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I spent Monday morning at a BDSM dungeon. AMA

338 replies

DukeOfBurgundy · 12/07/2018 10:21

Anything about BDSM-y stuff, really.

I'd probably describe myself as a sub. Although I'm mostly a masochist. I just like being spanked with stuff really hard.

The "dungeon" was exclusive use for me and my boyfriend from 10-2. Had a lovely time. It's the second time we've been there.

I've done BDSM "clubs" a few times. But I don't get anything from exhibitionism/voyeurism. Just enjoyed the spanking benches etc. Much prefer having the equipment all for our own use.

Ask me anything.

OP posts:
Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 11:08

Would you go on to a thread about boxing training and keep saying why do you. Boxing is awful it makes me uneasy

I see this as different to boxing as it's two equally matched people both fighting each other, with someone refereeing.

I see one person being naked, tied down, hit hard with heavy implements for a prolonged period, as something very different indeed.

Gorgon yes this is my fear. The person being hurt like this is always in some way messed up or vulnerable.

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 11:15

Boxing may involve two people evenly matched in weight & size, but that doesn't mean they are matched in skill or strength.

Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 11:17

No, i agree, but it's a fair fight in comparison to one person being held down and effectively beaten. I can't see the two as remotely comparable. In addition boxing has a referee in place overseeing it.

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 11:21

But the being 'held down & beaten' only happens because the sub allows it. Everything happens because the sub wants it to happen. I guess physically it isn't a fair match, but psychologically as a sub I still hold the control. I know that if at any point i want to stop - for any reason - i can without question. Even knowing that DP is much, much stronger than me physically nothing happens unless i'm happy for it to happen

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 11:25

Boxing is basically two people giving each other consent to try & knock each other out for entertainment. And money!

MiniTheMinx · 17/07/2018 11:30

I'm in agreement with Gorgon. I have never been on the scene. I do though know others who have and are. I have read here and elsewhere all about how wonderful it is, all about safe words, safe, sane, consensual, all about other people's experiences, I've read the usual narrative "the sub has all the power" and I call bullshit on it.

A guy I know would be many subs dream Dom, wealthy, erudite, very very clever, intellectual and very sadistic. He told me he does it because it's a legal way to get the high he needs to get off. He likes subjecting women to pain. He gets off on seeing women suffer. He can sadistically get off on causing real harm and it's legal. He's not a nice man. He's a charismatic man.

Some people are forced to top from the bottom because, it certainly fits the narrative "the sub has all the power" it's so ridiculous. If the sub has all the power then no one's getting off. What sort of mental gymnastics is involved in saying day is night. It's not authentic.

Limits......well people talk of soft and hard limits. Soft limits can be pushed, hard limits not so.....error sadist will only get off if he's pushing you or there is a real possibility of pushing you beyond your limits. If something has a limit, it's limited, you can't have two limits differentiated by the same thing.....a limit. It's either a hard limit or no limit. It's like saying a boundary can be found in two places, it's either a boundary or it isn't. So a soft limit can not exist, it is impossible. So, you can't be authentic, you play. That's where the idea comes from. You have a scene, you play.ike you played tea parties and learned to negotiate the narrative. Except playing is not authentic and as stated above sadists get off on causing pain, and subspace isn't something you play at being in!

Safe, sane, consensual. It's often not safe mentally, physically or emotionally. Sane, well it's not because it requires people to tie their heads in knots. Consensual, see above above about limits. Plus if it's a well worked out Scene, scripted to within an inch it's inauthentic and rather dull. But sadists don't like scripts they like inflicting real harm, pushing a limit (and ultimately there is only one limit....a hard limit) is not sticking to the script of a scene. Only by breaking the agreement can a sadist get off.

The community is full of people tying their own heads in knots, it's full of contradictions and double speak.

I am interested though in why Bluntness keeps saying hit with heavy objects. I have no doubt some might go in for it, but I'd say that's very weird and extreme. Short, burning, searing, stinging sensations yes, being clobbered with a heavy blunt object......weird.

Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 11:36

I am saying it because that's what's the op posted she liked on the second page.

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 11:39

There are always exceptions. To everything. There will be vulnerable subs who do things because they feel they HAVE to. There will be dom(me)s who do it because they enjoy hurting people. But that can be said about the reasoning behind everything surely? Some people become police officers to help society...some do it because they like the power behind the authority. Some people become nurses because they want to help...history shows us some do it because they get a thrill out of killing vulnerable people. Do we say based on that that all police officers or nurses are arseholes?

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 11:41

Your friend isn't a dom. He's a bastard.

Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 11:47

Do we say based on that that all police officers or nurses are arseholes?

This isn't a logical argument. Bad police officers and nurses are the exception rather than the rule. But sure they exist.

No one is saying someone who likes to be hit is an arsehole. What is being asked is are these people who are having the extreme violence perpetrated on them mentally well, or are they primarily vulnerable and damaged.

