Co-sleepers - help me with my constantly waking 6 month old please! (LONG POST!)

[ChairmumMiaow]

DS is 6 months old today, and we've been co-sleeping in various ways since he was about 3 months and grew out of his moses basket.

Before he came out of the basket, he was (briefly) sleeping pretty well (IMO) waking 1-2 times a night, and I was feeling good. When we took him out because it was too small, he started waking more often. I presumed this was a combination of the change of sleeping environment and the hot spell we were having at the same time. I thought it would get better!

Since then, its just got worse - he's waking more and more, so I have him in bed with me more and more, and now I'm losing my confidence in what I'm doing. It feels like he won't sleep for long without my nipple in his mouth (although I know its not actually as bad as that). He wakes every 1-2 hours, but seems to only sleep for more than an hour in our bed - he used to do about 3 hours in his cot to start with then wake frequently after that, but now we're lucky if we get an hour at the start of the evening (he normally goes to sleep between 8 and 9pm and just feeds then plays if we do bath earlier)

Some days I feel ok - if he just wakes to get latched on I barely wake up, but after weeks of doing this, I'm getting aches and pains in my back and arms. I normally lay him in the crook of my arm to feed, so when I go to sleep I get a dead arm after a while which wakes me up. Sometimes I can then roll him over onto his back, and he sleeps for a while longer, but other times he wakes up, which wakes me up more, and we have to get comfortable again...

If I try to feed him without being in my arm, I have to roll a bit further onto my side (but not completely over as that seems not to work) which gives me backache as my bac is twisted slightly. I've thought of supporting my back with a long cushion, but thought that it would just wake me up more to get it in place.

If I try to put him back in his bedside cot after every feed, I just wake up shattered. If I try to get him back to sleep by patting etc, he just works himself up into full crying, which I can't stand! Same thing happens when DH tries - as he does when he hears me and DS getting worked up!

I've had people suggesting that I'm waking him up myself, and that he might sleep better in his own room, and as each night I just get that little bit more tired, I'm starting to doubt the route I've chosen and wonder if I make DS sleep as he does! (but I really don't want him in another room just yet)

He doesn't feed as much as he used to in the day, and is not yet eating much solids (he started BLW very slowly about 3 weeks ago) so I know that he needs to catch up at night to a certain extent, but it feels like he's snacking a lot...

So I'm wondering if I can -

a) improve my sleep-feeding technique - any hints?
b) use some other non-crying technique to get him back to sleep
c) try a dummy (I don't particularly like them, but don't hate them...)
d) do something else...

If I can get more comfortable feeding him in bed, I'll be happy, as when I'm not knackered, I don't worry about getting him into bad habits, and DH and I have agreed we're happy to have him in our bed for some time. When I'm tired though, I feel like I'm doing everything wrong!

DS pretty much always sleeps in his cot now, although if I get really knackered I'll nap with him in my bed for the afternoon one.

I let dd sleep on my lap in the front room last night before transferring her to the cot via a quick feed at 11.30 and that was her till 2am. Although in some ways I feel like that is going backwards, I also felt much happier in that she was at least getting the sleep that she so obviously needs and also it meant we were able to watch a film. Hurrah! Am going to keep on with the naps as she definitely needs them at those times and am hoping she will get so used to sleeping at those times that eventually she will go down much easier, i.e. without me lying next to her! Going out tonight though so DP will be baby wrangling for the evening. God knows what will happen!!!

Avon - forgot to ask, how's it been going since your PU/PD started?

Hi there. I've just come across this thread and have had a read through as I am interested in the book "Healthy Sleep Habits Happy Child" - just ordered a copy from Amazon actually. My dd is 10months and can sometimes sleep really well through the night and nap well in the day. But she is very inconsistent and things like teething and colds send it all out the window and I often feel we are back at square one. Just ordered the book in the hope that it might offer some help. I am not great myself at being consistent about when I put her down for naps. Also she tends to bf to sleep or if that doesn't work we rock her to sleep. Would be nice if she could put herself to sleep a bit more. Anyway, sorry for rambling on on this thread. Just wondering if anyone else had found this book helpful with those sort of issues?

zulubump - I don't think any of us have got as far as good napping and regular sleeping so we'd be interested to see how you deal with disruption I think!

Last night was great. Asleep at 7 after about 20 minutes on and off grumbling with a bit of crying. Then nothing till midnight, and another feed at about 4, then when we went to get him at 7 he was just waking up. I can't really ask for more than that at night at his age, and we have our evenings back, so we're pretty happy.

We're not having much luck with the naps though - we can't get them right. I can't get him to nap long enough in the afternoon (we're sticking to 45 minutes in the morning, although I do try to feed him back to sleep - he's just not interested) and then he's tired at about 4, can be convinced to take a nap, but then it seems to mess up bedtime, even if we do it a little later. He's just grumpier after that nap.

