MN needs a closer watch of FWR

[BodegaSushi]

There is a concerning growth of posts with racist undertones cropping up on these boards, all under the guise of being proudly 'anti-woke'.

Apparently diversity is 'woke' and worthy of derision.

This is the thread I'm referring to here.

Disney went woke now they're going broke www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4836570-disney-went-woke-now-theyre-going-broke

Mumsnet needs to looks at why that board draws such types of posts, and why posters feel so comfortable openly airing their racism.

The person that wrote that posted it in the minute after yours.

So assuming that they were writing it, whilst you were writing yours, probably didn't even see yours before they starting writing their comment.

First response to my first post was a flat out denial.
If it was a joke, it’s a joke about racism.

Seriously? That's what's informed this weird tangent? It's not even a direct response to your post - people usually quote the posts they're directly responding to, as you will know having been here for so long.

OK then. That was definitely worth it and I'll definitely be engaging with more non-arguments in future.

If you do an advanced search using “black birthing bodies” there are heaps of references to this being called out as racist on FWR

So what is the overall proposal, here? Can anyone give people who post on FWR a clear idea of what we are to do to ensure no racist posts are ever made by anyone?

And if we see a racist post we are to report it, is that it?

Or something else?

The people saying 'black birthing bodies' are not people on FWR, but actual people in positions of power in the USA.

If we report it here it has to be evidenced that it was actually us so we have to divulge personal information, before we can be accepted as having reported it.

And I suggest you be an adult and tag the person and ask them directly.

To be fair to Crackhen, this is the third attempt by Crackhen to goad me into engaging with Crackhen. It appears that Crackhen hates being ignored, which is useful to know.

If you need proof that being "woke" has moved very far away from its origins in being alert to racism and social justice issues, we need look no further than the fact that the term "black birthing bodies" was clearly dreamed up by someone trying to be woke.

In a similar vein, I have come across white (obviously) trans activists demanding that the term "female genital mutilation" be changed because it is not inclusive of people who are subjected to the practice but do not identify as female.

I'm going to hazard a guess that the number of people out of the billions of women worldwide who have had their genitals mutilated (the overwhelming majority of whom are black) and who think being female is something you can identify out of is a big fat zero.

So who are they worrying about offending with this sexed language? Not the women and girls who are actually the victims of this abhorrent practice, that's for sure.

But it's OK. Amnesty International, who have been leading the way on the global campaign to eradicate FGM, have confirmed in writing that there is "no such thing as a biologically female body".

Its more than recognising the more overt stuff. Its about creating a safe space where white and ethnic voices carry the same weight and respect. That cannot happen when one group consistent tells another their experiences are invalid of pile on to them to beat them into submission. Lots of ethnic people have told you that space space does not exist here and here you are dismissing them. Are they really all wrong? Out to get women/feminists or false teamers?

Indeed, that was why I was disturbed by @Socrateswasrightaboutvoting stress on the importance of being British born. Surely non British born women have rights too? Is @Socrateswasrightaboutvoting a British nationalist?

What is it you expect the Royal We to do about it?

The space exists, and all sorts of people post in it. How does the Royal We manage people posting before they post?

The thought of any internet forum being a 'safe space' screams TRA to me.

In a similar vein, I have come across white (obviously) trans activists demanding that the term "female genital mutilation" be changed because it is not inclusive of people who are subjected to the practice but do not identify as female.

Me too. I've seen gormless white American virtue signalling "progressives" lecturing black African anti FGM activists about it. The lack of self awareness is astonishing.

"Why can't you just call it "non consensual genital mutilation" to be inclusive?"

A feminist forum is never going to be a "safe space".

Its impossible to stop racist posts but they can be called out consistently. Attacking/ridiculing people for highlighting why something may be deliberately or unintentionally racist or problematic would go a long way to creating a more positive environment. As would reading up on the experiences of ethnic women before trashing their lived experiences as not relevant. It's not exactly rocket science. The 'What do you expect us to do, it's impossible to stop racist posts' response, which is frequently pedalled, tells ethnic posters everything about how motivated someone is to creating a safe space.

The focus of FWR is always going to be sexism and misogyny. Other issues are certainly relevant, but as pp said there are all different kinds of people posting.

@AlisonDonut

Can you explain which of your experiences have been declared invalid on the FWR board.

Can you then explain who you are being accused of 'false teaming' with?

Weren't people calling out problematic posts on the thread this TAAT is based on? What more can be done, other than use the reporting function and explain to posters on the thread why the post is inappropriate?

Attacking/ridiculing people for highlighting why something may be deliberately or unintentionally racist or problematic would go a long way to creating a more positive environment.

What? No, I'm not going to do this.

I wish FWR was a safe space for all women. But it isn't because we frequently get told that we are right wing and bigoted for wanting single sex spaces and because we want to protect our children from harming their bodies in the name of trans rights. I find this very triggering.

It is a good idea to call out any bigotry. I think this should be extended to women the women of FWR who don't believe humans can change sex and who believe that there are situations in which this is really fucking important.

But in all honesty no public internet forum is a safe space for everyone because it is impossible to control what others do. I also worry about the impact on free speech on shutting down conversations.

I am still not clear whether PP is saying that describing surrogacy as the trade of babies, when that is literally what it is, is inherently racist. Is the PP suggesting that it is better for the babies born from this arrangement and surrogate mothers for us to STFU about the reality of the situation in case someone is offended?