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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

FAB & GLAM 10 - Gosh, Do We Really Talk That Much???

1000 replies

Dumbledior · 26/07/2009 21:51

Hi, new thread

Lovely to see all the old posters again. Don't go now you are back.

Annie/UC/MHIS - lovely to see you and thanks MHIS for the FB chat.

OP posts:
Anniegetyourgun · 23/06/2010 10:20

CAFCASS person does sounds sensible, to be fair. I'm not saying don't get some ideas from them, just that if anything they say sounds wrong to you, go with your instincts.

We just had a nasty scare because the new cat somehow managed to get out of the house early this morning (main suspect a very small upper window which was open a slightly larger crack than it should have been). Cue much searching of neighbourhood, fruitless calling, ringing of cat sanctuary for advice etc. Then the little madam walked in the front door! Ah well, I needed the exercise.

ladylush · 23/06/2010 10:34

Cats eh I searched high and low for ours once. She'd been scared by another cat and had run up a tree but was too scared to come back down so was out all night. When I located the mews I rang the fire brigade I was very apologetic and offered to pay for their time but the tree was so high that there was no way we could have got her down using a standard ladder. Anyway, the cat took one look at the fireman climbing up the ladder and jumped down. I felt so stupid

Anniegetyourgun · 23/06/2010 10:37

Hah! Perishers ain't they! Next time just leave a dish of cat food under the tree

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 10:38

Baffy, LadyLush and MacDoodle, thank you so much. You have brought a tear to my eye

MacDoodle, your post is amazing, thank you so much for sharing that. The course you talk about sounds really good.

The thing is, the CAFCASS lady was lovely, really lovely. I was with her for ages and she validated so much of what I was already thinking but she also made me realise so much more. We spoke about DD and she made me think ahead, to when DD is a teenager, is hormonal and is answering him back, when she is standing up for herself just like I used to do, the CAFCASS lady said that it will be then that he shows his true colours towards DD and it is that that I have to prepare her for. To cut a long waffle of explanation short I suddenly felt a huge responsibility towards DD, this is my chance to ensure that she grows up know what is a healthy relationship and what isn't and I so do not want to get that wrong.

I feel very much the same way as you MacD in that I don't want to highlight him as the bad guy. I somehow have to find a way to let her know that although her dad loves her very much he has these certain 'ways' which are not right and she has to not engage with. The CAFCASS lady was really concerned that DD should have contact with him at all so that has made me even more on my guard. I have to monitor contact and if I feel DD is suffering emotionally as a result of it then I have to write to the court for contact to be reviewed and so, because for a long time I didn't really know my own mind I am so scared of getting this wrong!! BUT, at the same time, I don't want to be overcautious and become precious about DD iyswim. Does that make sense?

I want DD to have the best relationship she can with her father but I also want her to be aware of the person he is so that she does not suffer any more than she has already done.

I think we need a holiday!!!

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 10:39

Sorry for waffling. But it does help. Thank you for reading

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 10:44

Thank you Annie. I read something last night and it said that sometimes counselling can highlight things a bit too much and actually convince a child that there is actually something wrong with them. That's the thing you see, DD is very very happy at the moment and I don't want to do anything to take that away from her. I worry that if I make too big a deal of what happened then it will become a big deal to her and spoil what she now has. But on the other hand I have the CAFCASS ladies words ringing in my ears....

ladylush · 23/06/2010 10:46

TFM - it sounds as though dd has the measure of him already (evidenced by her comment about him being nasty to you when you were being perfectly nice).

ladylush · 23/06/2010 10:51

It's the right type of counselling that is important. I don't know much about children's counsellors but would imagine that they would be aware that it is common for children to blame themselves when their parents have separated/or having relationship difficulties - and that their framework tackles that.

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 10:52

Yes LL she does. He tries to control her now but she stands up to him. He doesn't like it though. He told her last time "you are getting just like your mother, in fact you are just like your mother" all because she didn't want to wear the shoes he was trying to make her wear. I think he is going to end up shooting himself in the foot again, it's just a matter of time.