If we go through without the afternoon nap, we end up bathing him at 5.30 and putting him down at 6 - which means that even if DH leaves work at 4, (which he tries to do) everything's a rush .

Anyone got their naps working? When do yours nap and for how long?

OK. That'd the end of 2-hour naps. Had textbook naps yesterday and dreadful sleep last night.

LaTrucha - that sucks!

Our of interest, when did yours nap to get this result?

We had our standard 45ish minute morning nap, and after 2 (close together) feeding back to sleep sessions, we're so far on about 1hr40mins for the afternoon (total including wakeups) I'm hoping this solves the third nap issue we're having...

10 am (about 2.5 hours after waking) and then around 4pm. She has her bath about 7.30 and was asleep at 8.30... for a while ... .

She napped about the same times today but for an hour. We'll see...

I would say 4pm for 2 hours is too late. My guess would be that's the nap that caused you trouble!

HSHHC says not to let them start their afternoon nap after 3pm as it will mess up their bedtime.

We've been having trouble with DS's third nap being too late - He's normally in the bath at around 6 and in bed by around 6.30 and I just can't normally get a late enough or long enough afternoon nap to get him through till bedtime. Having said that, he's done about 1.10 till about 3.20 today (with 2 resettling feeds). I'm hoping we can have a nice relaxed bathtime now, without the screaming when the nappy is put back on, and maybe do some massage as he should still have the energy.

Oh and wish us luck - we're going to se the 7.10 showing of The Dark Knight and DS's auntie and cousins are watching him! - First time we've been out on our own in the evening since we had him!

Ahh but awake at 5 then asleep at 8.30 sounds doable

Yes. Not ideal but we have guests so have to be a bit flexible.

Is everybody else getting up at the same time every morning? I've been setting the alrm for 7.30, but often I just turn it off and we both go back to sleep till 8 (at ths point she is always in the bed). Is it really important to get up at the same time every day???

HSHHC reckons wakeup time is important - within a window - to "protect the nap schedule"

DS normally wakes up between 6 and 7 - if he's not awake by 7 we get him up (but normally we go in and he is actuallly awake, just being quiet)

It would be hard if he got up at 8 instead, as the naps would be later, lunch would be later, and bedtime would be hard. If we managed to get naps at the right time

Hi peach et al

Well it's swings and roundabouts here. The pu/pd went really well the end of last week up until Saturday night when DD backtracked slightly and kicked up an almighty fuss in teh evening and through the night. Sunday wasn't much of an improvement either. She seems to fluctuate between having really great 2 hour naps and then sleeping brilliantly in the evening to just doing her 45 mins and then struggles to go for an hour from 6.30pm. Last night she was up with us for 2 hours until 10pm ish, just like she used to be! I think I've been a bit foolish to think I could solve it all in a couple of days and I definitely need to be stricter when it comes to putting her back in her cot in the middle of the night. I'm getting so tired now though that it really just seems easier to take her into bed with us! Also we dared to venture further than the local high street a couple of times over the last few days and I think that's messed us up a bit - it's only when you're walking through Central London with a baby who you know needs to nap that you really realise how bloody noisy it is! So this week it's strictly napping in her cot and my sister's coming down so hopefully I can get some rest too. Also need to try and stop sniping at DH as he's really only trying to help in that not-really-helping kind of way - am not being very nice to him at all . Sorry for the negative overtones contained ih this post, hopefully there will be better news next time I post!

Avon - don't despair - I can remember how that feels. its a DH's job to take a bit of sniping when they're sleeping and you're not. I was positively horrible to mine for a while, but we both knew why!

The naps for us haven't made much different to night-wakings, just to bedtime - if the naps have worked well - and it seems to be just timing rather than duration - its a breeze and we hardly get any crying - if not, we get 10 -15 minutes.

Last night was good for us. Returned from the cinema to find he's had a little stir and 9pm but gone back to sleep by the time SIL got upstairs. Woke at about 11.20 when we were banging around going to bed, then at 3 and had good feeds both times. Was awake at around 6.30.

Tonight we're going to try a dream feed at 10 so I only have to get out of bed once!

Thanks Chairmum, I am incredibly lucky to have such an understanding dh. Oh how we'll look back and laugh eh? I am really pleased it's going so well for you. We are going to a wedding on Thursday evening so my sister is looking after dd - am mildy petrified that dd'll be a nightmare for her but am not going to let it show to either of them! Am just going to make sure I enjoy the champagne and the wearing of a nice pair of heels .

At least being so knackered gives one a licence to eat chocolate. More coffee anyone?

About a gallon over here!
It seems like two naps of about an hour sre good here, although, like Chairmum, they don't seem to do much for the duration of sleep. DD asleep at 8.30 and awake at 2, 4 and 5.15 last night. From 5.15 she just wants to suck and nap. I'm getting really fed up of it.

Peach - I was getting up at the smae time every day but has gone a bit haywore recently. TBH hasn't made a great deal of difference to sleep.

