Why on earth would anyone reject SPGS??

[newsibling123]

I've been reading through many threads with mums wondering between SPGS and G&L.

While G&L is a great school, why on Earth would there be a conflict in choosing SPGS, they applied in the first place, its not like they got cold called by the school and their DD offered a place!

If we applied to SPGS, we'd put G&L as back up, but if we had two offers there's no question we'd choose SPGS. The only way I can imagine conflict is if G&L offered a scholarship, or DD really didn't want to go SPGS, even then we would try and show her what a brilliant opportunity it was.

I know one chooses the best school for the DC, etc etc, but I can't imagine any scenario, all things being equal, how G&L would be 'better'. If DD was heavily tutored and parent was worried she'd struggle at SPGS now they have offer in hand, then G&L doesn't come to mind as an alternative to that! One of the less intense GDST schools or somewhere with broader selection, less high academic like Portland or More House maybe?

Don't mean to offend anyone here, choosing school is tough, but I just don't get this at all...It's like getting a place at Oxford and choosing Durham

I bet some people choose Durham over Oxford. Because they want to? Or thats where they feel more comfortable or will be a better fit?

I went to University with lots of women from SPGS. It’s very high powered and pressured and the women I met had clearly been affected by this. I’m a teacher in a fairly academic independent school and I think that I could easily imagine turning down SPGS if I felt it wasn’t right for my child.

I know if people who have turned down Oxbridge places for far 'lesser' unis. Schools are very much about what is best for each individual child and I can think of numerous reasons why other schools may be picked.
Cost
Location
Commute
Subject choice
Extra curricular
Specific sport preference
Ethos/approach
Gut feeling

This is why people apply for more than one school

While SPGS is an academic powerhouse there really isn’t any difference in academic outcomes for a bright child going to one vs the other. It’s just more prestigious.

So if you put that to one side, the schools have very different reputations (fairly or unfairly) regarding pastoral care, the parenting culture, mental health, and general feel.

While someone might be okay with sending a child to SPGS it won’t necessarily be their first choice.

Personally, based on the very public comments the former head made about the parents at the school when she was still in post, I’d be very nervous about SPGS. I’ve also heard mixed things from some parents with girls who recently graduated though of course there are plenty who are very happy.

I’d pick G&L over SPGS as I also like the IB programme.

There is academic research that it is better to be a big fish in a small pond, than a small fish in a big pond.

For Oxbridge entrance, I would expect the same individual to have a better chance being one of the top of the year at G&L, versus middle of the year at SPGS. Oxford benchmark candidates on how they compare to their peers at the same school. It would be hard to shine at SPGS.

They might decide they want Co-Ed, they might decide the commute is too much, they might have been put off during the application process, they might decide they want a school with uniform, they might just prefer another school, they might decide the fees are too much?
I always hear ‘noone ever turns down SPGS’. I know girls who’ve chosen LU, Tiffin, LEH, PHS and WHS as well as G&L over SPGS. It’s a great school, but there are lots of other great schools!

TBH, we were quite sad when rejected by SPGS. But luckily DD got offers from GL & LU. I think we were probably not that sad if we got the offers before the rejection. Actually I'm quite happy that we don't have to choose between SPGS & GL as we don't have very strong feels for either. I think DD would achieve her academic best in either of these schools.

It happens quite frequently actually. On the boys side for instance, thousands have turned down the likes of Eton, Winchester,Harrow,Westminster, St Paul's et al.

Now DD said she prefers co-ed

No idea about the schools you're talking about but I got offered an Oxbridge place and chose to go to Durham. Best decision I ever made!

LOL.

OP, maybe take a few deep breaths and calm yourself before trying not to offend people and then writing off other institutions as inferior.

(I have no skin in the game… but I can think of any number of reasons why people make different pro-active choices)

What if a prolific bully was going to the better school?

What if you were concerned about children killing themselves under heavy pressure?

I don’t know if these are state or private, but what if you were so rich that you could prioritise your child’s happiness and fun experience over the worry of getting the best education.

I know someone who turned a Cambridge place down. It definitely happens.

I went to Durham and met around five-ten people who rejected Oxford/Cambridge in favour of Durham!

Reasons were like the below:

Liked the city better
Liked the course/colleges better
Didn't want the pressure of Oxbridge
Oxford was too far away

There really is more to life than the reputation of an institution. Even though one of them is regarded as more prestigious, that doesn't mean it will suit every single individual.

My niece turned down SPGS. They just put it on the list, but it was not the number 1 choice.
I do remember the former Head publicity criticising the school. She was disillusioned, she left.
I also remember a story about how some of the girls would literary pass out from not getting 100% on exams.

I know several people who have turned down Oxbridge too. Mostly to go to Unis that have a better reputation on, or specialise in specific subjects. One person went to Durham for the opportunity to write some of those curriculum books they publish.

It's like getting a place at Oxford and choosing Durham

That's an abysmally bad analogy and plain wrong.