No one is also saying the sadist who enjoys inflicting pain is an arsehole either. They are though saying that they are sadists who enjoy inflicting pain on someone who doesn't fight back and that it's concerning that the people who like to be hurt are disputing this, that they think these people are only doing it to them because it gives the person being hurt pleasure. There seems to be a mental block accepting they are with a sadist who enjoys inflicting pain on them and gets off on it.

Of the two, the concern is with the one being hurt.

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 11:52

The misconception is that the one being dominant is abusive & the one being submissive is being abused. That's what flies out from posts here from people who haven't engaged in bdsm & don't understand it.
There is a huge difference between someone who, as a pp friend, actively enjoys hurting another person for the sake of hurting them, and someone who does so for the mutual enjoyment the interaction brings.

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 11:56

If someone whacked me in any other circumstance i'd lamp them back (unless i was sparko obviously!). Nobody has the right to touch me unless i give them that right. For me, when DP & I play it is empowering for me. It gives me a confidence outside too which is hard to explain but comes from the security of being able to fully submit indoors.

Bdsm is a hard thing to explain to somebody who has never even entertained the idea. When i first started exploring it my head would scream at me 'no chance, this isn't normal' because society told me it was abusive/wrong/unnatural. Yet my body would react & tell me something completely different. Again, akin to jumping out of a plane i guess

Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 11:57

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mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 12:14

Ime they enjoy the result as opposed to the concept of beating somebody. If they hit somebody & got a negative response they would stop...someone who admits they enjoy beating women wouldn't care what response they got, it wouldn't change their pleasure levels either way.

I think it's wrong to assume that anyone who is submissive in a bdsm setting is damaged or mentally broken. Do we assume anybody who chases an adrenaline rush in other ways is damaged? So anybody who rides a horse, or a motorbike for example...they do so because of the thrill & enjoyment it gives but ultimately both activities could kill them. Contact sports as another example...done for the adrenaline & excitement but again potentially dangerous. Nobody bats an eyelid because these are done willingly, the participant chooses the risk. Yes in some bdsm settings choice is potentially eroded, but that isn't a generic rule. On any thread about bdsm on here you get people putting forward their positive experiences of the sub/dom dynamic & people still jump to 'you're broken/being coerced/abused'

MiniTheMinx · 17/07/2018 12:45

Bluntness, there are Ds who are not sadists and some who are, and there are people who are primarily just sadists. The guy I mentioned is primarily a sadist. He gets a sexual kick out of inflicting pain. There are people who get a kick out of being in pain. They are ideally suited. Fucked up in so.e way or no way at all, they are suited.

As for Ds dynamics, and certain practices that cause some degree of pain or even mild discomfort, mentally or physically. It's all about the submission. I asked DP, do you like causing pain. He went very quiet. He felt conflicted. He said " no I don't, but I get excited by it because of your submission to me" he gets off on the fact I trust him in a way no one else can. I make myself vulnerable to him in a way no one else can and as a result he sees me, as I really am, and he feels powerful and he feels protective of me. I think that often it's about causing pain because it's about pushing the boundaries to see if that trust and submission is still be granted.

Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 12:46

I don't think anyone is assuming they are broken or damaged, but asking the very valid question.

I think also in sports with an adrenaline rush being hurt is a risk, not the basic premise.

What I can see is an almost wholesale rejection of the idea that the person hurting them likes doing it. When it has to be a given they do.

But the argument is they are only hurting them in this manner as it brings pleasure to the person being beaten. I don't believe this is an altruistic act but I understand why folks wouldn't want to think someone is hurting them to get pleasure. I get why it's hard to accept. Although it's glaringly obvious that's the truth of it. I'm sorry.

The arguments are also not cohesive. In one breath we are told it's about handing over control, in the next it's the sub in control. Which is it. If you hand over control, you're no longer in control. I get the trust thing though, that you trust the person won't hurt you more than you say you will allow. But that's about all I get. If you need a safe word, the. It's because there is a high chance you're not safe and the person hurting you will go too far. Why? Because they enjoy it. If it was just about the subs pleasure safe words wouldn't be needed.

Also arguments like I get pleasure from it, but need to be soothed, calmed and made to feel safe after are contradictory. Someone who needs to be soothed, calmed, made to feel safe, is someone who has just gone through something traumatic. Not someone who has just had great pleasure and is basking in the afterglow.

The more I question it, the more it seems something is very wrong with this scene when it moves to extremes.

Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 12:48

He felt conflicted. He said " no I don't, but I get excited by it because of your submission to me"

I'm sorry but this in any language translates to yes, it excites me. I am sorry, but you can submit in many ways without causing pain of hitting someone.

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 13:03

After i did my abseil i needed calming, because the adrenaline was incredibly intense. Was the abseil traumatic? Perhaps...i still booked in to do it again because everything i experienced made me feel incredible. It was a positive experience.

You don't have to apologise for not getting it. If you've never experienced it then it is probably a head fuck to think people genuinely enjoy it without any ulterior mumbo jumbo going on. I don't get why anybody would box, to me that is the stupidest position to put yourself in! But i accept that for boxers - and spectators - they gain something from it I simply can't grasp.

