Seriously MN this is fucking bullshit.

[DeathAnTaxes]

Message from MNHQ: We're afraid we felt we had to delete this thread as we feel like it has strayed way outside of our Talk Guidelines. We do regard deliberate, malicious misgendering (as opposed to accidental slip ups) as transphobic. Thank you to everyone who took the time to post thoughtfully here. We understand folks will want to talk more about pronouns and trans issues in general on another thread perhaps - but we would ask that you do so in way that doesn't rehash or repeat this thread. Thanks.&Message from MNHQ: We're afraid we felt we had to delete this thread as we feel like it has strayed way outside of our Talk Guidelines. We do regard deliberate, malicious misgendering (as opposed to accidental slip ups) as transphobic. Thank you to everyone who took the time to post thoughtfully here. We understand folks will want to talk more about pronouns and trans issues in general on another thread perhaps - but we would ask that you do so in way that doesn't rehash or repeat this thread. Thanks.

ONE poster wanted to discuss pronouns and they won. A thread about women being shut down by transactivists was shut down by a ta.

Fucking brilliant.

AND FOR THE RECORD THE PERSON'S PRONOUNS ARE 'THEY'

A vile misogynist was "misgendered" be being called he, because we can not even discuss who is doing this.. It is he's. It is men.

they was not even a thing 5 years ago. If I today demanded my pronouns be "Vagina owner" would everyone have to respect that?

Cis means that your sex and gender align.

User - cis = Stepford/handmaiden/unquestioningly happy to go along with what the men tell us to do.

Cis means that your sex and gender align

What about those of us who are gender critical ?

I'm so angry with the way MNHQ are dealing with this issue.
Your deliberate willingness to support MEN in this issue is absolutely mind boggingly STUPID. It does not make any sense.
Do you realise you are alienating a huge percentage of your users?

I think the cotton ceiling is logical. Male people identify as women and lesbians. Other lesbians tell them they see them as women and lesbians. But none of them will have sex with them. Which means the lesbians are lying. They don't really see them as women and lesbians, but are happy to pretend they do. Hence cotton ceiling, you are being transphobic by refusing to have sex with me.

amanaplan Ada was elected by the student body (or knowing what political engagement is like at Edinburgh, elected by Ada's friends from BLOGS). This doesn't exactly encourage moderate people to take part in student politics though, does it?

This and the mess with the Palestine/Israel groups.

Well after all these years I've just read the Talk Guidelines

You'll all be fucking delighted to know there is nothing in there to stop Ada coming on here and calling us all Cuntscum

However - if we mis-gender him her oh fuck it I give up

We can be deleted and banned.

HQ - whilst you are pondering here

The Cotton Ceiling is NOT about “men” getting into women’s pants, it’s about women born male (i.e. trans women) being seen & accepted as women, equal to cis women
Why is it deliberately called the cotton ceiling to equate women's knickers to the "glass ceiling" at work? The imagery is that "cis"women's knickers are something that need smashing into. It's violent in nature and actually scary to a class of people who are bought up from birth that they are rape able.
Seriously can't believe anyone thinks the cotton ceiling is in any way a reasonable thing. Ugh ugh ugh.

I think I'm going to quietly deregister.

I'm actually feeling strangely let down by the non-committal, woolly stance by MNHQ on this, and although I wasn't on the thread last night I did read it.

Deleting it, and some of the posts on it is censorship of the worst kind and I can't quite bring myself to keep contributing to (and supporting) a site that I think is sailing pretty close to supporting some rotten mysoginist and his apologists.

Thanks to lots of previous posters who've been amazingly supportive to me under other usernames and I am full of admiration for you women who are continuing this argument!

Posting in support. I'm another mother of girls concerned about their future. I think MNHQ answered a different question than was asked! I'm in favour of a Spartacus uprising as Mardy said. It is too important not to call a spade a spade, or indeed a man a man.

And this should be in trending. It has I think deliberately being stopped from being on there.

You and many others i would say wonky. I need to stay for now, because I am finding advice about feeding and sleeping babies, issues with mirena coils, handling being a wohm with 2 under 2 and many other breads of this site really helpful at the moment. Which by the way, are some of the issues i would equate with 'living as a woman'.

*threads

That mumsnet response was the worst example of corporate speak I have ever seen on this site.

YY Bluefolly.

The 'cotton ceiling' is logical only through the lens of male entitlement to sex. People are allowed to refuse to have sex for any reason, even shallow ones.

I can see a woman finding it upsetting if a man didn't want to have sex with them for a reason they believed to be shallow or prejudiced - their weight, say, or a visible disability. I can't imagine any woman then trying to publicly campaign that this was a 'ceiling' that needed to be smashed through and that any man who ruled out certain categories of women as sexual partners needed to be coerced to feel differently. Surely they wouldn't want to have sex with a 'prejudiced' person and would rather find someone who was actually attracted to them.

The 'cotton ceiling' is just men feeling entitled to women's bodies. It's vile.

Cis means that your sex and gender align

What about those of us who are gender critical

That is a fairly major flaw...

Agreed Blue

I am wondering whether there has been an influx of newbies at MNHQ, because there have been some very strange decisions made regarding deletions and now banning? BANNING? Really? For having an opinion?

I was not on the original thread. I do not post on these issues because i am ignorant. But i do read and try to educate myself.

I have always been meh about deletions up until about a week ago, now there seem to be some very extreme reactions from HQ to perfectly reasonable and robust discussions.

MollHackabout
terfisaslur.com
^"cisbians using 'I'm just not attracted to penises'

Except noone is attracted to penises. Noone is attracted to vaginas. Noone is attracted to genitals. You're attracted to the person.

When you first see someone you're attracted to them as a person. You don't know what genitals they have, implying you can tell a trans person from a cis person is cissexist and would force you to admit you are attracted to trans people before you find out they're trans.

So ask yourself why you'd be attracted to a transperson until you find out they're trans or what genitals they have?

Hint. Its because you're a sad little transmisogynist and you deserve to have your teeth beaten in."^

---

Jesus christ, if you click on the cotton ceiling part of that site, it is actually disgusting. I thought views such as this Ada dude would be rare, but it seems not so much. Interestingly its pretty much exclusively towards lesbians too...so basically again, guys trying to bully women into shagging them. I cannot believe this shit exists. Its actually quite disturbing. I feel so sorry for your daughter going through this.

Yy bluefolly

If you say that it is important to you that your partner has a vagina, you risk getting called a vagina fetishist.

brasty

" And this should be in trending. It has I think deliberately being stopped from being on there"

Very interesting

brasty
I think the cotton ceiling is logical. Male people identify as women and lesbians. Other lesbians tell them they see them as women and lesbians. But none of them will have sex with them. Which means the lesbians are lying. They don't really see them as women and lesbians, but are happy to pretend they do. Hence cotton ceiling, you are being transphobic by refusing to have sex with me.

The cotton ceiling is about men with a penis demanding the right to have sex with a lesbian.
Penetrative sex. With a penis.

Apparently I offended my daughters friend who is queer.

I used a female pronoun

I had to apologise

I am too old for this shit

I used to be a sado-masochist, necrophilic into beastiality but I realised I was just flogging a dead horse.