Standards at Oxford are hugely better than at Durham. Oxford teaches harder courses, provides more hours/smaller groups of teaching/marking, leads to very markedly higher graduate earnings, gives a far higher chance of 1st class honours/of funded postgraduate study. And Oxford is certainly harder to get in - the very weakest students at Oxford [possibly excluding the odd choral scholar, boat race ringer, etc] would be well above average at Durham.

Standards at these two schools are near as damnit identical.
Before grade inflation went bonkers, the two had almost identical proportions of A* proportions (52% vs 46%) - so the top 46% at G&L were objectively stronger than the bottom 48% at SPGS.

It's trivially easy to imagine geographical, cultural, or a whole host of other considerations leading a parent to prefer G&L to SPGS.

Maybe people are more focussed on finding the school that best fits their DD than some ridiculous idea that somehow SPGS is so unbelievably better than every single other school in the UK?

The fact that these posters are asking the question means that they are questioning something about SPGS that makes them feel an alternative school might be better i.e. it's not the Holy Grail you are making it out to be.

You come across as quite rude and condescending to be honest.

It's not about the most prestigious, well ranked school. It's about putting your child first and finding the perfect fit for her.

In the same way, you'd be ridiculous to ship your child off to Oxford if they preferred and wanted to go to Durham.

Prestige is not everything. In fact, I've unfortunately seen the downside of children who are pushed into situations and environments they do not feel comfortable in because their parents thought they knew best, and best just happened to be the most prestigious. It's actually really sad.

I probably could have gone to Oxford but chose York
In Freshers week I met loads of people who had put a York as 2nd choice but ended up there after not getting into Oxbridge. They were slightly confused about someone actually deciding NOT to apply and probably thought I wasn’t academic enough so they were even more confused by my excellent A level grades
You choose for yourself/your child the school or college/uni that suits them best. DD turned down a 6th form Grammar place for a local HE college as well and despite being very academic she might not even go to Uni

@puffyisgood

Ok UCL and Oxford is probably a more accurate analogy- but the point remains I couldn’t imagine interviewing at Oxford getting an offer then rejecting it, why apply ? That’s my point - all the posts here make perfect sense but not really in the sense they applied and got in. I can perfectly understand parents believing SPGS isn’t right for their daughter , and not applying , but those with doubts and yet they put them through the selection process anyway??

@Hoppinggreen

I get that, you didn’t apply Oxford , but you must admit to give up a place offered for somewhere else makes one a very rare student .

I get it if people get cold feet , the stark reality from the heady days of interviews and the offer of a place , careful what one wishes for and all that. But even that suggests they were going through selection with eyes half open?

We didn't apply to SPGS for DD as we just didn't like the vibe and I stress sent her to one of the local GDST with a nice scholarship schools. I can't say for certain that she'd have got a place of course but we felt it wouldn't have been right for her. She also got a place at Tiffin, which we turned down.

Turned out OK, she's just got an offer from Oxford to read medicine. SPGS is a great school I'm sure but it's not the only great school and definitely not the best school for everyone.

@newsibling123 do you have children and have you applied for schools yet?

Parents might apply for SPGS even if its not their first choice because if they didn't get their preferred option they would still potentially go to SPGS as a fallback.

As odd as it sounds, there are many instances of children getting into higher league table schools and being rejected by ones that are perceived to be easier to get into. Parents are just spreading the bets to have as many options as possible.

[quote newsibling123]@puffyisgood

Ok UCL and Oxford is probably a more accurate analogy- but the point remains I couldn’t imagine interviewing at Oxford getting an offer then rejecting it, why apply ? That’s my point - all the posts here make perfect sense but not really in the sense they applied and got in. I can perfectly understand parents believing SPGS isn’t right for their daughter , and not applying , but those with doubts and yet they put them through the selection process anyway??

@Hoppinggreen

I get that, you didn’t apply Oxford , but you must admit to give up a place offered for somewhere else makes one a very rare student .

I get it if people get cold feet , the stark reality from the heady days of interviews and the offer of a place , careful what one wishes for and all that. But even that suggests they were going through selection with eyes half open?[/quote]
The Oxbridge analogy is just terrible. Well over 90% of the population doesn't have the beginning of a clue about how SPGS, G&L etc rank against each other. Of the remaining less than 10%, many or most don't care. Oxbridge is a cut above the other universities in a way that no school comes close to being, not least because all schools primarily put pupils through the exact same set of public exams, with the vast majority of perfect marks come from outside the so-called 'elite schools'. An A from SPGS is worth no more than an A from your local comp & could conceivably one day [though I won't hold my breath] be worth less.

As regards applying and then dropping out etc: Covid has shone a light on this and a comparison with university applications does the same - it's really incredibly wasteful and silly for so many of the private schools to all have their own slightly different assessment tests and criteria etc. It's beyond obvious that admissions could be run just as well based entirely on a combination of performance in a single nationally standardised test or series of such tests. Applying for half a dozen private schools could easily be as straightforward as applying for half a dozen universities through UCAS. But we're a very long way from that ever happening. Until such time as it does, parents can't really be blamed for the current trend of over-applying, keeping options open, and making final decisions at the last minute.