Anyone else trying to gently sleep train?

[MrsIH]

Dd2 is 13 months old and always been a crap sleeper. The longest stretch of sleep (up until very recently) I’ve had is 3 hours and that is on a good night. Generally I think she was waking 2 hourly but I’ve had nights of every 45 minutes. I have a dd1 who is 3 but who is thankfully a good sleeper.

I’m not at work atm luckily and I have no tolerance really for the crying methods. They’re just not for me so I’m not looking for suggestions or justifications of them.

What I’m trying is getting her to fall asleep in the cot and also trying to reduce feeds (she is breast fed) over night.

Anyway the falling asleep in the cot is going well. She did last night but some nights I’m still putting her down asleep as I pick her up and cuddle her if she cries. Frustratingly last night she woke up after 2 hours even though she’d fallen asleep in the cot. I think I got her back down ok but then she woke after another 2 hours. Then I was up for 2 hours trying to settle her. I gave in and fed her in the end although she still didn’t go back to sleep! DH managed to get her down in the end. So I’ve had about 5 hours broken sleep which isn’t great.

Basically looking for anyone else trying to do a similar thing and some moral support. I’m desperate to improve sleep as it’s so hard having her and her sister all day on my own on broken shit sleep!

I'll join. I have 11 mo. He is EBF and we are making progress. For naps I put him in cot awake and leave the room. He self settles, no crying (did have to work up to this) at bedtime I sit next to the cot after putting him down awake and everytime he cries I pick him up until he stops crying and lay him back down saying its bedtime.
I used to feed back to sleep but I start by saying I wouldnt feed him until 1am and went up and hour each night. Last night was no feed before 2am. He woke twice before 11 and resettled himself without me going in the room. Woke at 2.51am and had 8 min bf. Put down awake and went back to sleep. I am cutting the feeds down by 2 mins each night also. The then woke up at 6 this morning for the day.

Hi @HakunaMatataa that sounds really similar to my approach just that I do still sometimes rock/shush to sleep if she needs it. So it’s really good to hear you’re making progress.

I wish I could use same approach for naps but it’s tricky as dd1 is often downstairs just watching the telly. She’s not yet 3 so I hate leaving her like that and so I get dd2 to nap as quick as possible - so either feeding or rocking asleep. My plan is when dd2 is on one nap a day and dd1 a bit older to try to get dd2 to self settle for naps too.

@MrsIH oh I still rock and shh if necessary. If he wakes at night before it's time for a bf (even though he doesnt need it now) I'll try water first. If that doesnt work I'll walk around the bedroom with him, failing that I shh and rock

Naps are difficult. I had to do it this was as he would have only 15-30 mins per day and was an overtired bundle of joy constantly. Once he started self settling he slept longer. We did use gradual retreat to get to this stage. It's hard when you have other DC too. Mine is in school so not so bad. I fed to sleep until a few weeks ago. Both for naps and at night. You just have to go with whatever is right for you and your family.

So far she has self settled twice tonight! Pray for me

That's great! All good here so far too!

That’s great guys! Less good here - bedtime was ok but she woke at 11 and is still awake. Well falling asleep on us but won’t be put down. I tried for an hour and DH is with her now. So frustrating.

Just had over an hour of cry and fussing. I fed her initially then put her down. She was quiet for a bit then started cry. DH changed her nappy and we left her but she was just constantly crying so I’ve given up and fed her. This is her fourth feed! Surely she can’t be that hungry!!

@MrsIH sorry it didn’t go so well tonight. It’s gutting after a previously good night.

Sorry to hear that @MrsIH Apparently there is a few nights that are awful it's them testing your resolve. Pretty good night here. Woke at 11, got back to sleep without a BF. Woke at 3.50am, was meant to be 7mins BUT we fell asleep. Woke up at 6 for the day

I took back over from DH and got her back to sleep at 1.20. Lots of bum patting did the trick! So at least I didn’t feed her I suppose and she wasn’t upset.

She woke at 3.30 and I just fed her straight away - we also fell asleep!! I woke up and put her in cot at 4.30 and she was up at 6.30.

So I guess positive in that only one feed?

I worry it’s confusing for her that sometimes I feed and sometimes i don’t? But I don’t think I’m ready to go the whole night yet and not sure she is?

Was you 11 wake up easy to resolve @HakunaMatataa?

How old is your lo @puds11? Sorry if you’ve already said. Sorry you had a tough night too.

@MrsIH that's really good that she manages without a feed on the first wake up! Its progress, and also feels like a huge win when previously you were always feeding to sleep.

The 11 wake up was interesting. Picked up and put down a few times. Lots of shhh and cuddled him to sleep in the end took around 30 mins. At least no feed!

I've been told by HV and I'm certain hes not waking through hunger. He has 3 meals a day plus snacks and 4+ feeds. When he feeds at night he just suckles.

I think next step for us is to allow him to feed after 3am but just cut the feed short by a minute every other day. HV advised this. Hopefully then he'll not bother waking.

Congratulations to everyone who saw some progress last night!

We had a very frustrating night. DS woke as usual about 45 mins after bedtime, but my husband managed to settle him with patting and shushing without picking him up. That’s good progress for us, especially as he won’t normally settle unless it’s me.

He then woke at 9.30 and I fed him, and I decided I wouldn’t feed him again until 1.00 (taking inspiration from some of the posters on here, thank you!) he woke at 11.45 and I managed to settle him with shushing without picking him up, and with hardly any tears. I couldn’t believe it! Although it took an hour He then woke at 2.30 and I fed him. He didn’t fully fall asleep so I managed to get him to sleep with the shushing as he lay in his cot and I lay in my bed. Result!

