Yes it's another cliched 'he's having an affair' thread - HELP!!!

[MaggieMuggins]

So, after trawling MN relationship threads for the last hour I can see that everything I am about to say is so 'classic' it's untrue

DH and I have been together for 14 years, married for 4 and DD is 15 months. I became suspicious that he was having an affair before Xmas - we have had the 'I'm just not very happy at the moment' conversation - and after a bit of snooping and a few pennies dropping I confronted him last night and told him that I knew there was something going on with him and his teaching assistant. (An interesting take on the boss-secretary cliche, no?)

I also told him that part of the reason that I'd been able to work it out was because the year before we decided to have a baby one of my own work colleagues had told me that they had fallen for me, and I had an emotional affair with him. Nothing really happened, and I worked through it all alone (it was the year that DH was doing his teacher training and I was at a really low ebb, very flattered by the attention but ultimately it was never going to go anywhere).

Anyway, he admitted that they had grown close (says they haven't kissed, but 'sort of' told each other that they have feelings). He also admitted that he had met her on Saturday when he went out for the afternoon, but says that they just met up and wandered round the shops. I think I believe him.

Anyway, DH and I have had a crap sex life for years and never really dealt with it. We are like two best friends sharing the same house/parenting. I have tried so many times over the years to talk to him about it but he's just buried his head in the sand, told me he loves me, ignored the problem. I would desperately love for us to get that spark back, and I can't cope with the lack of physical affection for much longer.

He says he doesn't know what he wants - before Xmas he was convinced he wanted to leave, but now he's not sure. Doesn't know how he feels about this OW. I've told him that he MUST talk to a friend, that's the one thing he has agreed to do. I told him I want to go to counselling but he said he needs time to think first.

I feel completely bereft and terrified of losing him. I am also angry that he has done this to me when I need him so much right now (am at threat of redundnacy at work, just to add insult to injury) and I am feeling physically unattractive and knackered from working full time and dealing with motherhood and trying to get to the gym and trying to have a social life and trying to keep the house nice. When we had DD I thought I had everything I wanted. What a complacent fool I have been.

Awww - thans AF. Coming from you etc etc

Maggie I don't blame you for trying to play it cool, not make ultimatums etc in the short term. Just don't spend too much of your life treading on eggshells, feeling insecure, trying not to rock the boat. As AF says its hugely damaging to your self esteem and also relationships have to built on stronger foundations than just preserving the status quo.

I hope he really opens up to this friend rather than just takes the opportunity to get away from it all and have a beer. Good luck.

I would still make sure I phone his mum's house.

I will definitely ring his mum's house! Even though I am not worried that he won't be there. I am also hoping that his mum can talk some sense into him. I want to make sure she is aware that this is going on.

I'm going to arrange some counselling for myself. If he won't come then at least I will have some professional help dealing with the fact that the love of my life is behaving like a selfish dick.

good luck x

You won't want to hear this, but here goes. My situation is EXACTLY the same as yours. No sex marriage, but lots of love and fun and friendship and we did sweep it under the carpet. My husband had an affair 1 year after we married and after 2 or 3 very painful months we got back together and I did learn to trust him again. What I lost though was self respect for myself - I always felt I had done all the work in rebuilding our relationship and he had 'seen sense' rather than desperately wanting me back. Fast forward, we have two beautiful children aged 2 and 4 and low, what has happened? He has had another affair, left me when littlest one was just 1 and now keeps coming back and forth and is 'confused'. And you know what? I STILL want him back, not because I can't get by without him, but because I am remembering what we had and what we have to look forward to - like you. However, I have been too much of a doormat and allowed him to play out his crisis with me as a sounding board. If I could act with hindsight, I would have chucked him out and cut him off completely - not because he's a wanker but because the emotional roller coaster has no doubt been harder than a clean break would have been. However, Iknow I did all I could to protect teh family and the marriage, and it still wasn't enough. He won't have that luxury next time he feels regret. Here's what I would do if I were you - have a real heart to heart, let him know how much you love him and want it to work, but tell him you can't stand by while he choses. It is for the best that he moves out and sorts his own head out without you, and if he misses you, he will see sense. Then you can start on the counselling and work towards building a marriage that isn't just about babies and friendship. Don't rush anything is my advice. Well done you for perservering and giving him a choice = lots of women wouldn't. If you give a taste of what life is like without you, then he will be much clearer in what he decides and though it will be horrible for you nodoubt, it won't be ALL horrible - you will have more time to yourself to chill and decide if the relationship is really worth it, plus get used to being on your own with your babe. I;ve done it with two little ones, and although I would love the whole family thing, it's actually much easier on your own once you get into a routine than you think it will be, and once he sees you coping and having a life of your own, it will unsettle him for sure. Hopefully he will realise what he is missing once all the routine stuff is out of his life and he will realise where his bread is buttered. These men, honestly, the more I hear, the more I am convinced we are better off without them. Stay strong, eat chocolate, drink wine with your friends and look after yourself. Donh't spend too much time feeling sorry for yourself -life is very cruel sometimes but it's how we cope with things that's important. You are not just a wife, you have been let down badly so now it's time to find yourself once again. Sorry, I've had a glass of wine and am rambling. Good luck pet, I really hope he sees what a selfish prick he is being and steps back into line!

very good post, cheryl, and I am sorry it came so much from your heart, and your experience

Another thing to think on is that (speaking as someone whose H and the OW had exactly the same jobs and working relationship - hope I haven't given away too much about RL now on these boards for people to rumble me) - he has fallen for her as she is his little helper. Unlike you (rightly busy with dc, which he should understand, yet probably resents), she panders to his every need and is like his servant while he feels like the bright sun she revolves around.

