Please add your support for an independent Scotland

[grumplass]

Please comment on this thread to indicate how many supporters of independence are on Scotsnet.
Please do not post if you do not support.

EU for me every time.

Currency question: if you speak to people from countries that went through adopting the Euro, it’s hard then fine.

Not ideal. Nothing is ideal right now. I don’t know what’s best.

Grumplass yes- it's draining and I think just leave them be but then I think- I've got children and too many soak up the misinformation from the UK Government.

Diplidocus You've obviously never been on an independence march, have you? Tonnes of banners with English and Scottish flags joined together. And * gasp we sing flower of Scotland together. Why? Because it doesn't matter where you're born. Tbh I find unionists obsession with the anti English bollocks weird. Why not anti Welsh? Anti Irish? I mean I know it's because the Tory press put out the message with the aim of influencing English Scots and prevent them voting for independence but surely most are aware of this tactic?

Also your comment re multiculturalism- Scotland was the first in the UK to offer a home to refugees caught up in the recent crisis. The SG gov are also fighting against the dawn raids / taking people out their homes and putting them in hotels * this is being done by the UK Gov to save money as its cheaper than paying landlords.

You cannot - Can you describe point 3 a bit more please? There's no issues travelling down Ireland so I'm not sure what you're getting at re jobs/ movement etc. Thanks

@Scotslassie1
From what I've seen, the Irish border question has been extremely difficult to solve, and I'm not sure we're there yet. There are also various employment/regulatory difficulties that could arise should Scotland be in the EU while the UK has left it. From Jan 1st, EU citizens will need to get a Visa to work in the UK, and this obviously needs to be discussed as a society as currently we all take granted our ability to live and work anywhere in the UK.

@Y0uCann0tBeSer10us
In regard to your Q3, I think we can assume that EU membership would confer freedom of movement. It really would be up to the rUK to decide what was on offer in terms of travel, jobs etc. I would imagine it would be similar to the Irish offer.

@grumplass
I'm a scientist and I prefer facts to assumptions, especially given how volatile the world currently is. Technically, EU citizens are subject to the points based immigration system from next year, and as you say it would be up to Westminster to give us some kind of special deal. If the talks turn nasty and they don't, we stand to lose a lot of opportunity we take for granted currently, and this needs to be discussed openly.

@Y0uCann0tBeSer10us until the 1990s the IRA was at war with the Uk state and a ceasefire was declared at the time of the Good Friday agreement.
This depends on EU membership so basically that's why the Irish border has caused such a nightmare.
Previously there were armed checkpoints etc.
However goods and services have always travelled with relative freedom between Ireland and the rest of the Uk. Irish people have been able to work and travel freely.
Despite the tariffs and work permits I think Irish people will retain an aspect of their privileged position. This was mooted as part of the Westminster agreement but who knows where we are now with Brexit. But I have a suspicion it will stay as England buys so much of its staple food from Ireland and I think we might be in the same situation.

I was just going to write that- the UK Gov refused to protect what was put in place through the Good Friday Government. The EU feel it is important so there was no agreement between the two.

@Y0uCann0tBeSer10us being scared that Westminster won't be generous to us is default mode- crumbs from the table.

To be honest if you have the skills that are needed by employers you will be able to travel and work and this will be the same after Brexit- your employers will enable it.
So it shouldn't be a huge worry.
I would rather have access to the EU for opportunities for our young people.
But I do think England will let us travel freely in a home nations agreement.

I believe that the current issue surrounding the Irish border is more to do with schengen which all new member states to the EU need to join which if Scotland did do so would lead to an equally problematic border issue.

Yes

The 'huge' Scottish tech gaming industry - did it make up for failing oil prices? How strong will the Scottish gaming industry be if we tax high earners a lot more and stop the tax breaks to tech companies? Tech is endlessly portable at the programming and design side. The tech reliance on intellectual capital not natural resources is why every country is throwing money trying to build their tech sector.

EU funding isn't going to equate to UK funding.

Annon bit of a weird comment..we have lots of other sectors of our economy- renewables, food and drink , tourism, finance . It's just one of many and was written in response to pp comment re tech skills / jobs on Scotland. Intellectual capital requirement is stating the bloody obvious and something which is very well done here.

Nicola sturgeon is asking Westminster for more money only today.

Who will she ask to help if she gets her way?

@justgeton
You missed the bit about borrowing then....

@anon444877
www.sasa.gov.uk/seed-ware-potatoes/potato-exports
This is worth approx £113 million.

I live in england but im in favour of scottish independence

@justgeton
We will keep our assets within Scotland and not be handing money to WM to get a fraction back and we will have our own ability to borrow.
Scotland has a vast amount of resources, we do not need to be beholding to England, but if we are such a drain as so many think do you think WM are clinging on out of the goodness of their hearts to help us??

Tech is something that is very well done in many places due to intellectual capital being the main requirement is the point @Scotslassie1 - I mentioned tech because you mentioned it.

I'm going to leave this now - there's clearly some support for independence on scotsnet and clearly others that can't see the huge unknowns and known negatives make it worth the gamble.

For those saying things might be difficult for a few years - how many is a few? Is it like Rees-Mogg's fifty years for the uk to recover from Brexit? Because that's not only the rest of my life, it's most of the life of the next generation, and the working life of at least the next generation after that.

I would happily live through this with the prospect of better for future generations because at the minute we're living through it anyway with no hope of it being better in the next 50 years probably be worse the way things are going

Thank you to everyone who posted on here! It was great to see you and even to have some debate ( although not technically asked for)
I'm going to sign off here now and head away for some more relaxing threads 🍁🎃🍂

Me!

I’m always perplexed when there is such anti independence vitriol on Mumsnet.

In my mind it doesn’t ‘fit’ with the overall mindset/ethos of the site.

Not even that there are differences of opinion but that the unionists here are so venomous towards nationalists.

And it’s only one way traffic that I’ve seen.

@justgeton

Nicola sturgeon is asking Westminster for more money only today.

Who will she ask to help if she gets her way?

No. She was saying that the Westminster Government can borrow money from whoever they want but the Scottish government aren't allowed to. The only source of extra funding available to Holyrood is the UK treasury, whereas the Tory party can have a quick drinkie with whichever Russian oligarch they are brownnosing and get a bung - with strings. That Scotland will be expected to contribute to paying off somewhere down the line.

Nicola sturgeon is asking Westminster for more money only today.

The Scottish Govt is asking the combined United Kingdom Govt for more spending towards the devolved issues. This money is to come from the joint pot of UK borrowed money which Scotland will be involved in paying back.

There @justgeton I fixed it for you.

Did anyone see Douglas Ross lying again on the above point? The amount is to cover everything in Scotland ( transport, health, education , everything) and he's keeps saying why are you not giving the full amount to businesses bad snp.. whilst knowing full well the £ needs to cover everything. He also said that's all Scotland's getting and it'll need to do ( despite SG economists saying it'snot enoughdue to furlough ending and the announcement for the replacementof furlough not applying here ( chancellor of the exchequers decision).
Such a f ed up situation where you have an mp who doesn't have any interest in applying his power and asking his bosses to help the country he is supposed to work for. And continually lies with the sole purpose of making the SG look bad, zero interest in actually putting in place a post furlough scheme.