Teething STILL in full swing here!

Hi guys,

DD is 6 months this week and thought I would let you know how her schedule is going.

Wakes around 6am (far too early but can't seem to influence this!)
First nap at 9am for 2 hours.
2nd nap at 1pm for around 21/2 to 3 hours.
Bedtime 7pm.
Wakes for feed at 11pm and again at 3am.

She has naturally extended her first 2 naps and no longer needs the 3rd nap. It would be nice if she would cut out the 3am feed but I guess I can't complain as it is such an improvement from a month ago. I think I am going to try and stretch the 11pm feed to 12 or 1 and maybe that will see her through to 6 but I am doubtful. HSHHC does say that most BF babies will need a couple of night feeds until around 9 months.

Hope everyone is well and has a good night tonight

And just when I thought it was safe to relax - we have teething!

And now I'm not sure. He was definitely grumpy (and he's not really a grumpy baby. He also didn't want us touching his teeth which was odd (he normally likes having his gums rubbed). He woke at around 9.15 and we went in after about 10 minutes and it took us till 10.45 to settle him again.

We can't see any sign of teeth or gum swelling so now we're not sure what to do if he wakes early tonight. Is he teething or was he just having a bit of a complain about his new routine?

After his wakeup he went through till 3, had another feed then woke up at around 5.45 and DH brought him in with us half an hour later. Recently he's slept through till at least 6.30 (and has never really been one of those early risers...)

Decisions, decisions... Why is it so hard to be sure you're doing the right thing for your baby?

Why are babies never simple!?

I know what you mena Chairmum, I go back and forward all the time in what I want to do. We have taken to letting her sleep on my lap in the front room in the evening before transferring into the cot. The only thing is that the last couple of nights I have been really tired and at her first waking (last night at midnight) I gave up trying to put her back into the cot after about 20 mins and brought her into the bed. sigh... The being up and down all evening was really starting to get to me, hence the sleeping on my lap and am thinking will try the cot again in a few days. Avon - am sure if you keep going it will get back on track. Am still thinking about PUPD but am going to wait a couple of weeks as we are going away for the weekend to stay with family for the bank holiday and therefore I think it is best not to do it and then have this disruption. Right, almost time for morning nap!

Well after all that negative stuff yesterday we had our first major improvement last night! It took a while to get her settled using pu/pd but she did - 30 minutes I think it took - she dropped off at 8pm ish then slept til 12.30am! This is the first time she has slept through an evening. She went back to sleep post feed IN HER COT til 5.15am upon when she awoke and chatted away to herself for 15 minutes before realising she was hungry. She was in with us til 6.30am when DH left early for work so I just put her back in her cot. She moaned a bit but then fell asleep for another hour (and so did I - bliss!)! I am thinking two long naps are better for her than three shorter ones - she skipped the third yesterday - and also I waited as long as possible to feed her before she went to bed so she was really hungry. In the past I have cluster fed but I think she is old enough to do without that now. It worked last night so I'll definitely try it again!

Kristin thanks for the update. Peach I absolutely understand when you say you just bring DD into bed with you and leave it at that. I am trying desperately hard to get her back in her cot post feed and it paid off last night but if she'd have kicked up a fuss then I'd probably have done the same. I suppose you just have to do as much as you can and don't feel too disheartened - we've all been co-sleeping for a reason (because it's amazing!!) so if you're getting a few more nights of her being in bed with you then try and enjoy them. You know you will miss her when she's sleeping 12 hours straight in the room next door - in the meantime look forward to trying pu/pd after the holiday.

Chairmum -= wishing you a happy teething! , HAppier than ours, anyway , which is still going on.

Another poor night. Ho hum...

And yes, Chairmum. I know exactly what you mean. And why does everyone who doesn't have a baby 'know' exactly what to do, according to them at least.

hi all

reading with interest as my 8mth non-sleeping, co-sleeping teething baby is lying asleep right now coming up to the dreaded 45th minute of her nap...

Won't bore you with the details but can identify with all your problems.

and isn't teething hell?!!

about 3 weeks ago I had managed to only feed ONCE at night can you believe it (took weeks to get there) - then teething hit and it's all back to square one PLUS - this is the warning!! - I got my periods back!! . So that is the one advantage of lots of night feeds

good luck all for tonight

ChairmumMiaow - just read through this thread after you replied to me on mine. It rings so many bells with me, although I haven't had to get up as many times in the night as you! I'll definitely keep following it. My DD has been the amazing non-sleeping baby during the day pretty much since she was born so perhaps the 2 hourly schedule could help us. Worth a try!
Do you think it's worth buying the Healthy Sleep Habits Happy Child book?

Today is a write off following me spending 3:30 to 6am up with DD last night. I even tried letting her cry for abut 20 minutes which just mad me feel bad, DD furious and DH retreat to the spare room. But tomorrow is always a new day .