It's very flattering and doubtless he has idealised the rest of her to fit this(my OW turned out to be a pathologically lying nutter - see countless threads passim - and while the signs were there early on he chose to ignore thwem as it didn't fit his view of her then). Doubt she'll have as many faults as that but the fact is you are competing with an illusion of perfection presently. Somehow you have to burst that bubble. And if he does come back, he changes school asap - even if he has to take on supply work till he finds a new place. So I agree with AF - send him off and see if he chooses to come back. Again, real time with her will make him see her as she really is.

after you have sent him off to be with her, would you really beable to take him back? I dont know that I could free him in the hope he would come back.

I don't think you should be waiting to see what he wants. You should be deciding what you want. He lost all rights to decide if will stay or go when he started seeing another woman in an inappropriate way for a married man.

However, did he know about your emotional affair? If he did and has forgiven you and moved on, then you owe him the same but it has to be with clear ground rules.

Aw Ab...I was concerned when I saw this thread, as I thought it would bring back memories. Suspect you're spot on about the attraction.

It's interesting how Maggie's RL friend is saying the opposite to most of us on here - I wonder has she walked in our shoes? I honestly think giving betrayers a very stark choice is like throwing a bucket of water over their fantasy life - so many people think they don't have to make a choice at all, until it all hits the fan.

Similarly, I really hope the DH's friend in this thread isn't of the "you only live once" variety - what's needed here is someone who loves them both and who can be honest enough to tell Maggie's H that he could be ruining his life for a fantasy.

How are things today Maggie?

Hi all, thanks for still posting and being there for me, even when I am off MN for nearly a whole day!!

Cheryllou, really appreciate the advice coming from someone who has been through such a similar situation.

Abedelia, I am SURE that you are right about the attraction thing. I saw a photo of them in a group at their Xmas do 2008 and she was gazing at him adoringly; you can write the scenario from there, really! Although I think it developed after I went back to work full time, prob about 3 months ago, obviously there has been an attraction there from her side for a while.

I have decided to tell him that when he comes back on Sunday I will be expecting some sort of resolution. He needs to know that he can't come back and dither and I will make it clear that this is the time he is being allowed to think things through. I won't tell him this now, but unless he agrees to counselling, getting her moved from his classroom and giving me 100% commitment to our marriage then I will expect him to move out.

Fab, sorry I forgot to answer your question about my emotional affair. No, he didn't know about it until I told him about it when I confronted him the other day. He hasn't really asked me a lot about it and seems too wrapped up in himself to care, but I am sure we will have to resolve both mine and his if we are going to stay together and move on from this.

WhenwillIfeelnormal, my RL advice is coming from someone who was in a similar marriage to mine and urging me to go for counselling because she and he H didn't and ended up divorcing. There were affairs but they were never discovered and so not really dealt with.

The friend my H is going to see has had a lot of marriage problems but has seemingly come through the other side, after moving out at his wife's request for a while. He is also a strong Catholic, so will be pro us staying together. I don't think he's ideal as I don't know him very well but I think he is the one person who my H will be able to open up to properly.

Do you know what you want to do?

(Btw I had an EA on and off for a year and DH has forgiven me even if I haven't)

Not really, Fab, if you'd asked me earlier this week I'd have said that I wanted us to try and fix this but the more that I hear from the people I am talking to both here and in RL the more support I realise there is out there and the prospect of going it alone seems less terrifying. If he gives me anything less than 'it was all a huge mistake and I am 100% committed to sorting this out' then I will be asking him to move out. From there, I will go for counselling alone and try to come to terms with things and if he realises he has made a mistake well, then I suppose I have to decide if I can accept that.

maggie good luck with everything - you sound very sensible and far from a muggins.

maggie....take the muggins off your name, love x

Maggie, having just read through all of this thread, I just wanted to reinforce what other posters have urged you to do: forcing him to make a choice and show that you mean business. WWIFN is absolutely bang on when she talks about the damage it'll do to your self-esteem if you allow him to "let him think he has an option to keep you both on at the same time". When I found out about my DWs affair the few people I confided in all gave me this advice and I ignored it. I had some crazy idea that I wanted her to take her time and decide who she wanted to be with. She has said subsequently that she felt because of this that I wasn't willing to fight for her. She also actually asked me if I wanted her to move out, and now I wish that I had asked her to.

