reliable information about down syndrome then you really need to sort yourself out. Sorry. Although googling might bring you to this website:

www.aheartbreakingchoice.com/ds.html

Whilst I realise not everyone would make our decision - it does not make dd1 any less worthy of life and respect. I wanted to punch the computer when I read the lines about how they made the 'sacrifice' for the betterment of their other children and to save the child with ds from a life of pain and so on.[vom] How they owed it to their other children. The other comment about them all playing in heaven together in god's nursery - oh puhlease. Sorry but not worthy of life but hope they are enjoying their 'life' playing in heaven. Yes you made the choice that you think was right for you - do not dress it up into something it is not.

Actually wannabe - your info is correct - for every pregnancy where an amnio has led to a miscarriage 3/4 of those children did not have ds.

Anyway rant over - need to go and get to bed. Dd1 is off to mainstream school for free dress day and mad hat day for easter. Dd2 ( poor child saddled with a sn sibling) is off to kindy and dd3 and I are joining her later in the day for a very hungry caterpillar picnic.

oh my god that website!!

eidsvold Wow great post. I think thats what I need to do, reclaim him back just for us. The whole lost souls playing in heaven and how they made the ultimate sacrifice for their other children also really pisses me off.

Enjoy your day. All sounds terribly umm... normal!!

"saving this baby" good grief.

I actually think these people need counselling (preferably before the termination really) because if the only way you can deal with it is to fantasise something then surely you may not have made the best decision for your long term mental health. I've just read a whole post where the termination is referred to as an 'interruption'. There's lots about how terrible a life with LD's would be. I know someone with DS who goes to ms school alone on the (regular) bus, meets up with her friends at weekends, is taking the same (more) GCSE's as her ms friends.

I just want to echo what TDEN said - I'm really glad that this thread is here. I don't have any real experience of SN, but I wouldn't terminate for religious reasons - and I find it so encouraging that, if it ever turns out to be my path, the choice that I believe is right can also be one that really does work and is so full of joy. Don't know if that makes any sense (and I'm trying hard not to be crass), but I just wanted to say thank you.

That website is terrible! I actually feel sorry for these people, all (that I read anyway) wanted pregnancies but ended really because they haven't fully understood the realities of the syndrome and how joyous life can be. Do you think they really believe they are saving their baby from pain and unhappiness? What about all the lovely things that the baby will not now know, something simple as a lovely cuddle or a seeing or feeling the sunshine.

'We were going to have to face everyone and explain we lost this baby' this from a woman on that site, before they even had the results back. This makes me sad on so many levels. Ignorant tossers.

Bizarre sites are common on the internet but I feel sorry for the would be parents too. They are more juvenile and life limited than any child they might have.

do you know what shocks me? how little things have changed since I was expecting ds(nt) 18 yrs ago.
there was no information offered then just a triple test. god knows what I would have done if the result had been bad, because I was ignorant, I knew nothing about any kind of disability, but surely to god 18 years later people shouldn't still be ignorant, they should have been educated about sn by now and know it isn't the end, just a different beginning.
I haven't clicked that lick as it sounds horrid, on that subject I would rather be ignorant.

Lick?? I meant link