I am a total failure as a mother.

[turtledove23]

My DS is 9 months today and I can't seem to get anything right. He goes to bed at 7 and (on a good night) sleeps til 1-2 then wakes anything from 2 to 8 times and wakes anywhere from 4-7 for the day. I have to work very hard to get him to sleep well in the day. Lately he has been having an hour in the morning and 45 mins-hour in the afternoon. We try to do 2-3-4. He is still breastfed despite me trying to give up about 20 times. He has 7 teeth which caused him huge extended pain and has been working on the eighth for what seems like an eternity. He is just about walking but can still only manage 6-10 steps so we're still in developmental hell. I have been in tears since 415 when he woke this morning, as have realised that after trying NCSS and all the kind stuff that I am going to have to (TONIGHT) do CIO. No booby, no love, just screaming. It is breaking my heart but I can't do this anymore. I know that I am on the road to PND from lack of sleep. Please tell me it will work?

You are exhausted and worried - but certainly NOT a failure!

There doesn't seem to be a right or a wrong way to do things and each baby is different.It sounds like you've done well to get him into a going-to-bed routine and thats great that you can guarantee yourself a couple of hours to yourself in the evenings.
Have you tried giving up bf very very gradually? Does he take a bottle?

Oh, golly, please do not feel bad about this. I have had three children (now aged 11, 13 and 15) and they have all had radically different sleeping habits. My son was a very tricky sleeper, and after soul-searching just as you are, I came to the conclusion that he's just not much of a sleeper (he's still up at 5 most mornings, and he's 15!). I really think there is very little parents can do to influence how much sleep a baby needs. None of us wants our babies to be awake several times a night for several months...

As you say, he is learning new things very fast- the walking thing was good for us because our son got a lot more tired after running around all day, although the trade-off was falling over a lot. Everything seems worse when you are tired though. I can guarantee that you will feel a lot more positive when he starts sleeping a bit more at night (and he will!). Honestly though, ours did not sleep reliably through the night until about 18 months. This is not that unusual. Anybody who tells you otherwise is a big fat liar.

Hang in there, turtledove; it will get better, and you will not even remember this phase...

First of all you are not a total failure as a mother. My son went through a horrible sleeping phase around 9 months I'm sure, after previously sleeping through 7-7 (how smug was I??)

We could never pin down why my son woke up, he was not BF, and was also teething, but not as many as your ds. We did do cc, after trying many other things, and it has always worked for us. It is tough, but you have to remember it does work, and it is worth it.

Oh and the development stage up to walking is so difficlut, my ds didn't crawl until 9.5 months and then 10 months started walking.

Hang in there, it will get better, lack of sleep is the worst.

Not sure if I haven been any help, I have my ds sat on my lap, so am just babbling.

Thanks all. No, wont take a bottle/cup/beaker/mug/anything really. Once got him to have 2 oz out of a beaker but he was STARVING. I left him with DS for 3 days and he didn't touch a drop of milk.

Obviously that should have said I left him with DH. Yawn.

You are NOT a failure as a mother. Or, if you are so am I, and so are an enormous number of us who weren't lucky enough to get babies who sleep through.

I have to say that I don't think your son's sleeping sounds too bad to be honest. I'm only saying that as a reassurance that he is well within the bounds of 'normal', and not to diminish how rotten you feel about it. I do know from bitter experience how utterly destroying it can feel when your baby relentlessly won't sleep as much as you need him to.

If he's teething with difficulty, that will have a massive detrimental effect on his sleeping, but the good news it that IT SHALL PASS. Teeth are finite. He won't be getting them for ever (though it must feel like it sometimes).

I can't tell you that CIO will work, because I've never tried it. It seems like an very stressful solution to an already stressful situation. Would snuggling up together and sleeping with him work?

I hope you get something sorted ASAP.

If I BF him back to sleep with the after 2 wakings he goes back down immediately after 5 minutes BF. If I just try to comfort him he stays awake for over an hour and then wakes soon after. Have tried the CC bit, it just pisses him off mightily and he seems to get worse the more I come in. DH is very little help and now refuses to do nights. I am hoping that if I can drug myself put earplugs in and sit rocking like a madwoman in the hallway for two nights solid that I may see an improvement.

I put him to bed in his cot at 7 and we co-sleep from 2. That is me and DS, I have to sleep in his room as DH wont have him in with us(he has to get up to work) and this is killing "DH and me" too. The other problem is that I am too tired to have sex with DH and he is getting very upset about it. (Dont get me started on that one.)

It sounds a bit like you are trying to tackle it all at once.
If you can, try to just focus on one thing at a time. Maybe you could just work on the bf to sleep bit for now, if that is something you are not happy about. Carry on bf for a while longer if you can so he knows its still part of his world but that it just doesn't happen at sleep time.
Does he take any water from a cup or bottle?

Water is no problem. Put milk in that beaker though and he looks at you like you've tried to poison him!

Sorry, have been rambling a bit. I haven't had any coffee yet. Someone tell me how to do tonight? Do I give him water?

I can identify with that one - my dd will not drink milk from anything but a bottle and is 23m!

