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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

I Would Like To Propose A Solution To The Trans Threads Problem

559 replies

DioneTheDiabolist · 31/08/2016 22:08

Dear MNHQ, I am pissed off with all the Trans threads. I understand that you don't wish to stifle debate/free speech and all that shit, so I propose 4 threads where all trans posts can be hidden go.

A Fuck Trans thread. For posters who hate that people are trans.
A Yay Trans thread. For posters who wish to support trans people.
A Trans Bunfight Club thread. For posters on the other two threads who want to have a bit of a ruck.
And a What MNHQ Have To Say About Trans Threads thread. For, well I think you get my drift.

All other trans posts on the site can be deleted, no other threads can be started and I can enjoy the site more.

OP posts:
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7
CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 15:17

"Not everyone on MN uses it to have their awareness raised about anything. They are fine with their level of awareness as it is."

Of course not. Some people are just perfect the way they are and know everything there is to be known.

Felascloak · 03/09/2016 15:18

ego I do, however we do ask people in a non confrontational way to explain non-gender critical views and either they vanish or they start shouting "TERF" at us.
Jack Munros recent thread about "what is a woman?" being a case in point.
The contributions you, miranda and Helen made on the bullshit threads were very measured and interesting. However didn't really help explain the TRA "A woman is anyone who feels like a woman" position. I assume because that isn't your view either.
buffy did a great post about why the woman=feeling, woman=biology camps are incompatible. I guess that's what I feel too.

Ego147 · 03/09/2016 15:19

Do you ever wonder how pointless it is to answer a question with a question

So you've no answer to that question?

Echo chambers do nobody any good. They just reinforce people's views and prejudices.

That's why the 'bullshit' thread was good. There was good debate from a range of voices. Not echo chamber. No one group dominating. Voices from all sides.

CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 15:23

Where else do we find a forum that is not an echo chamber?

Do you ever wonder if the trans threads themselves on here are an echo chamber rather than a debate with a range of voices?

Do you ever wonder how pointless it is to answer a question with a question?

So you've no answer to that question?

Is that why you almost always answer questions with questions?

I can do this all day, Ego. Go on, answer with another question. Grin

Sparklingbrook · 03/09/2016 15:24

Some people are just perfect the way they are and know everything there is to be known.

Yes, there does seem to be people on MN just like that.

Ego147 · 03/09/2016 15:25

As I was saying felas, the 'bullshit' thread was good because there were sensible contributions, people listening, discussion on all sides and it was one of the better debates on here - rather than mere echo chambers.

CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 15:26

"didn't really help explain the TRA "A woman is anyone who feels like a woman" position. I assume because that isn't your view either."

I wouldn't assume that at all.

It would be interesting if Ego would like to answer, though and not with a question.

Ego - Do you believe that a woman is anyone who feels like a woman?

And if not, what is a woman?

Ego147 · 03/09/2016 15:28

And if not, what is a woman

With all due respect cote, I am not going to open that can of beans on here - for lots of reasons.

This thread is also about having an area for trans threads - rather than me answering a question from you,.

So I'd be derailing this thread.

CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 15:30

Sure. Where would you like to answer, then?

Choose a thread. There are several on this topic at the moment.

Over to you.

Ego147 · 03/09/2016 15:31

Choose a thread. There are several on this topic at the moment

With all due respect cote, I have zero interest in discussing that with you.

SodTheSpecialSnowflakes · 03/09/2016 15:32

I would also like to thank those who were "dicking about on the internet" who made me realise, just over a year ago, that all the Trans stuff I found so boring and irrelevant did actually matter.
I've posted elsewhere about this but there was a Trans thread here last summer that was so aggressive and entitled that I completely changed my opinion. Peak trans moment.

CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 15:37

"cote, I have zero interest in discussing that with you"

In that case, I suggest you stop yourself from replying to my posts on this thread & elsewhere.

And thank you for proving once again that you have zero interest in discussing the actual issues, for all your talk of how great it is to have a "range of voices" etc Smile

SoHairyAndForeverSpartacus · 03/09/2016 15:38

there was a Trans thread here last summer that was so aggressive and entitled that I completely changed my opinion. Peak trans moment

Actually, that's also true for me. It was the passion about how important this is for all women that came through in people's (sometimes a little aggressive) posts on the IOC thread that made me think, "Well some of these posters usually seem so reasonable, measured and sensible, but they're really getting worked up about this. Maybe there is something I should pay attention to here.."