Also, as AF said, don't worry about telling other people about what is going on. I didn't tell any of my friends that lived locally. I didn't tell my mum for two months! It did indeed cut me off from potential support and enabled my DW to keep the OM as an option for several months. When I look back I realise that I did almost everything wrong. I should have been stronger. I realise that this meant that when we finally did go into counselling a lot of it was fire-fighting the negative effects of what happened after I found out about the affair.

Sorry, I feel like I have hijacked this thread. I guess I'm providing support for the advice that you've received here by providing a cautioary tale for what happens when you don't do things this way (my DW and I are separating). I wonder whether my DW and I would be in a different position if I had taken control in the way that AF and WWIFN suggest.

There's some brilliant advice here, Maggie, and you sound as though you're handling this fairly and rationally - much better than I did when my ex was unfaithful. I was pretty much unhinged for a while, which I cringe about, looking back.

I just wanted to add that, if you would like your marriage to survive this, you might want to tell no one in real life - or maybe just one or two friends. I did open up to friends and family about my ex's infidelity - went for the name-and-shame approach - but also told them that I wanted things to work out (it took me some months to scrap that very bad idea!), and I think it lost me some respect for a while, IYSWIM; people couldn't understand why I wanted to make a go of it with someone who'd treated me so disrespectfully.

So if you want to work things out, keep fairly quiet about what your DH is up to. If you don't/if you do end up separating, then it doesn't matter so much.

You're handling a painful situation with admirable dignity. Good luck.

I don't have anything to add but "Oh, honey." I really feel for you-so much to go through with a little one. There's nothing I can say that hasn't already been said better, so just know that we're here for you.

Actually we went for the other appoach of telling people. At first it was for my support - i havent found too many people turning away from us when we said we were making a go of it. In fact the opposite.

It helps because it makes it real - i also feel that he would be letting down a lot of people if he did do it again - iyswim.

Yes he did treat me very badly but also people understand that he is making a huge effort to make it up to me and it is nice when people comment on that too.

I think if it is kept a secret it can lead to a lot more mis-understanding. At least people realise that i still have down days and that certain things will forever bring back certain memories.

I think by not talking it becomes a bit of a taboo, which i also think is unhealthy.

OP YOU have nothing to be ashamed of and if people make you feel that way they are not true friends - if he finds it hard to handle that people know - too bad.

Take care

You probably won't want to hear this but I think the affair or whatever it is is a symptom and not the cause of your problems. Your relationship has been in dire straits for a long time and you haven't recognised this. After your affair you chose not to tell him and chose to have a child. You didn't see that your emotional affair was a sign that your marriage wasn't fulfilling your needs.

I am sure there are some people who are unfaithful even when they have a perfect marriage but I don't think there are many or your husband is one of them. He didn't go looking for infidelity, it came to him on a plate. He was probably feeling unwanted and unloved due to lack of sex and lack of attention and another woman's attention will have restored his ego.

Everyone has the need for a fulfilling relationship with emotional and sexual intimacy and if it isn't there then problems are bound to arise.

I think you should be getting someone to look after your child for however long you can get, a few days, an overnight, a few hours and spending that time talking to him but not about the affair as that is not important but about what is wrong in the marriage and do you both want to try to put it right. If you can't talk rationally (probably very hard to do right now) then you need to get an urgent appointment with a counsellor together and not alone.

I don't think you should make any ultimatums, you both need to talk this through. No-one here knows what is the right answer and neither do either of you at the moment. He needs to come to his own decisions about this woman but only once you have both worked out what to do.

Frankly I think it is bizarre to suggest it is for him to decide by talking it through with his mum, best friend, whatever. The only people that know what is best is the two of you. I wonder if you do actually care that much if you think it is just for him to decide things.

You have a young child and, whatever happens, you will always both be her parents and will need to get on at some level. Now is the time to find out what your relationship really is. Again, I don't think this woman is in the least important, fixing what is wrong in your relationship or finding a way of separating without bitterness could save a huge amount of sadness in the future and I don't think you should be delaying things just waiting.

I'd like to nominate Aussieng's : "when men whimper on about how they do not know what they want, they generally know exactly what they want but do not know how to get it without looking like the bad guy." as Quote of the Week.

Labrawoman, you make some good points, but I think that in order to get to the stage of dealing with the long-term problems that the OP has described, it'll be necessary to deal with the effects of the affair first. The DHs relationship with the OW has to be resolved (by him), before they can work out where to go next. If nothing else it'll force the DH to work out where his priorities lie.

In my case, allowing my DW to sort of keep her options open meant that we were side-tracked for a long time going round and round in circles. I felt all through that time that she really wanted to be with the OM, but that she was with me because of the children.

Sorry, one other thing, just re-reading your original post. Given that what he has told you (and you believe him) amounts to an emotional affair in the workplace just as yours was three years ago, why is there a lack of understanding from you?

Maybe he would have worked it through on his own just as you did? Maybe you can turn it round and think about how you would have felt if he had discovered it and given you ultimatums. You are in the best place to have real insight into what is going on here.

Maybe it is just how he feels, not being able to talk about it and needs to work it out in his own head.