DP enjoys whacking me with a belt...does he enjoy the actual act of hitting me? He must do, but he enjoys the reaction more. Which is a pleasurable reaction not a scared or pained one. Someone who enjoys hitting a person to get that sort of reaction isn't doing it in the spirit of bdsm...they're wankers pure & simple imo. The mindset is different.

Many contact sports the expectation is that someone will get hurt. And bdsm isn't all about pain...as someone mentioned above, you can be hit in such a way that it doesn't hurt. It depends what you prefer.

Sarahlou63 · 17/07/2018 13:13

@MiniTheMinx " I have never been on the scene." Nuff said.

mustbemad17 · 17/07/2018 13:23

Bluntness we have a safe word because DP pushes my boundaries within our agreed activities. Obviously i can only speak for us there, because i trust implicitly that his goal isn't to hurt me, it is to provide pleasure. I can't guarantee he won't, but then i can't guarantee much in life. He watches my reactions, he reads what my body is telling him & he acts accordingly. Sometimes i don't want to go beyond a certain point, & my safe word is me telling him without question that enough is enough. That point changes every time depending on several variables

bananafish81 · 17/07/2018 13:46

But in both you accept that the person who is hurting someone is enjoying doing it? That if they were not allowed to hurt them they would move on to find someone else who would let them hurt them? That's not disputed right?

I'm not sure that isn't disputed? Posters are talking here about engaging in D/s with their partners, in sex they both find enjoyable. Seems a bit of a presumption to go on to assume that because a couple can enjoy mutually pleasurable D/s sex together, that this means that the dom partner would simply dump the sub partner if they weren't up for it. There's usually more to a loving partnership than JUST D/s sex, unless you're living a 24/7 D/s lifestyle

The dom might not have been a dom until that relationship when they met their partner and discovered that submission was what turned them on

Someone that enters a relationship, finds that their partner enjoys BDSM, and experiments with D/s to please their partner, and finds that they enjoy the activities because they please their partner....

.... It seems that you're making it very black and white, suggesting that anyone in a dom role is a sadist and they are just looking for unsuspecting people to whack with a flogger

MiniTheMinx · 17/07/2018 14:37

"nuff said"

Really, I could say a lot more. A boundary or a limit can not exist in two places at once. It can be moved, but it can occupy only one space. The limit is the 'hard' limit. It's philosophically impossible for it to be anything else.

I know two men who were on the scene, one the sadist and the other a man who consented to have his girlfriend get him on the floor and kick him. Both liked to "play" and like having scenes with 'friends' one was quite frankly probably very good at what he did if you wanted to be hurt, the other had been sexually abused as a child. So yeah, the scene. I have one friend who is so sweet and she's quite vulnerable, she's been round the scene for a long time trying to find one good man, she's still looking.

Like I said, whether you read about, talk about in RL or online it all boils down to a lot of people using the same terms, acronyms and descriptions. In the same way one might discuss a scene and follow it, everyone appears to have swallowed a script. This serves to obscure people's real motivations. The typical one is "the sub has the power" it then follows "he/she does this for my pleasure" if you have then what are you gaining by saying "I'll give it to you, but I've still got it" saying and doing are two different things. Doing and playing are two different things too. Would a real Dominant want to hear "well darling I'll let you play at having power and I'll pretend to submit to you" each to their own but I can't play at submission, and I'd not want to submit to Keith in accounts who wants to be a part time playtime Dom on Saturdays.

This echo chamber that says "I have the power, he does it for my pleasure" simply turns the act of submission into its opposite. Fine if your a person who can live with illusiin, but it's not authentic. But more worrying it probably obscures a lot of real abuse that occurs, or at the very least allows the sadist I mentioned to get pleasure from abusing people. He doesn't want you to submit in the classical terms of the agreement, he just wants to hurt you, intact if he had your permission he'd gain little from it. So although you might think "this is sane, safe and consensual because I've got the power" he thinks "I will push to the extreme because it's at precisely the point it's too unbearable (that limit) that you begin to suffer and I begin to get off"

Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 15:11

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Bluntness100 · 17/07/2018 15:19

DP enjoys whacking me with a belt...does he enjoy the actual act of hitting me? He must do, but he enjoys the reaction more

This is just so disturbing, it really is. 😔

bananafish81 · 17/07/2018 15:22

That's really the definition of messed up, of course they aren't, of course they enjoy hitting you, hurting you, that is what rhey get out of it. To believe otherwise, shows something is very askew here. It's emotional manipulation as well as the physical attacks that are occurring.

Do you believe that everyone who buys some handcuffs and a paddle or whip from Ann Summers or Lovehoney is committing abuse by one partner causing pain to the other, whilst they're tied up and the other partner is in control. That's a lot of people

You can easily cause red marks or bruising with a single thwack of a cane or crop. Where in your mind is the line between these mild kink fun with more hard-core BDSM? Are both unacceptable? Where is the line between acceptable and unacceptable if not?

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