IBelieveTheEarthIsFlat · 03/09/2016 15:39

Yes me too Special. I ignored them for a long time, wondering why anyone could have a problems with trans.

Ego Why not? Surely this is the core of the trans issue or am I missing something? I don't understand why, if you are on these threads, you wouldn't want to get to the core of the issue

Ego147 · 03/09/2016 15:42

Why not? Surely this is the core of the trans issue or am I missing something? I don't understand why, if you are on these threads, you wouldn't want to get to the core of the issue

This is a thread about a trans area. Stop derailing it and making it about me and what I think,

I have told you quite clearly that I am not going to answer here - or elsewhere. If you can't figure out why I don't want to discuss that on here with some of the posters who take part, then that's your problem. I am sure other people can figure that out.

AvengeTheDoc · 03/09/2016 15:42

This is my first post on. Trans thread, there's just so many and so much crap written (by both sides ) IMO, and a lot of attention for what is a really small portion of society.

The thing that strikes me a the vitriol it gets and I liken it to when women were getting rights and some men were getting outraged, "what about our rights" surely an equality of rights somewhat dissolves others. I'm sure some men felt that giving women the vote made their vote valid for a somewhat terrible example. Or perhaps this is what vitriol gay people got by many back in the day.

And I see a sense of what about women and I think one thing that comes to mind to paraphrase what seems like the BLM slogan "yes women's rights matter like everyone's, but this isn't about women's rights, at the moment"

I personally think as a whole now,for th most part women have equality, and now there is some restraint in letting others feel better in society in "forgoing" certain things which to be honest because of so few trans people is almost irrelevant day to go.

I do dislike "they" though myself and abhor Cis, which I've also seen aimed at men by feminists before trans issues came to a head.

Ego147 · 03/09/2016 15:45

And thank you for proving once again that you have zero interest in discussing the actual issues, for all your talk of how great it is to have a "range of voices" etc

A range of voices is great. Unfortunately some of the voices make it very hard to want to continue in the debates when they happen.

IBelieveTheEarthIsFlat · 03/09/2016 15:45

Okaydokay. Gotcha

CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 15:48

Avenge - I'm not sure I understand what you mean.

For example, what do you mean by this? "I'm sure some men felt that giving women the vote made their vote valid for a somewhat terrible example." Confused

AvengeTheDoc · 03/09/2016 16:06

Yeah I think to be honest what turned in my head from a succinct post went awry, what I meant is men who have had the vote probably didn't consider it a honour or right, but when women were getting the vote I would imagine some men felt that it diluted the process, or they're vote had less impact because women were "taking" the vote. Really it didn't and doesn't really affect men, women getting the vote. Just like a lot of things pro trans in actuality won't affect women, but because some see it as trans people taking something away from women they are against it. When really in practice it'll largely be a non issue

MaudGonneMad · 03/09/2016 16:07

Just like a lot of things pro trans in actuality won't affect women, but because some see it as trans people taking something away from women they are against it.

Like what? Can you give an example?

CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 16:10

"men who have had the vote probably didn't consider it a honour or right, but when women were getting the vote I would imagine some men felt that it diluted the process, or they're vote had less impact because women were "taking" the vote"

That is not AT ALL what women are objecting to, though. As I honestly think you will see if you would read a single thread on this subject.

Transwomen already have all the rights that women do, by virtue of both groups being people with equal rights - they can vote, own property, etc. Discriminating against trans people is already a crime in its own right.

That is not what this debate is about, at all.

JudyCoolibar · 03/09/2016 16:11

And thank you for proving once again that you have zero interest in discussing the actual issues, for all your talk of how great it is to have a "range of voices" etc

Given how much Ego has contributed to the various discussion threads, that really is absolute nonsense.

Felascloak · 03/09/2016 16:11

cote please stop snarking at ego. It gets very boring to read and derails the thread.

CoteDAzur · 03/09/2016 16:18

Ego is the one who replied to my post and then said has "zero interest" in talking to me. Which is odd, but fine.

Pointing this out isn't 'snarking' imho but your POV might give a different view.

re "Derailing the thread" - Since MNHQ has replied that there won't be a separate topic, I would think it OK to be discussing related topics, as we have been doing.

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