TransAgenda BullShit: The I am Spartacus Thread

[OscarDeLaYenta]

Post deleted by MNHQ as it broke our Talk Guidelines

erm check my profile, I'm a cisgendered woman... and I dont mind that label like some of you....

and I'm a trans ally..

and most of you should be ashamed of yourselves really....

Clonakilty I'm sorry that happened to you

Nope. None.

Found plenty.

I'm a woman, we don't use cis here, we find it offensive.

Good for you.

Now, do flounce off, there's a dear

Clonakilty - more for you. You absolutely should NOT have to put up with feeling unsafe any longer, and you can safely ignore LGBTEXEC's attempt to shame you or any one of us, because it's clear and utter bollocks.

There is no shame in wanting safety for women.

I'm still Spartacus, btw.

Looks around.

Nope, not ashamed.

You, on the flip side, see fit to come on to a thread where hundreds of women have expressed their views and tell us we're talking bullshit and should be ashamed. People have written detailed and reasoned posts explaining their views which I would bet you haven't read 99% of, but you think it's appropriate to tell us off like naughty children

If you want to actually engage there is a debate thread in the same section where you will find both women and transwomen who have thought about their views a lot and are willing to articulate them and discuss them. But, here's a hint...calling them vile, bigots, transphobes or TERFS won't wash. You need to bring a little more to the table then name calling.

Mooncups of the world unite
We will not give up the fight
To be a woman is our right
Fuck cis labels they are shite

I make no apologies or take no prisoners!

Hi LGBTEXEC this thread is for registering support.

Pop over to this thread instead, for discussion.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/2716917-This-is-bullshit-Thread-2?pg=1&order=

Just most , *LGBTEXEC?

TAs love that shame-thing, don't they? Throw a scattergun of insults and adverbs and adjectives, hoping some will hit. No actual real argument or facts for their reasoning or name-calling. It's just all about the feelz, and how terrible everyone is for Saying True Bad Things.

Thanks for your contribution. I think it enlightened many who aren't already familiar with the TA point of view.

Thank you, Thumbwitches and MrsTerry. X

Oh no! I should be ashamed for not falling at the feet of men, that are calling themselves women and their little handmaidens, that are naively trying to be oh so PC and following the other 'female' sheep straight to the slaughter. I just can't find it in myself to accept the lie that men can become women and men with dicks can become lesbians FFS!

nope, not ashamed, not fucking CIS...STILL SPARTACUS and never more proud of MN.

We should be ashamed for saying that people like those listed in the OP are men, and that there is no such thing as a female penis or a ladybrain?

Not likely. Gender is a social construct. Men can wear dresses and make-up and love shopping. It doesn't make them women any more than women who dislike these things are men. 'Feelings' do not trump reality - if they did, Rachel Dolezal would be accepted as black, Stephonknee considered a child, and the 'transabled' would be encouraged to have surgery to remove the limbs they honestly believe they would be better off without. Philosophically, there is no difference between these things and someone like Danielle Muscato declaring that he is a woman because he feels like one, and being taken seriously.

I am not cis. I don't have a gender identity. I'm an adult human female: a woman.

I'm still Spartacus.

I know this isn't the thread to debate this, but from LGBTEXEC's article:
With 2nd wave feminists clinging on and waving scare stories about men in women’s toilets, and even lesbian feminists like Julie Bindel pushing this crap, (it was one man, who wasn’t really trans), you begin to see where the gap is, that hysteria has set in.

ONE MAN WHO WASNT REALLY TRANS? But if a man says they are a woman, we (and you) are expected to accept this without question. So what is "really" TRANS then??

I am Iguess - and it's not a guessing game to realise that a man with a penis can not be a woman, can not understand the journey/obstacles we all have to face as a woman. That does not mean I don't empathise with them or hope they are treated well like all humans should be.

I work with young children and I don't say boy/girls toys, encourage a girl not to play with the woodwork area or worry that a boy in a princess dress will catch the gays - they are learning. I don't agree with pumping a child full of hormones because a boy want to be princess merida instead of Robin hood or a girl refuses to wear a skirt/dress to school. In the same way I wouldn't encourage a parent to seek guidance if their child was pretending to be a dog, mouse or airline pilot.