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 10:55

By the way LL, she always saw/heard me being 'perfectly nice'. I can put my hand on my heart and say I never raised my voice at him, never swore or did anything that would make me as bad as him! Maybe I should have though

ladylush · 23/06/2010 10:57

Then you are a saint TFM I think I'd have killed him.
As for twatman telling your dd she is just like you - let the compliments keep coming

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 11:02

I never thought of it like that!!! x

Anniegetyourgun · 23/06/2010 11:06

Does he love her, though? Does he really? Is he even capable of normal parental love? It doesn't make him a bad guy if he can't, a damaged one perhaps. It's not a reason for her not to love him, although she also needs to be wary.

I did tell my boys that their dad loved them, but then I'm sure he does or I wouldn't have said it. I also said that although I am very angry with him I am not ever going to tell them they shouldn't love him - they're his children, that's a much closer relationship than an ex-spouse, and he brought them up and changed their nappies and important stuff for years. You can't and shouldn't just switch that off. That is not the same as accepting his behaviour, which they have recognised for themselves is peculiar (especially DS2, who tried to live with him for a whole year and is still slightly traumatised). I've also said it's a mistake to assume that he's always wrong just because they know that sometimes he is, and that they should behave respectfully in his house even if they don't agree with him. I expect the same courtesy!

Re counselling for a child, from what you say it sounds like now would not be a good time for it. I'd want to let the little girl settle for a while longer. She's got a long way to go to her teens hasn't she? If you tell her about counselling and explain what it can do for her she may even tell you herself when she feels ready for it, or she will at least be prepared when you feel like it's the right time. Surely CAFCASS lady would respect this? She's warning you about the future; it doesn't all have to be settled right now, much though you'd love to just sponge all the nasty stuff off your precious child like a damp sponge to a blackboard. People aren't that simple and some things take a long time to sort out.

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 11:09

On a lighter note........ I had a man in my house today. He came to sort out my alarm. He was a very nice man. Tall, twinkly eyes, nice smile, you know the kind of man I'm talking of anyway, he stayed a little longer than he needed to, just chatting about his work, but it was nice. It was very nice. And I think I may be rediscovering 'things'. I think I might like men after all

He told me to just give him a call if I have any problems with the alarm. I wonder if I will have any problems with my alarm ......

ladylush · 23/06/2010 11:13

It's the heat making you frisky

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 11:19

Annie, that is exactly what the CAFCASS lady said to me, that she doubts he is even capable of parental love. He does tell her he loves her and he does put his arms around her but that is only when he is saying goodbye to her. He never does that just because he wants to iyswim. I can't help myself, I tell her all the time that I love her, kiss her and hug her. He on the other hand will buy her anything and everything. That little very rarely asks for anything but he will buy her things, things he wants her to have not things she asks for. One Sunday morning when she was five years old and not long started school he decided she needed a computer. So she had to have a computer, right then! Straight after breakfast we trekked to PC World and he bout her a £400 computer! I can count on 2 hands how many times she has used it. That's how he shows his love I think. Or how he buys his love.

He doesn't interact with her on her level. He expects her to join him on his jaunts iyswim. He doesn't just 'have fun' with her, play with her, read to her, nothing like that. And nappies! God, he never did nappies!! I feel he sees her more as a possession.

Re the counselling. I think you are right.

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 11:20

LL but he was rather hot himself! And there was me, thinking I was scared of men!

Anniegetyourgun · 23/06/2010 11:21

The heat has the opposite effect on me - I wilt I remember one day coming home from work after a horrible commute on a stuffy train, my tights had split so my thighs were sore, I felt tired, smelly and washed out. Then-H picked me up from the station with a carful of offspring and said (apparently in all seriousness) I had clearly been having an affair, as I was all sweaty and unusually quiet. Talk of "the last thing on my mind"... I couldn't even summon up the energy to tell him exactly what I thought of such crassness. Think I just croaked something like "You stupid man".

Happy for you though TFM. XP may have temporarily stolen your peace of mind but he couldn't steal your 'ormones! Want to borrow my screwdriver set...?

ladylush · 23/06/2010 11:24

Nowt wrong with your hormone alarm

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 11:25

I'm sorry Annie, I shouldn't laugh but you do tell it so well. You make me laugh!

TimeForMe · 23/06/2010 11:28

I just need a Twatman alarm! I think all men that have proved themselves to be Twatmen should have to have a tattoo on the forehead as a warning to unsuspecting ladies!

