What do you do when sleep training hasn’t worked?

[Nosleep2021]

DS is just awful. We are lucky to get 2/3 hours at the start of the night, wakes, then he refuses to go back in his cot. He isn’t hungry or anything - milk is offered and refused.

Since what he wants is to be picked up the sleep methods like Ferber don’t work.

I never thought I’d do CIO but I just can’t carry on like this. I’m depressed because of lack of sleep.

@Nosleep2021

I really hope you can sort it out OP. I don’t have advice for you, but really do hope you find your solution.

Accept that you haven’t done anything wrong but there isn’t necessarily a quick fix. Meet your baby where he’s at. Give him security like you’re doing by holding him. Get DP to help. It’s his job to support you in this.

Get a sleep consultant. Seriously. My DD was fucking horrendous until she was 16 months and my mental health was absolutely shot, I was hallucinating due to sleep deprivation. She woke every 45 mins-1.5hrs every single night from 4 months- 16 months. Often awake for hours on end.

Within 3 weeks of the sleep consultant getting involved she was sleeping through.

Best money I’ve ever spent.

Honestly, in your situation I would do the same. Cc where you go back into the room after certain intervals or CIO. He already knows how to get himself to sleep. Whatever you do, choose a plan and stick to it and assume it could take 3-5 nights to take effect. As the previous poster said there may be a few issues to address so don't give up if it doesn't happen overnight.

I've had two poor sleepers, it's incredibly tough, I sympathise.

DS1 went through a similar "split night" phase and I had to pretty much cut out his naps to crack it. Is he napping in the day at all? If so when? When does he go to bed?

How have you approached bed sharing? I share with my youngest, big bed, bed guards on each side, DH in spare room. It's not ideal but it's better than the alternative.

Hang in there, it will get better.

My general sense of all these sleep books et al is they work for some babies. This is why there are so many books and methods. The best thing to do is to study YOUR baby, his preferences, his routine. What’s his natural eat/feed/play cycle like? It sounds like he can fall asleep but treats that like a nap and is then awake for a long period. What happens if you ignore him then? Dim light so he can see you and you ignore him? Are their allergy issues? Does he have reflux and associates sleep with pain?

You hint that he’s a snuggly baby- he wants that closeness of touch. Is that true when he’s awake as well? Maybe he needs to learn some object permanence to help with what might be separation anxiety etc.

Naps really don’t make any difference to his sleep at night. Honestly. I know it’s often said on here the daytime sleep is the answer to night time but not here. No idea why.

It’s very hard to get a consistent routine because he is in nursery usually (I am on holiday from work at the moment) but anyway I doubt that ir would make much difference

There*!

Just seen your update I really feel for you! It's so important for babies to learn to sleep without being held. And it's important to have a happy mum!

Could you try cry it out but not actually leave him? Just hold his hand or stroke his hair for say 2 mins then cuddle him for a bit then hold his hand for 5 mins etc and gradually go longer between each time picking him up? No idea if it would work but I don't see the harm in letting him cry if you are still there and he knows it other wise I don't see why he would ever want to stop being held as it's obviously the nicer option!

I think with naps if you make a change you have to do it for 2-3 weeks to observe any real change. So for instance when older toddlers either give up their nap or transition to a shorter one it involves several weeks of hell closer to bedtime before their body can make that transition.

If he’s nursery he probably actually does have a natural routine.

There is a next to me crib for up to 4 years old, next to me forever it's helpfully called 🙈

Please take this kindly OP but I think you've possibly not been consistent enough with anything. You have done nothing wrong either, some babies just don't sleep. However you list all the things you've tried and it's a lot. He's only 12 months so some of the things maybe coincided with development leaps etc.

If you can afford it, get a sleep consultant.

If not, get a routine.

He’s not really awake for a long period as he will fall asleep but only on you, he wakes and screams when you put him back down.

Ok so his method of falling asleep is on you. Does he has a dummy or a comfort object? How does he fall asleep at bedtime?

I’ve been perfectly consistent but at some point you do have to concede defeat, when it’s three weeks in and your baby is still screaming even though the book says he won’t , so what do you do, carry on being consistent, or just sob?

Tbh I wish I hadn’t had him but he is here now so I’m just trying to make life bearable. I can’t keep getting three hours sleep a night. It’s horrific.

If you lie on your side with his head on your upper arm facing you and your arm around him, so he's tucked into you, does he settle? It sounds as though he waking in the night looking for you hence the jumping on you?

I’ve said - he will go to sleep alone although it takes longer but this makes no difference to him waking and then refusing to go back in his cot. I know the holy grail is supposed to be he falls asleep in his cot by himself but it hasn’t made a difference as far as I can see.

But changing things every 3 weeks is a lot for him to cope with.

You need more sleep, that's a given. What support do you have?

Would you be prepared to CIO?

Made no difference with mine either! It's not the holy grail the books say it is!

His version of settling which is constant kicking down sometimes but I really cannot sleep on that position.

I’m looking for something that means I get to sleep: I mean I obviously want him to sleep too but him sleeping and me not isn’t ideal really!

OK Herc so I should carry on with something that doesn’t work for another three weeks?

I mean, I’m doing what works insofar as he sleeps it’s just I don’t.

Sunshine ha, same!

Anyway, I didn’t post for people to have a go at me, TBH - I know it’s always a risk on MN but what I’m saying here is I have read the books and I have tried what they suggest and my baby’s sleep is still utterly dire and it’s having a knock on impact on my whole life: my diet and my health and my work and my relationship and my friendships. And I’m absolutely desperate to do something.

Have you tried white noise? Story tapes?

Is it the same time every night? Does he get cold? Does something happen in the house to wake him? Our neighbour going for his night shift used to wake our boy. We started to preempt it and stroke his back just before the neighbour left to keep him asleep.

Hi OP. A book I've found really helpful for all 3 of mine is called 'Precipus Little Sleep' by Alexis Dubeif. It's give you plenty of strategies for different ages and differ sleep issues. It also has CIO guidence as a last resort. It's well researched and I found just having a plan for the night gave me some hope and made it feel like I had some control over the situation. I never had to leave any of my babies crying for more than 10 mins in the end. They all sleep through now. Wishing you lots of luck with it all, you'll get there! I feel like I am a shite parent (human being in general) with no sleep and it really got me down so I feel your pain. Also there is a 12 month sleep regression so you might be about to turn a corner! X

*Precious