A man has a penis. A woman has a vagina. These are the basic laws that whether you agree with Darwin evolution theory or the creation story have been true since time began. I will not allow a man to make me/other women feel unsafe in our safe spaces OR vote for a man to take on a woman's equality role to tell me how I/we should be feeling/arguing for OR devalue all that women have fought for by allowing men to take over that fight.

I will not take on the name cis - when you would delete other aggravating/xenophobic insults.

I will be respectful, I will be kind, I will answer their questions on mumsnet with no bigotry but I will not say that a man is a woman when they never can be.

I worked with a person who went to Thailand to have theirself made into a woman. She suffered a great deal of pain and a botched operation. Never did she call anyone cis or anything else. In fact quite a nice person and she never pushed an agenda, just got on with her job. She had problems with hair loss which was noticeable but she refused to buy a wig.

The kind of person who just got on with her life and let others get on with theirs.
She didnt write pretentious rubbish or join any group. Sadly she took her own life when her partner left her. A real case of being trapped in the wrong body and having the courage to change.
How many have that courage?

lgbtexec I fully support any transsexuals living as whatever gender they feel best suited to. I have seen how low someone with body dismorphia can go and the torment they deal with on a daily basis. I have a very good friend who is a post op transsexual woman and I fully support her right to live as a woman. I say that using her terms she lives as a woman not that she is a woman because she understands that is not biologically possible. I happily use the pronouns she wishes me to and would for anyone who I meet.
However I also support through right for my daughters to be in women safe places without having to face a Penis. They should only face a Penis if and when they are ready to. Many women who use women only spaces may have suffered abuse at the hands of a man why should they have to share their safe places with a body with a Penis however the body is dressed up. Women have fought long and hard for that right and it is a right we should be able to use and keep without worry or shaming into sharing with anyone with a penis.
I support everyone being able to choose who they share sexually experiences with without fear of being called any type of phobic. I was under the impression that we as a society deemed no means no for whatever reason and acceptable course of action.
I am a mum of 6 children I support their right to grow and make choices like wearing whatever they wish and playing with whatever toys they wish. I don't believe they should be referred to as straight gay or trans until they are able to make a fully informed choice by themselves. I say this as a proud mum of a teenage son who in the last year came out as gay.
I also support the right that I do not have to be called a Cis woman just because I was born a girl and have grown into an adult female.
I fully stand by what I say and believe I also stand by others choices to live as they see fit as long as it poses no harm to themselves and others. I am not ashamed the ones who should be ashamed are those who are promoting violence and shaming others into having sex with them by calling them phobic and I am still spartacus. message edited on poster's request by MNHQ

I am Scalliondays and I too am Spartacus. I would be sorry to be banned from Mumsnet but firmly hold the following views:
Biology is absolute and paramount - apart from a tiny percentage of intersex people everyone is either female or male depending on their chromosomes and this cannot be changed.
Gender is a concept which limits people and we should oppose it - we have a personality and likes and dislikes
Transwomen are a subset of 'men' - they are pushing the boundaries of what it means to be a man not a woman.
Children should not be 'transed'.
There is no such thing as a female penis.
Transwomen should not be in women's prisons, hospital wards, toilets, shelters and they shouldn't be participating in women's sport at any level.

• These are areas that should be segregated by sex alone.

The idea that people can self identify themselves into the other sex is rubbish. 'Cis' is an insult and should not be used. Women should not be required to use the female pronoun for a transwoman - we may choose to but it is a kindness not a right. Statistics should be noted according to a persons sex. Lesbians have every right not to be attracted to transwomen.

I am sick of aggressive men trying to trample our rights but have empathy and sympathy for those men who wish to present as women and quietly get on with it. I would support the right of transpeople to have facilitites and protection from hate crime.

That is of course a very tragic story. Perhaps if that person had had the right mental health treatment, rather than feeling they needed to surgically alter their body, they might still be with us. Maybe not. But please don't use suicide to shut people down.

That was to Portia.

Clona

I remain Spartacus in spite of the erudite points of one poster here

I too know somebody who lives their life quietly and with dignity while undergoing any manner of medical and psychological interventions in order to fully transition. I have nothing but respect for their struggle and how much harder I would imagine their life must be compared to somebody who feels comfortable that their sex and gender match up. Funnily enough they agree themselves that their situation is that of a tiny minority of people and while they should OF COURSE have every right to be safe and protected from harm and, lets face it, usually male violence, they do not require women's rights to be infringed.
That position is a possible one, imagine!