When I moved on from bf to sleep (6/7m i think) dd did not like it one bit but I would stay by her side while she kicked up a fuss, and rub her back or stroke her her hair. The first time took about 2 hours and as I percevered over a week or two it took less and less time until she was going off in 5 - 10 mins

turtledove, if you a total failure as a mother, then so am I!
Ds turned 1 today and last night he woke up at 1am, 3am, 5am and 6am and was up for the day at 6.40am. The interrupted sleep was awful!
Just like your ds, mine has 7 teeth and has been cutting the 8th for at least 2-3 weeks, I can now see a white bump on the gum so I am praying it'll pop through any time now. He is snotty as hell as well and dribbles like the Niagara Falls
He is also not walking unaided - he has taken 2-3 steps (I think the average age for walking alone is 13mo, so your ds is doing fantastically well!!). He is also having similar nap times.
We did sort of try CIO, but my DH stayed in the room and comforted him (I stayed away) after a couple of days her started to settle down and was only waking briefly for 5-10 mins, but then it all went to hell in a handbasket again and I started feeding him in the night again.
He then managed to sleep 7pm -5am for 4 nights on the trot (woohoo!!!) but then he started waking up again, I think that is when toothypeg no. 8 started giving him trouble.
Is there a reason you want to give up bfing?
Can you try sticking with it? After we had a few nights (After the sleeping through) bad stretches I put my foot down with DH and said I would go and feed him as it was the quickest way to settle him - plus I think it was the teething and extreme snotty nose that was causing him to wake.
He does have good nights and bad nights, and I think (apart from last night but that was because we got late from visiting the in-laws) the good nights are outnumbering the bad ones.
I did have one friend who went cold turkey with bfing, and stop abruptly and then her baby took bottles. But she did suffer some discomfort for a few days afterwards.

Sorry it's a bit rambly!

It will get better!!

bf til she was 9m too btw.

OK, so plan now that the caffeine is working: keep BF during the day and knock night waking/feeding on head. Those who have done CIO-am assuming he may get thirsty with crying, do I go in with water?

what's CIO?

off to do brekkie - good luck later! Stay calm and remember it won't be like this forever!

He is too little for Crying it out.

Please don't.

He is just a normal baby. They are all more or less like this. It's bloody knackering but just try and roll with it as much as you can. Soon it will be over.

I mean it.

Let him make his own timetable. You're not on top form at the moment obv but banging your head on the wall that is baby sleep problems is not going to solve it!

Just please don't do CIO. There's no need and it will just distress you both to the hilt.

And you can't control this top down imo.

That's exactly what you need to stop - you think you've got to keep it all in line but no, you don't. A baby will just do what it needs to do and there's no point fighting it.

I'm not sure whose expectaqtions you're trying to meet in terms of being a 'failure' etc but please give up worrying about that. Nobody's judging you, we've all been there or are there at the moment

I FEEL like a failure. Doesn't mean that I am, just that I feel that way. My health is suffering. My marriage is suffering. My son is constantly overtired. Something has got to give.

This is what I have done and dd (7.5 months) slept 11 hours last night without waking at all. Previously, she'd been waking up about 8 times a night.

I started by refusing to bf to sleep I did the ncss 'pulling off' bit and then patted her to sleep. I did it for a couple of weeks but I think a few nights would probably be enough. It's hard work, you can be there patting for an hour or more. Then I stopped feeding her. So when I went in I didn't pick her up, just kept patting until she went to sleep (anything before about 6 in the morning when I would feed her but take her downstairs to feed and get her up for the day). Again, hard work and there for ages, but I did this for a few nights. Then when I was happy with that I did a version of cc in that I went in and out of the room very quickly, leaving her for one minute then 2, then 3 (not more than 3) and in between I went in and reassured her, but because she was already used to not being picked up and fed it was OK. She just whinged a bit for about 15 minutes and then went to sleep. Ever since then she's been sleeping brilliantly. So, I know it's hard when you are so tired and desperate, but if you can put the work in for a couple of weeks, it's worth it and so much less distressing for either you or the baby. I think going from one extreme to the other is going to be awful for him and awful for you as a consequence. Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

CIO is not the answer. A serious talking to for youe DH is!! He needs to be more supportive and less demanding. He may be going to work etc but you spend your time doing the most important, mot demanding job in the world, raising his son!!

Carry on co-sleeping and nurse him on demand, and perhaps try reading "Three in a Bed" by Deborah Jackson. It will help you to see that you are not a failure and that your son is behaving quite normally.

We tried to go the "conventional western" route with DD1, cot,seperate room etc, it was a disaster. I read 3 in a bed, and the Continuum Concept and had an epiphany, we stopped trying to "train" our baby (18 months old by this time, and still waking every 2-3 hours a night, only going back to sleep on the boob) and allowed her to sleep in with us after her first waking (about midnight). Suddenly we all got more sleep, she became less stressed and clingy and within 6 months was sleeping all night in her room in her own bed, shortly afer this DD2 was concieved...... if you see what I mean.

What I'm saying is, change your expectations, not your mothering. Get your DH to behave like an adult and not a stroppy child, and stop thinking you are a failure. You are not.

Also, sleep when he's napping in the day, take him into your bed and zizz together, and consider carrying him in a sling during the day if he's grumpy.

Chin up, it'll get better I promise.

oh i see CIO, cry it out. no, dont do this! imagine how you'd feel crying and upset and getting no comfort at all until you just wore yourself out and fell asleep. Surely that can't lead to a good restful night

turtledove, your not a failure

my 2 ds's have never been good sleepers, they are too lively and see sleep as a nuisance

I've tried everything trust me

the oldest is now 10 and is getting better slowly

its bloody hard going I know

but my 2 are great boys, lovely to their old gran, kiss me all the time, well behaved at school, lots of nice friends

just because some kids sleep better than others doesn't make you or me a bad mum

hang in there xx

turtle also you'll find babies/kids change as they grow

mine have been crap sleepers/good sleepers then got a cold/ crap sleepers again

and something that worked last month may not work this month

I'd only recommend doing what suits you I had my 2 in with me for years as it was the only way any of us got any sleep, all my friends poo pooed it, their kids slept all night so they kept saying, but I seen traits in my kids I wouldn't have put up with that they were willing to accept

so we're all different, do whats right for you and your family