I may start a campaign!!

ladylush · 23/06/2010 11:34

You could be very rich if you develop such a device Right, I'm off. Got to load the dishwasher, hang out the washing, make dd's lunch (and eat mine),paint my nails, go shopping and return in time for the England game

ladylush · 23/06/2010 11:36

That's toe nails - can't be arsed with finger nails.

Anniegetyourgun · 23/06/2010 12:00

On the plus side, XH did a lot of hands-on stuff for his wee babes because I had a full-time job and commute, and the price of nurseries was horrendous (no childcare subsidies when the first three were small). He would take me to the station and pick me up every day for years, make me tea in the morning and eventually learned to be in charge of doctor/dentist appointments and go to school open days. He too, though, was more of a one for buying stuff for the boys whether they wanted it or not than for the stories/hugging, and as he wasn't earning for most of our time together, I ended up paying for it. Good fun.

Tanee58 · 23/06/2010 16:10

lol at everyone calling TFM's ex Twatman. I am proud of myself (preens grinning)!

Cats - oh yes, our longhaired one got shut out all night not many months after we moved in here. (I have my suspicions that DP had something to do with it, as, at that time, he was treating the cats the way he treats DD now - locking them out any opportunity) Anyhoo, I had flu, but staggered up and down the road, calling her and crying. Not a sign, so I staggered back and then heard a tiny mew by the front door. I suspect she'd hidden in the shrubs in the front garden, all night! But oh, the anxiety, picturing her tiny squashed body on the North Circular!

Lush, your nasturtiums. Blackfly. They LOVE nasturtiums. I don't grow them anymore. Tho if you grow veg, the nasturtiums make a good companion plant as the blackfly will live on them and leave your veggies alone. You can try washing them off with soapy water, or blitz them with chemicals! TFM's the best gardener here though, any advice?

TFM, so glad to hear DD's opening up. I always think, if they're able to ask questions, they deserve fair answers. I'm with what the others have said. You can explain that Twatman was absolutely wrong in his behaviour, but he is still her father and - in his own way - loves her. Trouble is, 'his own way' is horribly destructive and I strongly suspect she'll think of him as a toxic parent as she gets older. His 'love' is all about control - he doesn't really see you or DD as individuals - merely as possessions and extensions of himself. Wow, he's Soames Forsyte!

No GP appointment today. They had only just got their schedule set up, and have some weird appointment system. They can't give me an appointment for the day I want until tomorrow. Well, I'll be on the phone first thing! It has to be a Wednesday (DP's day off) otherwise I know DP will say he can't go, as he'll have to take time off and lose pay. I'm not letting him have the chance to make ANY excuses.

Had an horrendous morning, getting DD and a friend off to their first Glasto (may be their last!) They were due to go by coach, friend's mother paid for it, so I offered to drive them to the pickup point near us at 7am. Only there were no clear instructions as to where the point was, except J2 bus stop, Brent Cross. Any of you know Brent Cross? It's a nightmare of roads and flyovers. We drove round and round, couldn't find the side road where the stop was (having googled it and thought we'd located it) finally spotted it on the other side of the N Circ, but by this time the coach must have gone. Contemplated driving them all the way to Somerset, saw sense, booked them a train, went to the underground station, down escalator not working, they then got cold feet about trekking down the stairs and on to Paddington with all the kit they had to carry, ummmd and ahhed about getting friend's brother to drive them down. Friend's mother stopped that (good, as she and I had already paid out over £150 between us just for transport), and I MADE them go to Paddington, even went with them to help carry their tent and make bloody sure they got on the train!!!! Got the tickets, the seat reservations were in different carriages! I said well, they could always ask whoever was sitting next to them to swap. Confusing announcements about where to find the train, staff telling us one thing, tannoy and display boards another, all aimed, I suspect, at preventing a mass rush of hippies when the train pulled in, so I stayed with them until the train came up and saw them through the barrier. Got to work three hours late, and am now here alone as all the office have pushed off to watch the match!

Well, alone, apart from a half of lager. Because I'm worth it. ...

Oh, what we mothers do, eh? I just hope she enjoys Glasto. She can be very 'glass half empty,' my lovely DD, and I think if I hadn't shoved them on the train myself, they would have said sod it, and gone home!

And I would have half killed her for the massive waste of money!

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