Could something be wrong with my 2yo? Please help

[Cakeandslippers]

Hello, I'm feeling very broken and sad right now so please be gentle 😔. I can hear my 2yo upstairs having a complete meltdown, it's been constant for over 2 hours now, I've had to come downstairs as I just feel so awful I can't bear it (husband is with her).

She's always been a bad sleeper but since Christmas she's refusing to go to bed, not just refusing but it's a nightly meltdown, and I've never known anything like it, she's like a wild animal, she gave herself a black eye the other week throwing herself around her room (we were there but it's impossible to stop her, she's strong).

We've got a solid bedtime routine and she likes it, she's fine till it's time to lie down and she just won't. Then it escalates most nights to a horrendous meltdown.

We've tried lying with her to go to sleep, she either refuses to lie down or just messes around and it can go on for 2-3 hours. On the advice of the HV we tried just putting her in bed everytime she got out (3 nights of 50+ times putting hat in bed, she screamed a lot it was awful, it seemed to work on night 4, she didn't scream and went to sleep, but after 3 relatively good bedtimes we were back to normal). We've tried the No Cry Sleep Solution, it didn't work at all.

She normally has no screen time after about 3ish, often none after 10am. Naps are hit and miss as she does the same screaming for naps with me so they often don't happen, though she will nap at her childminder or grandparents no problem. Nap situation doesn't seem to impact on bedtime at all either way.

She was getting grumpy at tea times so I started involving her with cooking and it's helped loads so she's eating plenty and happy enough before bedtime most nights.

She's also waking and shouting for dad 1-5 times a night, sometimes settles ok, sometimes has a complete meltdown and normally in between.

We also have a 7 month old who I feel isn't getting the attention he deserves because of this, I never get any time with my husband as the baby also wakes a lot and so we're in separate rooms and evenings are taken up with the 2yo battles. I'm so stressed and sad, feel like we're doing something horribly wrong as she's so unhappy. But I'm now wondering if this is even normal, everyone I know who's had similar issues can at least lay with their child to get them to sleep, she normally just crashes out from exhaustion and I hate the idea she's crying herself to sleep every night, its breaking my heart.

Is it possible there's something wrong with her? Or have we done something terribly wrong? I'm just so sad and tired and I don't know what to do.

This sounds so stressful for you all- we’ve had similar in the past and it was so so difficult to deal with. I ended up so on edge constantly from the fear of another awful night. Looking back, I would say it seemed like for my LO there was an emotional trigger (nursery changes, new sibling to get her head around, house move). I don’t think I handled it well at the time but I’d say it’s a phase, it will pass and is probably due to some kind of separation anxiety. If you put your efforts towards soothing that it may help (sounds like you’re doing lots already) and just ride it out. Is there anything in her bedroom that she might be wary of? Any big changes going on? I realise everything is a bit crazy with the world right now! Big hugs, it’s a really tough one,

My 2yo (now 3) went through a similar Stage after DD2 was born. There’s a brilliant app called moshi which is sleep stories for children, you have to pay for the full version but there’s a couple of them that are free. I was so shocked it worked!!! She was full on screaming every night like you describe, with the sleep stories I think she felt like she was getting a treat!

Thank you. Nothing changed at that time I can think of other than my husband had 2 weeks off work but he's mainly wfh now anyway so not a huge change. The reason I had to give up tonight was because she won't even let me cuddle her unless I'm stood up, if I touch her she kicks, punches, bites and just screams and screams at me and I'm just out of options, there doesn't seem to be another way to calm her down. I'd do anything really. The only thing I can't do is have her in my bed as the baby has to cosleep from about 10/11pm as he'll only settle for 20 mins at a time in his cot and she'd wake him up. I just don't know how much longer I can cope. I hate waking up in the morning as I'm already dreading the evening.

Thank you @Wingingthis I have tried that app and audio books and music and white noise but nothing helped. This was a few months ago when things were bad but not this bad so maybe I should have a look again, I think it might be worth revisiting now she's a little older.
I just wish she'd respond to things like other people's children do 😔

I think you haven't done anything wrong.

It is presumably unlikely to be something wrong medically if she is healthy the rest of the time, but speak to your gp for reassurance if you feel concerned.

Is there anything that makes her calm - like not going to bed and sitting in the lounge? I would just stop trying if it were me, as it sounds dreadful for all of you. Would she fall asleep on your knee in the lounge? Then carry her up when you go to bed?

I’d second the audio stories or failing that I think I’d even sit and read stories for ages. It properly broke me at the time (with a poor sleeper baby too) but I’d go for the gentlest route possible to regain that security. I too couldn’t have her in my bed and was getting worried about starting bad habits so it’s a real balance. It’s so hard to parent well when you’re absolutely exhausted!

Is it possible she has an ear infection?

The bit that resonated for me is that she won't let you cuddle her unless you are standing up. May I please ask if you have had her ears checked?

My dd only slept upright in my arms from about 10months to 20 months. It was all down to rank ear infections/glue ear.

Does she cry a lot in the day time too?