But then it all went wrong. He woke at 3.30 and I tried not to feed him as I wanted to get to at least 5am, but he was crying so much and I was so tired by this point that I gave in and fed him to sleep. He then woke again at 5 and I gave in again and fed him, after which he was wide awake for ages crawling around in his cot. He then settled himself eventually and slept until 7.30.

So all a bit frustrating and confusing. He clearly can self settle, and he can’t be hungry as he can go 3-4 hours during the day without a feed. But he’s still hours waking every 2 hours on average at night!

@HakunaMatataa I think my dd probably doesn’t need any night feeds either. She eats pretty well now and has 3 milk feeds a day. Also, the other day when she slept till 4 without a feed by boobs weren’t really full so she obviously isn’t taking a lot of milk. It’s just so hard at that 3/4 am time when you’re shattered! I’m not sure I’m with it enough to time the feed to the minute!! Let us know how it goes though. I am wildly hoping dd will stop waking at 11 and sleep till 3/4 and then I can work on shushing and not feeding then. But at the moment I’m so tired I can’t be bothered and just feed her. Argh!

@Colinthedog that does sound confusing and hard work. I know the feeling! Well done for all the shushing and the good thing is wasn’t fed back to sleep every time. That’s progress!

I should try to see that I’ve made progress to but I’m so tired from last nights 2 hour epic shushing session!! And also v sick of singing nursery rhymes!

I’m with you on the 3am tiredness @MrsIH, I was doing so well up until that point! But I’m just so desperate to get back to sleep when it gets to that time of night, especially when I know my 4 year old will be getting me up in a few hours time! Fingers crossed your LO drops the 11pm feed so you are less tired when they wake at 3. And good luck with the shushing, I didn’t think any baby would ever need shushing for an entire hour to go to sleep but my DS is teaching me something new every day!

I am also with you on the 3am tiredness. He often ends up in with me at that point as I'm too tired. I think that's a good indication she's not taking much during the night. I was expecting to wake up with painful hard boobs to, but nope. I would say as long as shes eating enough during the day which it sounds like she is, she doesnt need it. It's more of a comfort thing at this stage.

@Colinthedog that's great! They do surprise you. I think it all depends on how you would like to do things. I am intending to fully nightwean at a pace that suits us both. Another thing it may be beneficial to try is picking a window of time you wont feed for. So say 11pm - 4am (or whatever window you choose) and gradually increase the time frame. So I dont know maybe start with 10 -2am and dont feed between these times but feed as normal before or after.

I think babies are very clever in that if they know you'll give in it's a battle of the wills. They know they'll get it eventually. We all do it! I've noticed the biggest improvement in wake ups now that he realises he wont be getting fed (unless its time) he doesnt even look for the boobs anymore and a cuddle is enough. To be honest if I wasnt like a Zombie at 3am I could probably get him back to sleep without feeding. I'm not quite strong enough for that yet ha.

@HakunaMatataa Thanks for the suggestions, really helpful. I definitely need to start putting some boundaries in place with regards to night time feeds, so it’s not an all night buffet. I’m trying to strike the balance as he’s still only 6.5 months and isn’t doing too well with solids yet, but while he might need a few feeds at night he definitely doesn’t need as many as he’s having, and definitely not an hour apart!

I think I’ll set myself a challenge tonight- I won’t feed before 10, before 1, and before 4 and see how I get on. Then I can hopefully work on dropping one soon. Does that sound reasonable?

Yes totally agreed. Ds was the same every 45 mins at that age -.- I wish I hadn't left it so long. So at that age they say they dont need feeding. But until solids are established I would argue they do. However long he manages in the day try for at night. Then maybe you can start trying to reduce one at a time gradually. This will cause him to increase his calories during the day to make up for it.
Also, sleep cycles are 45 minutes so it may be a feed to sleep association which was also a problem for us. So getting him self settling would help massively.
Is he teething yet? That always made us go backwards as obviously he needed the comfort. I was advised to not progress more with sleep training but to stay exactly where we were until he started feeling better. Hope this helps @colinthedog

@HakunaMatataa He can self settle sometimes, but seems to find it hard at the moment and it can take a while. I guess he just needs practise. He’s actually stopped putting things in his mouth as much recently so I don’t think teeth are the problem. But who knows?!

I will attempt the new schedule tonight and report back tomorrow! Thanks for all your help.

Is anyone else attempting a new schedule tonight?

You are very welcome. Good luck!

Thanks @HakunaMatataa.

I think if I end up with a long shushing around 11 I’ll feed at 3 ish but if she sleeps through till 3 I’ll try to not feed then either.

Annoyingly she responds much better to me shushing that DH!!

Praying wildly and loudly to the sleep gods also! I might try this to, provided I have the get up and go to get up and rock and shhh.

Yes! Same DH doesnt do the shhh either because DS will just cry for me. Although every thing I've read says dad should shh because of baby smelling mums milk

Well this hasn’t gone well. I said I wouldn’t feed DS before 10.00. He woke at 9.30. DH went to settle him,but after 20 mins of him crying in DH’s arms and getting quite distressed I cracked. I am now feeding him. Don’t know if that’s the right thing, as I feel I have made DS really upset for no benefit at all. But just couldn’t bear it. Not sure where we go from here?

I had the worst night ever. She slept for 3 hours but then that was it. Woke up every 5 to 20 mins after being put back in cot. That went on till o fed her at 1.30 we fell asleep and when I put her back I got maybe 90 mins sleep. She woke up at 5 ish and although i fed her I couldn’t face any shushing. I tried getting her to sleep in my bed but no luck.

I’m so tired and fucked off now.