Thank you @PracticingPerson , I don't know. Shes capable of staying up till 11 easily and I'm so tired I really want to be going to bed no later than 10 and I do need at least an hour of child free time (I know some people think that's selfish but I have to cosleep so it really is 24/7 which is too much for me). She has to be up at 7am 3dpw as she goes to a childminder so the challenge is that she's always tired and so an even later night may not help. It's probably worth a try though as this situation is impossible.

Yes ear infections do make lying down very painful, this is worth checking asap.

@LiveintheNow and @RosesAndHellebores an ear infection hadn't occurred to me, would there be other symptoms? I think her hearing is ok though she has a habit of ignoring me at will so I can't be sure. She tantrums quite a bit in the day but only at home, she never vetoed cries at her childminder which I'd expect if it was sore?

Oh I've been there, both of mine were horrible, horrible sleepers. I'd get her a full check with the GP just to make sure there isn't anything like an ear infection going on. Then I'd just do whatever works to get you through.

Mine are 7 & 9 now and they have been the most fabulous sleepers for quite a few years, but I did once count that I was up in the night, multiple times, for a stretch of over 5 years between them. You will get through it, this too shall pass, hang in there.

I cut out my two year olds naps three weeks ago and she falls asleep at 7 like a dream now. Was a massive palaver till 9 or 10 at night when she was still napping.

I have no advice on the sleeping but just wanted to remind you everything is only ever a stage and no matter how horrible it is now at some point (hopefully really soon) both children will start sleeping fine, you and your husband will get back valuable time together and you will feel so much better. Just hold on tight to that thought!

We had two under two and it's really bloody hard (we also had a third so three under three- not recommended). I googled/ mumsnetted myself silly sometimes over sleep and naps and bedtime.

Please hang in there, it does get easier. You and your hubby just go with it, and accept it a bit more. Kids are very different, and not all have read the textbook about how they should go quietly off to sleep at a certain time
Some need more comfort than others, especially at two. Please dont think I'm downplaying how you feel, I totally know how desperately you want, and deserve some quiet time. All of this is a phase, and it will get back to a more doable normal soon.
Ours are 3, 5 and 6 now, and we feel our sanity (and peace of mind) returning. You can and will get through this, if you pull together. Your 2 year old is gine the crying sounds terrible but they are loved and ok. Whenever we mention any of what happened a year ago to ours now they remember none of it!! All that worrying about them being scarred for nothing!

It does get easier and this too shall pass.

Mine had very developed speech and hearing loss was poo poo'd. TBF DH and I both have voices that carry - he was a barrister and we both have measured enunciation.

They had leaks if temperature but I understand it can be just chronic so I would advice you at least discount it. FWIW dd was grommetted at 20 months and the day after she was so happy Nd taken with something in the car, it took me quite a few moments to realise she could hear the birds. Yet her speech was very clear.

I have no advice to add from that given above. But wanted to say you sound like a very gentle and warm mother. And I don’t think anyone would ever think asking for one hour of child free time a day is any thing close to selfish!

Warm milk, horlicks type stuff, aromatherapy, massage, warm bath before bed, night light, night light with plinky music, light on in the hallway, star chart, banana and/or porridge right before bed?

Lavender everything- temple or wrist balm/oat bag/fabric conditioner/ plug in/reed diffusers/oil diffuser?

My two have a night light show thing with lovely lullaby music (they are 5 and 7!!) but they love it. My son has a fan on every night (as do I..!)

Lush sleepy cream helped us

And you sound lovely, and she sounds challenging but normal.

My 2 year old is the same and I've wondered the same thing, it's awful. Mine actually does suffer from ear infections but unfortunately the consultatiok we waited a year for was cancelled due to covid. She was referred in March 2019 and there's no sign of ENT starting back up again.

Recently we've had some success with an audio story I found on Amazon Music about her favourite cartoon character! We don't bother reducing screen time anymore. Sometimes we just let her stay up downstairs with us until she's essentially so exhausted she falls asleep on the sofa. I can't battle with her anymore.

We have a 4 year old too and she has suffered for almost three years as my youngest has always struggled with sleep and taken our attention. Covid has amplified it all massively too unfortunately.

Have you tried putting her back in a cot?

Please excuse typos. Peaks of temperature (and advise - not advice). Tapping away on phone

Sadly albeit more than 20 years ago now, we had to pay privately for grommets and they were life changing for both of them.

Sleep consultant. We had a similar situation with hours and hours of night tantrums, throwing things, etc etc. It took a lot of hard work but I honestly don't think we'd have been able to conquer it without professional help. Look up Dream Nights, it was the best thing we ever did. Hang in there!

Thank you for the kind comments, it has made me feel a bit better. I just see all my friends who have no problems like this and we've had 2 years of it and I just don't understand why, I try so so hard.

@FudgeSundae

I will ask GP about ears, my husband had v bad glue ear repeatedly as a child and was late talking because of it and I have also had issues too (had gromits as an adult) so worth ruling it out. Though for what's its worth I think she wants me to stand purely because she thinks she'll fall asleep if she lies down.

@fudgesundae no she wasn't ever really in one as she would just scream and scream every time we tried to get her to sleep in her cot so she ended up in with me till 12 months then in a bed.... plus she'd definitely just climb out I'm 100% sure 🙈

Thank you others for your tips too